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G56 oil comparison.

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Good article RV, thanks. This fits with what Eaton/Fuller, Clark, Spicer and Mack have always recommended. In the old days it was just 50 wt engine oil but now with synthetics thats what they spec. In the old days of low power, 50 wt engine oil was suficiant at about 500 psi shear strength. With the huge power of late model vehicles, the 50 wt synthetic, rated about 3000 psi is the oil of choice.



I have always used 15/40 engine oil in all my pickups because I keep it on the shelf but after reading the article I might have to switch to a good 50 wt synthetic. The big trucks also say to not mix oil or use a multi weight oil, that the straight weight is better.



Nick
 
Wow what an eye opener. Thank the author for his time and efforts. My only question is how is the shifting at cold temps with the 50 wt synthetic? The Syncromesh is a bit stiff when it's 20 degrees out. After reading that I'm running out to the truck parts and switching over. I had always wondered if the growl that my 05 had in 5th gear was something failing, this article answered that question. thanks again.
 
we found that out in our test but the sae 50 is to thick in cold weather. we blend a 50-50-mix of the sae50 and 5w-30 and use 7 quarts.
here is what we use. Delo Synthetic Transmission Fluid SAE 50 delivers exceptional all-climate, year-round performance in heavy duty truck transmissions. A unique additive package can protect gears without using the “active sulfur” agents commonly found in automotive axle oils. This results in little to no corrosion and long life for copper-containing parts, such as oil coolers, bushings, and thrust washers. Good pumpability in extreme hot or cold temperatures promotes smooth shifting and efficient power transfer. It is specifically formulated to meet the latest extended drain requirements for Eaton transmissions, with drain intervals of up to 500,000 miles.
Synchromax is recommended for manual transmissions
that specify an automatic transmission fluid or motor oil.
It is also ideal for transfer cases and 2-cycle motorcycle
gear boxes.
Synchromax is formulated with Royal Purple's synthetic,
proprietary Synerlec additive technology, offering
improved shift quality over a wide temperature range and
reduced gear noise.
Synchromax is fully compatible with all types of friction
materials and offers excellent corrosion and oxidation
protection without affecting the soft metals commonly
found in manual transmission synchronizers.
Performance Advantages
• Greater wear protection
• Smoother shifts
• Excellent rust / corrosion protection
• Reduces friction for more power
• Lowers operating temperatures
 
Thanks for the posting... I pulled the ATF+4 out of my G56 early on but replaced it with Amsoil Synchromesh. Guess I will be switching next time to Mobil 50 Synthetic trans fluid.
On another note, The 6 quarts of ATF+4 that I pulled out of my trand got filtered and dumped into the fuel tank of my old 240D Mercedes diesel. Ran real well!!
 
After reading the reports I decided to try the Mobil Delvac. I installed 7qts thru the top on Sunday with air temps at 47F. As soon as I backed out of the driveway I knew I was not going to be happy with the shifting. Going into 2nd to start was a little stiff but then the 2-3 shift was very difficult. Double clutching did not help, and then the 3-4 shift was nearly im***sible and 4th was always good in the past. Later I took it for a longer ride of about 10 miles, after say 5 miles it started shifting normal. Let sit overnight and tried again today around 47-50F and it was once again horrible.



In the past I have used Amsoil ATF and then Pennzoil Syncro. Those two were the best of the lot, and I will probably be ordering the Pennzoil today. The truck won't be used again until the fluid is replaced, it's that bad.



I don't see how this weight oil could be spec'd be Mercedes and no way you could use it in the winter.



It's odd, some guys say the trans is great shifting others like me think it is clunky or sometimes hard shifting. It almost seems that there is a wide variety of trans assembly tolerances, some like mine are set too darn tight and you get this clunk/grind into the gears, while others assembled looser have smooth shifting.



Going back to the Mercedes Mobil 50 vs the Dodge ATM fluid, is there a chance the Dodge US spec'd transmissions are somehow different then the Mercedes Europe only ones ? How about same transmissions but different assembly plants ?





Oh yeah, truck has 75k and original clutch. No towing.
 
After reading the reports I decided to try the Mobil Delvac. ... .....
I don't see how this weight oil could be spec'd be Mercedes and no way you could use it in the winter.

