Gulf Coast Bypass Filter guts...

[steved]

I thought maybe you could stack 2 rolls in there, too. No dice, huh?



Still, thanks for the pictures and write up. I'll bet seeing that oil clear up was cool.

I guess I'm not seeing the right roll of towels... most of the center pulls I have seen were typically large in diameter? I know there are options... stacking two rolls (or maybe three) is definitely an option... I have also looked into the brown, very dense "industrial" type rolls of paper towel, and found some that, while a little short, would physically fit the GCF housing.



steved

 

[ThrottleJockey]

I guess I'm not seeing the right roll of towels... most of the center pulls I have seen were typically large in diameter? I know there are options... stacking two rolls (or maybe three) is definitely an option... I have also looked into the brown, very dense "industrial" type rolls of paper towel, and found some that, while a little short, would physically fit the GCF housing.



steved

I would unwind some of it, but that's probably not a good idea, huh? I still want one like you have. Let us know how you like the brown roll of towels, those things are heavy.

 

[steved]

Here is the UOA with the GCF...



Note the decreased iron and the "elevated" insolubles. I attribute the drop in iron to running warmer weather (the first UOA was from a winter run). I attribute the insolubles to the loose fitting GCF element I started with... hopefully this drops with the use of tight fitting paper towels.



And this is a UOA of CJ-4 Rotella...



steved

 

[PRout]

Looks good Steve. I'm really liking that low silicone level as well. Just curious as to what air filter are you using also? Thanks

By the way, I wasnt totally happy with my last results when I pulled one of the two frantz filters out series. Just added a 1/16th restrictor orifice to slow things down a bit. Hopefully that'll get my OA's back close to where yours is. .

Nice filter set up.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Steve, you're beginning to strengthen my faith in the CJ lubes - at least the Shell version! :-laf



Those wear metals, and the TBN look VERY good. I hope you don't mind, but I couldn't read the analysis sheet you posted, so am re-posting it here for others who might also have problems:



#ad

 

[steved]

Looks good Steve. I'm really liking that low silicone level as well. Just curious as to what air filter are you using also? Thanks



By the way, I wasnt totally happy with my last results when I pulled one of the two frantz filters out series. Just added a 1/16th restrictor orifice to slow things down a bit. Hopefully that'll get my OA's back close to where yours is. .

I'm using the Baldwin 4162?? Its the drop-in Baldwin air filter...



I used a wire drill... #57?? I believe my homemade orifice is around 0. 0502"... where a 1/16" is around 0. 0625". I knew that 5/64" (the GCF orifice size) would be too large...



With that orifice, I'm getting less than 1 quart per minute hot idle...



So far I'm happy... I really want to see if the levels change now that I got the tighter filter element in there...





steved

 

[PRout]

Thanks for the info Steve. .

I like your idea of using the "even smaller" orifice size. When I ran a flow test w/ the 1/16" hole, it still seemed a bit fast. Really dont like losing that much oil from the main flow to the head first, and theres no reason to jam that much oil through the filter anyways. .

Think I might do like we used to do to carb jets in the motorcycles, we used to solder the hole in the jet closed, then re-drill with the size we wanted. That way we didnt need to buy new jets everytime we wanted a different mix. . Maybe I'll try a #57 drill as well. .

 

[PRout]

Steve, you're beginning to strengthen my faith in the CJ lubes - at least the Shell version! :-laf

Quickie question/comment (kind of off topic but want to keep the main topic going). .

Lately I have noticed on the first startups in the morning, more top-end noise for maybe 2-3 seconds, then it quiets down. Makes me think of how some parts are getting the dreaded "startup wear".

Just wondering if this could be related to the new formulation of oils, or possibly the bypass filter allowing some top end oil to drain back into the pan (since thats where my return line goes). Any thoughts on this?

Pondering the thought of using some sort of one way "check-valve" (if its not oil type related - which I dont think it is), but need to use it in a way that doesn't block the normal needed flow. . Guess it would probably have to go on the intake side of the filter. .

Just adding another can of worms to the bypass filter mix thats all. .

 

[steved]

Thanks for the info Steve. .



Think I might do like we used to do to carb jets in the motorcycles, we used to solder the hole in the jet closed, then re-drill with the size we wanted. That way we didnt need to buy new jets everytime we wanted a different mix. . Maybe I'll try a #57 drill as well. .

That's how I "adjusted" the orifice on the Amsoil head when I had it... brazed it shut and redrilled it.



I actually thought about using actual carb jet for an "adjustable" orifice, but I didn't know what thread size they used... and finding the orifice size in inches was challenging.



steved

 

[steved]

Quickie question/comment (kind of off topic but want to keep the main topic going). .



Lately I have noticed on the first startups in the morning, more top-end noise for maybe 2-3 seconds, then it quiets down. Makes me think of how some parts are getting the dreaded "startup wear".



Just wondering if this could be related to the new formulation of oils, or possibly the bypass filter allowing some top end oil to drain back into the pan (since thats where my return line goes). Any thoughts on this?



Pondering the thought of using some sort of one way "check-valve" (if its not oil type related - which I dont think it is), but need to use it in a way that doesn't block the normal needed flow. . Guess it would probably have to go on the intake side of the filter. .



Just adding another can of worms to the bypass filter mix thats all. .

