generator

[Tilesetter Too]

OK, Hurricanes SUcK. I've got a generator but it comes nowhere close to powering the whole house at once, not even parts at once. Forget running the fridge and water heater at the same time or the well pump. And the house AC, fuhgettaboutit.

We may be down powerwise for a week or two. This is Florida, we NEED AC!.

Anyhow, more to the point. I seem to remember someone had something in their signature about building a generator from an old VW diesel or some such Motor.

Anybody got tips on how to do this, Links, pics, etc? I will be googling for info but if anybody has practical knowledge it would help.



Thanks for the help and be sure to cast evil thoughts at IVAN churning his way to florida next. Maybe enough ill-will will push him back out to sea.

Shawn

 

[Ncostello]

Sorry about all the bad luck down there. I've been thinking of you all.



As far as gens go... 3 months ago we had a bad storm that knocked out power for three days. I went to work and towed on of those portable diesel 3cyl light plants home (the ones with the telescopic 4 halide lamps). Even that thing was barely enough to power my deep freezer and fridge. I had like 30 amps of 115V power from it. I did kick on the lights too outside and aimed them at the house. It was like sunshine in the windows so the house was lit up well. Here I was driving around a completely dark town... and you could see my house a mile away like a baseball stadium right in the middle. It was weird. Neighbors were super jealous .



It all boils down to having a gen set that will crank out enough amps. If your house normally runs 100A service then you would need that to have things normal. Plus you'd need the correct wiring disconnects to hook up such a gen to the house. You never wanna back feed power to the pole as you could shock a power line worker somewhere trying to restore power.



I guess the VW motor would work fine or any other engine as long as you had the gen set to spin up. Thats where it can get expensive with large gen sets. We had Cat diesel semi trailer units at work that are something like 500 KW... but I couldn't hook them up to the house!! We were going to ship them down to Florida to power up some critical businesses but got called off because the storm didn't knock them out. (and thank goodness it wasn't as bad as earlier predicted).

 

[Tilesetter Too]

I backfeed through the dryer 220 power supply. The main is always off to make sure I'm not backfeeding the powerpole. The genny has 220 capability. It is a 7000watt model with 12,500 watt surge for starting motors. I am having a hard time running the fridge and any other power hungry device at the same time. I can't imagine the fridge and water heater pull more than 7000 watts but I can't seem to get them both to run at once.



It may be that the fuse panel seems to run off seperate legs of the dryer line. If I don't have power to half the house, I know I've got a loose connection somewhere. Maybe a manual disconnect could supply the power adequetly? Possibly the fridge and water heater are trying to run off the same 115 leg from the dryer?



Anyhow, I'm looking for something in the 15-20KW range for the next disaster.



Shawn

 

[EricBu12]

A good thing to do is to run 2 Cords into the house. Have one go to the plug in where the waterheater is and one to the fridge. I would just try to use the 2 or 3 circuits you have on the generator to run the important stuff. The fridge runs all the time and the WH is sporatic on the thermostat. After that, you can branch off the fridge to a couple of flourecent lights... the Gen you says has 220 cap. ? then run that directly to the dryer, not the wall where it is in, the cord itself. In otherwords, use ONLY the circuits on the gen and split it up.



I have a 4000 gen in my trailer and it is able to run the A/C and an 1100 watt Microwave. So a 7000 watt will run a fridge and some lights at least. I think the problem is using the house plug ins. Just run cords directly to the units and try that. Start with the highest load draw first, do one at a time, and see what you can run without tripping... Also as stated above, if you have them, use Flourecent lights instead of incadesant. Uses less power... .

 

[KBennett]

It may be that the fuse panel seems to run off seperate legs of the dryer line. If I don't have power to half the house, I know I've got a loose connection somewhere. Maybe a manual disconnect could supply the power adequetly? Possibly the fridge and water heater are trying to run off the same 115 leg from the dryer?

Shawn

The power coming into your house is 240 volts with a neutral. The neutral allows you to "split" the 240V into two 120V lines.



An electric water heater will draw quite a bit depending on the size and is usually powered by 240V. If it has a double pole breaker it is 240V.



Are you turning the breakers off to the other items in your house?

 

[rbattelle]

Why doesn't someone make a replacement alternator with a 240v AC generator strapped to the back of it so we could use the truck as a generator?

 

[KBennett]

Why doesn't someone make a replacement alternator with a 240v AC generator strapped to the back of it so we could use the truck as a generator?

I don't think it will fit.



I have been loking at these from Harbor Freight.

Generator Link

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If I could get a PTO for the truck and spin it at 3600 RPM I would be off to the races. If the truck engine was run at 1000 RPM and the ratio of the gearbox was correct then you would have a 7. 2/10 KW Generator.

It only uses 20HP!

 

[rbattelle]

I find it hard to believe that the technology to make a compact 20 or 30 kW generator small enough to fit on (or around) an alternator isn't out there. Then again, I suppose you can have anything you want for the right money.



Also, I assume an oscillator circuit could be constructed to provide 60 Hz independent of AC generator RPM. Certainly it can be done with a DC generator and an inverter.