Mobil Delvac is NOT SPECIFIED by MB. Mobiltrans SHC DC is. Delvac is different per the engineers I spoke with at ExxonMobil.
 
Mobil Delvac is NOT SPECIFIED by MB. Mobiltrans SHC DC is. Delvac is different per the engineers I spoke with at ExxonMobil.

Well,according to Blackstone it's nearly identical. I thinned mine out per CKelley's suggestion with 5-30 Amsoil synchromesh. After a couple of blocks it shifts pretty well here in our climate. Excellent after warming up a bit. Now this winter maybe another matter. I believe all this speculation came about after owner's couldn't stand the racket these transmission's make after the smf conversion using ATF. Mine never shifted better than with Amsoil ATF and the stock clutch. I drained it at 21K one time and the magnet had a dab of fuzz on it and the fluid was pink as new.
I too don't see how Mercedes can specify any fluid this thick for worldwide cold climates.
 
On Mobil's site they say that the Mobiltrans SHC DC is discontinued has been replaced with the Mobil Delvac 50 wt. CKelly 1 who makes the Synchromax fluid? That sounds like it would be a better match as the synthetic 50 wt is really had shifting when cold... .
 
Mobil Delvac is NOT SPECIFIED by MB. Mobiltrans SHC DC is. Delvac is different per the engineers I spoke with at ExxonMobil.



Correct, but the Delvac was the nearest identical to the SHC DC and as posted above "On Mobil's site they say that the Mobiltrans SHC DC is discontinued has been replaced with the Mobil Delvac 50 ".

Once I got it hot it was fine, but that's not acceptable, no way I could leave my driveway when it's 20F out. Probably work fine in the southern US, but that's about it.
 
Well,according to Blackstone it's nearly identical. I thinned mine out per CKelley's suggestion with 5-30 Amsoil synchromesh. After a couple of blocks it shifts pretty well here in our climate. Excellent after warming up a bit. Now this winter maybe another matter. I believe all this speculation came about after owner's couldn't stand the racket these transmission's make after the smf conversion using ATF. Mine never shifted better than with Amsoil ATF and the stock clutch. I drained it at 21K one time and the magnet had a dab of fuzz on it and the fluid was pink as new.
I too don't see how Mercedes can specify any fluid this thick for worldwide cold climates.

On Mobil's site they say that the Mobiltrans SHC DC is discontinued has been replaced with the Mobil Delvac 50 wt. CKelly 1 who makes the Synchromax fluid? That sounds like it would be a better match as the synthetic 50 wt is really had shifting when cold... .

Correct, but the Delvac was the nearest identical to the SHC DC and as posted above "On Mobil's site they say that the Mobiltrans SHC DC is discontinued has been replaced with the Mobil Delvac 50 ".
Once I got it hot it was fine, but that's not acceptable, no way I could leave my driveway when it's 20F out. Probably work fine in the southern US, but that's about it.

Let me try to answer these points as were posted above (bearing in mind I am not a tribologist):

Let's start with what we know to be fact.

1. The G56 Transmission has only two specified fluids in the US.
A). The first specified fluid for the G56 in the Dodge Ram and Ram trucks is specified by Chrysler/Dodge/Ram. This fluid is ATF+4. Dodge specifies only 5 quarts of ATF+4 in the transmission, not 6 quarts as many say. Chrysler/Dodge/Ram also is the warranty provider for this transmission. Using any other transmission fluid or more than is specified is not recommended.

B). The second specified fluid per Mercedes Benz (MB) Specification is MobilTrans SHC DC. It is available product - we sell it. Mercedes Benz does not warranty your transmission - Chrysler/Dodge/Ram does. The MobilTrans SHC DC meets MB Spec http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/235.13_en.html. The specification is cited on the products labeling (on the MobilTrans SHC DC label) and is the only product currently sold in the US that carries this rating.

2. Delvac 50 is not a substitute for the MobilTrans SHC DC as per my conversations with ExxonMobil engineering technical support. It does not meet the MB specification, nor does it say anywhere on the product packaging that it does, nor does ExxonMobil say or imply that it meets MB specification per my conversations with their engineering technical support.