Couple thoughts. . the new oil actually has been improved for cold weather flow... I get pressure almost instantly at temps above 50*F. The filter being upside down creates a "trap" that should prevent too much oil from draining back. However, I still get the noise as you describe, I always have since new.



If you decide to use a check valve, there are two thoughts I have... either place a low cracking pressure check valve in the bypass filter line (this will prevent draining of the bypass back into the crankcase, yet still allow flow to the bypass under all conditions); or you could get a check valve with say a 30psi cracking pressure... this way you would be assured there was no lack of oil at idle (since idle is below the 30psi cracking pressure) and no draining of the bypass filter. The bypass would work as it should when you were at pressures above 30psi (like driving).



steved

 

[steved]

or possibly the bypass filter allowing some top end oil to drain back into the pan (since thats where my return line goes). Any thoughts on this?

Upon re-reading this, got me thinking that it should not "drain" out unless you have an air leak some where?? Or is the outlet/return above the oil level??



steved

 

[PRout]

I believe the return is slightly above the oil level in the pan.

Also, I'm relieved to know that you have noticed the slightly increased start up noise since new. Guess I'm just listening for it more now that the oil formulations have changed.

Your 30psi pressure valve really sounds like the way to go. I've actually seen the Isspro oil pressure gauge read down as far as 22 psi at idle in Las Vegas on a hot day after towing heavy. That would definitely be a good time to cut flow to the bypass. . May have to look into that. . Good thinking!

 

[05mxdiesel]

Looking good Steve, how long you going to run the oil? I wonder what the starting tbn is, gotta be pretty close to 8. 8. Your fe has dropped off significantly, must be broke in now, and comaprable to gary's low fe wearing motor. The virgin cj-4 rotella must not have any silicon in it, like the old ci-4 with 4-6 ppm in it.

 

[steved]

Looking good Steve, how long you going to run the oil? I wonder what the starting tbn is, gotta be pretty close to 8. 8. Your fe has dropped off significantly, must be broke in now, and comaprable to gary's low fe wearing motor. The virgin cj-4 rotella must not have any silicon in it, like the old ci-4 with 4-6 ppm in it.

If I can do it, I am not going to change oil... just the GCF and add the 1. 5 gallons of makeup oil every 10k... might stretch to 20k, but I'm not sure. I will continue to do UOAs until I see I can successfully accomplish this...



I will make this point, this UOA is a run of CJ-4 without any added oil. I ran it this long, then dropped the filter and added makeup oil, I currently have 5500 miles on THAT run (the new filter with 3 original gallons of oil and 1. 5 gallons of makeup oil)... someone on another board indicated the only reason the cj-4 looked this good was because I had added makeup oil, which is not the case here.



I'm considering switching to Rotella 5w40 since I got the bypass working now... I don't tow heavy (truck is more a grocery getter than anything), but you really can't argue with a UOA that looks like this (if it ain't broke, don't fix it).



steved

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

You know Steve, I'd bet that if you end up using the most dense filter media you can find, that density will absorb lots less oil than the "stock" stuff as GC provides - so oil loss MIGHT not be as high as you think!

 

[steved]

You know Steve, I'd bet that if you end up using the most dense filter media you can find, that density will absorb lots less oil than the "stock" stuff as GC provides - so oil loss MIGHT not be as high as you think!

Finding a source for the denser media is something that I haven't done yet... mainly, I don't have the free time... kinda busy.



Another thought is that just because it appears denser might actually mean the pores are smaller and therefore, the denser material might actually hold MORE oil in the pores.



In any case, I don't think 1. 5 gallons of oil every 10k is that bad.



steved

 

[05mxdiesel]

In any case, I don't think 1. 5 gallons of oil every 10k is that bad.



steved

Thats not bad at all considering the results of your uoa and the fact that it is on cj-4 dino rotella. Do you prime your gcf or do you just add the 1. 5 gallons of oil to the motor and let it fill the cannister?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

In any case, I don't think 1. 5 gallons of oil every 10k is that bad.

Actually, in view of the reported lower additive content of the CJ lubes, adding in that amount of fresh lube (and additive!) is probably a GOOD thing!

 

[steved]

Thats not bad at all considering the results of your uoa and the fact that it is on cj-4 dino rotella. Do you prime your gcf or do you just add the 1. 5 gallons of oil to the motor and let it fill the cannister?

The way my GCF is oriented, it has to go together dry. Since it pumps less than a quart per minute, it fills extremely slow. So I simply keep adding oil as it fills the container.



Another thing we got to consider about this setup is the fact that while the majority of owners have the original 3 gallon sump, I have 4. 5 gallons... nearly 50% more. I feel this does two things... the oil takes longer to lose its additives because it has more to lose and the oil has a chance to cool off some running out to the large steel housing. So comparing my UOA (with the GCF) might not be representative of another UOA on a 3 gallon sump of similar mileage.



But as Gary noted, adding 1. 5 gallons of oil every 10k miles should allow me to theoretically never change the oil since I'm changing 1/3 of the oil every time.



And again, my setup is kinda unfair for comparing UOAs since the total system volume is increased.



steved

 

[PRout]

Nothing wrong with that at all.

Remember when we used to have the oil pans on our older trucks "deepened" by adding a couple inches to the bottom just for that reason. More oil capacity = more everything capacity.