 

[KBennett]

Also, I assume an oscillator circuit could be constructed to provide 60 Hz independent of AC generator RPM. Certainly it can be done with a DC generator and an inverter.

It has been done. Check out the new Honda generators.

Very $$$

 

[Tilesetter Too]

Ignore previous post, I've been having posting problems. It usually won't let my first post through and then erases it so I did a test post AND OF COURSE it went through!



Anyhow,



Kbennett, Yes all other breakers are off and WH still doesn't want to run. Yes it is 240, double breaker.



EricBu12, The genny will run whole house at once except WH, AC, and dryer because I'm back feeding through the dryer. I think it is the wiring letting too much power drop to the appliances.



I'm looking for a genny head in the 12. 5 - 15kw range. I've got a 17. 5hp Yanmar 2cyl diesel tractor with a bad driveline but good motor sitting in the yard. Anybody want to hazard a guess of what the equivalant gas motor horsepower would be. Would 23-24hp gas be about the same. I've seen that most genny heads advertise on gas horsepower, but I guess I would need torque peaks for the yanmar to help with the rating.



How about a source for a good used genny head? I'd even take new if the price was right.



I'll be starting a new thread on the Yanmar for info on it.



Thanks, Shawn

 

[EricBu12]

Here is an Automatic standby generator that hooks to the breakers on your house and turns on and off when the power comes and goes... . Some of the other sites I see this on prices start at around $2000



http://acadianapower.com/15kw_automatic_standby_guardian_generator_1.html



Here is a Diesel Version of a system called Kaytolite. It is a PDF. File (acrobat Reader)



http://www.emergencysystems-inc.com/genspec/prepak/15-60diesel.pdf



Heres a site that has the perm. Mount and there is one portable at 12. 5 and 15K for $2100 and $2400... ... Right above it, there is the Automatic Generac system for 2100 to 3200 dollars



http://www.powerpony.com/



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[QRTRHRS]

I used to work with a guy that set up a backup system that was VW diesel powered. It was not homebuilt though, rather, it was a commercially available unit. He set it up in a shed instead of the garage. He stuck a 275 gallon oil tank in the shed for his diesel. Since our work went overseas, I don't see this guy anymore to get info. I know it was not cheap. Wholehouse power never is, especially if it's an automatic transfer.

 

[BoostIsGood]

Get a gas water heater

 

[MLeppen]

"Possibly the fridge and water heater are trying to run off the same 115 leg from the dryer?"



Yes that is true, the fridge is using 115 volts to ground and the heater uses 115 x 2 to ground while only sharing one of the 115 inputs with the fridge. clear as mud?

Also, are you using the 220 capable volts or just 115? 7000 K/W is roughly 50 amps with surge rated @12,000 k/w or 80 amps. that should run all of your house.

Most homes only use less than 50 amps at any given time unless you run electric heat /dryer(current pigs) something doesn't seem right. hope this helps.

 

[KBennett]

"Possibly the fridge and water heater are trying to run off the same 115 leg from the dryer?"



Yes that is true, the fridge is using 115 volts to ground and the heater uses 115 x 2 to ground while only sharing one of the 115 inputs with the fridge. clear as mud?

Also, are you using the 220 capable volts or just 115? 7000 K/W is roughly 50 amps with surge rated @12,000 k/w or 80 amps. that should run all of your house.

Most homes only use less than 50 amps at any given time unless you run electric heat /dryer(current pigs) something doesn't seem right. hope this helps.

You may have struck on something there... . an unbalanced line.

Maybe you are drawing too much from the one leg of the 240. Both legs should have a fairly equal load.

 

[Tilesetter Too]

This was my thinking too. I figure I'm pulling from only one leg or something. 7kw is certainly enough to run everthing but central AC. I'm thinking of getting a manual transfer switch for the generator and seeing if that will solve any of the problem. I can tell when I'm not hooked correctly into the dryer plug because one half of the house will not work. If I reconnect and get the wires seated properly then everything works but WH which is why I think I'm unbalanced (or the generator is anyway!).



Shawn

 

[MLeppen]

7000 watts is more than enough to run central air. My friend has a 6500 honda generator and runs central air, all the lights, 2 tv's ,home stereo,fridge ,cieling fans ,garage lights and when you turn on microwave, pop goes the breaker. Full load is never any good for genset but that's what it can do short term. He also backfeeds, through welder recepticle in garage.

 

[DOverton]

For the ones looking into a generator that mounts under the hood check out the AuraGenerators. I believe they will produce 8000 watts at idle or WOT!

I will look up the web address if any body is interested.



Dallas...

 

[KBennett]

For the ones looking into a generator that mounts under the hood check out the AuraGenerators. I believe they will produce 8000 watts at idle or WOT!

I will look up the web address if any body is interested.



Dallas...

Looks pretty cool... Aura FAQ link

 

[Tilesetter Too]

Now thats a sweet set up. I'll take two. Think I can get 'em for $1000 total???? HA HA

Shawn