3. The Blackstone tests that were done are an excellent starting point for making your own decision if you decide to stray from the two recommended fluids. The tests, however, are not comprehensive nor complete. The cost associated with a four ball, bouncing ball, pin on disc, etc. type of test is expensive. The Blackstone tests do not measure for the others chemicals / properties of these tests and serve as a starting point only. It's adds a scientific starting point with which to begin comparisons, but is not definitive in the least.

4. On page 16 of the report by Flopster843, he concludes by saying, "But this is your truck and your bill if it breaks. Use the information here and draw your own conclusion. As for me, the only fluid going in my transmission from this point forward is MobilTrans SHC DC. "

That sums up all we can say that we truly know is fact based on published information. Please let me know if I've missed anything.

==================================================================================================

In addressing the other issues as relating to what's above I can relate to you what I do have direct experience with. I do use MobilTrans SHC DC and I have operated my vehicle in temperatures down to 15 degrees Fahrenheit. The answer to the shifting while cold for me is to warm up the transmission while I let the engine warm up.

I would like to take credit for this idea, but IIRC, AH64ID first posted this a long time ago. I make sure my parking brake is set and will hold. I start the engine, put the transfer case in neutral, and shift into sixth gear. I slowly release the clutch and the transmission will be running at the speed my engine is idling. I warm up my truck typically five or so minutes when it's under 45 degrees Fahrenheit. When I pull away my trans shifts normally. I do shift at around 1850 to 2000 RPMs though. I have found that if I shift at a lower rpm, it does shift a little slower.

In regard to custom blended transmission fluids, it's all an individual choice. If you have questions I didn't answer here, please post here or PM me and I'll try to help as best I can.

As a sidenote - An excellent resource as a starting point is "Bob is the Oil Guy". Here's a link to "Basic Lubrication Design" and I highly recommend "Motor Oil University" that is on that site as well. It helps explain a lot of information, and helps you make a better informed decision. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/basic-lubrication-design/
 
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Correct, but the Delvac was the nearest identical to the SHC DC and as posted above "On Mobil's site they say that the Mobiltrans SHC DC is discontinued has been replaced with the Mobil Delvac 50 ".



Once I got it hot it was fine, but that's not acceptable, no way I could leave my driveway when it's 20F out. Probably work fine in the southern US, but that's about it.





I wonder if overfilling is part of the problem?



Nick
 
Remind me again, what oil change interval does Dodge call for on the g56 trans? 30,000 mile oil changes? I think mine is due for a change, I'll have to look at my spread sheet.

I noticed a marked improvement from the ATF+4 to the Penzoil Syncromesh. Seeing as I'm in a warmer climate I'm may go with the thicker stuff recommended by Mercedes Benz and this article. If I wanted to bring the viscosity down and add magnesium as a detergent to the mix, would it be prudent to run a 25% mix of Syncromesh with MobilTrans oil?
 
Sean,
I'm running CKelley's cocktail of 1 gal Delvac 50 and three qts Amsoil 5-30 Synchromesh. Even in our mild climate,the trans is a bit stiff for several surface road blocks.
If I still had the dmf,I'd just be running the Pennsoil. The transmission noise just drove me nuts with the thinner viscosity fluids. I've never seen anything more than fine particles on the magnet with any fluid I've used.
Straight 50 wt in the winter wouldn't work for me. Warming up the trans for five minutes is not an option.
 
I didn't change mine soon enough :(

I thought changing the transmission fluid with Amsoil ATF every 40,000 miles would net me long life. At 103k, I've lost 4th and 6th gear. I've ordered Gorilla for the next go around. I'll report back in another 103k and give my opinion :)

--Eric
 
I've ordered Gorilla for the next go around. I'll report back in another 103k and give my opinion :)

--Eric

Eric, not trying to dissuade you, but have read a few threads where people have complained about the GJ, NOT just for its harder shifting when cold properties, but ALSO for metal in the fluid on first change of GJ. Check out what TDR member CKelley does with his fleet of G56 trucks for perhaps a better proven solution for running and towing with the G56.
 
He offers a GJ Lite now. Mine would barely shift with his original molasses viscosity version. I'm using CKelley's cocktail. A little stiff in the morning but fine the rest of the day.
To be honest,my magnet's never had anything more than a fine fuzz on any fluid I've used. Just can't use ATF with the smf conversion. Too noisy.
 
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