Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) have saved 800 for bombs, which ones?

[rodmeyer]

Okay, here's the deal.

I have a 02 ho 6sd. only bombs I have right now . KN air filter, gauges fuel, boost,egt.

I also had a guy talk me into a bully dog propane kit before I really knew anything about cummings and the bombing thing and all. Dont get me wrong. propane works great, its just if I knew then what I know now I would have started somewhere else. Injectors, box exhaust first . Saying all that, I have 8oo bucks saved. I do tow a lot summer thru fall. 20,000 gvw.

Seeing what I have now, what would be the next best mod for my situation?

I was thinking VA and exhaust. but that may be over my budget, I don't know.

Lets hear it boys. thanks a whole bunch,Rod

 

[Barry]

Opinions are like belly-buttons... ... ..... most folk have one. Here is mine:



EZ first.



4" exhaust second



Upgrade injectors third.

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by Barry

Opinions are like belly-buttons... ... ..... most folk have one. Here is mine:



EZ first.



4" exhaust second



Upgrade injectors third.

What Barry said, except I'd upgrade the clutch as step 3 (since you tow heavy), and then upgrade the injectors. That's the dilemma I'm in - we tow a 36' 13,500 lb 5ver that puts us at 21,180 GCW (21,500 GCWR). With our current mods (see signature) I'd like to go to DD Stage 2 injectors, but I doubt the clutch would stand up to it, especially when towing.



Rusty

 

[Chipstien]

Well I would start with DD2's and put the rest back in savings to go towards a clutch. Then after the clutch you could go with a EZ. The reason being injectors are easier on a clutch than a EZ and you will get more overall power.

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by Chipstien

Well I would start with DD2's and put the rest back in savings to go towards a clutch. Then after the clutch you could go with a EZ. The reason being injectors are easier on a clutch than a EZ and you will get more overall power.

Note that he has an ETH. Won't you need a boost module & boost elbow in conjunction with the DD2's to circumvent high EGT's? Our ETH could hit 1300 degF stock when towing the 5ver. I can only imagine what the EGT's would be with the DD2's and no other changes.



That would be one advantage of getting the EZ first - you'd already have the boost module when you add the DD2's.



Rusty

 

[John Berger]

I upgraded in this manner:



1. Edge EZ

2. 275 hp injectors

3. 4 inch exhaust



Oops, I forgot 2a - South Bend clutch, after the mods and extensive towing killed my poor lil stock clutch:{





If I had it to do over, I would have went with Bully Dog Stage III's, which I will do when I'm officially out of warranty, probably sometime this coming summerOo. Oo.

 

[TxDieselKid]

Originally posted by RustyJC

Note that he has an ETH. Won't you need a boost module & boost elbow in conjunction with the DD2's to circumvent high EGT's? Our ETH could hit 1300 degF stock when towing the 5ver. I can only imagine what the EGT's would be with the DD2's and no other changes.



That would be one advantage of getting the EZ first - you'd already have the boost module when you add the DD2's.



Rusty

Rusty,

You make a valid point, but it's an HO, they don't respond as well to boxes as they do injectors.



I would look into a Stage 2 or 3 injector, an aFe airfilter kit, and a stright 3" exhaust.



GAUGES, GAUGES, GUAGES All the more important because you tow. Also you gotta do something about you lift pump sitution.



But like Barry said, "Opinions are like belly-buttons... "



Andrew

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by TxDieselKid

You make a valid point, but it's an HO, they don't respond as well to boxes as they do injectors.

Yes, I'm aware of that. Nevertheless, he's going to need more than 20-21 PSIG boost to keep his EGT's under control. Therefore, if he went with injectors first, he would wind up with something like a Practical Solutions boost module that would become redundant when he added an EZ or Comp. Remember, he's towing heavy (my situation), so EGT's become a much bigger factor.

GAUGES, GAUGES, GAUGES All the more important because you tow.

He says he has fuel pressure, boost and EGT now.

But like Barry said, "Opinions are like belly-buttons... "

Yep.



Rusty

 

[Cummins4Life]

Get a Clutch! Then start saving again for the good stuff.

 

[TxDieselKid]

Originally posted by RustyJC

Yes, I'm aware of that. Nevertheless, he's going to need more than 20-21 PSIG boost to keep his EGT's under control.

That's why I suggested the aFe and the stright exhaust.



Andrew

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by TxDieselKid

That's why I suggested the aFe and the stright exhaust.

Without a boost module, the ECM won't allow the VP44 to supply enough fuel to increase boost beyond the stock 20-22 psig. Yes, the intake air might be a few degrees cooler, and mass flow might increase slightly at a given boost due to reduced intake and exhaust losses, but maximum boost will still be 20-22 psig without some type of boost elbow & boost module. If it were to try to go higher, the VP44 would defuel and an overboost code would be set, right?



With that being the case, I don't believe the very slight airflow gain produced by the aFe and straight exhaust would be sufficient to offset the greatly increased fueling characteristics of the DD2's, and higher EGT's (substantially over the stock 1300 degF) would result. Ya gotta have more air to burn more fuel efficiently.



Further, the maximum horsepower gains available from the DD2's would be limited by the boost-driven defueling limit of the VP44 - when the boost reached 20-22 psig, the ECM would say, "That's it - no more fuel. "



Again, as Barry said, just my belly-button opinion based on 29 years experience with an engine manufacturer.



Rusty

 

[TxDieselKid]

Originally posted by RustyJC

Without a boost module, the ECM won't allow the VP44 to supply enough fuel to increase boost beyond the stock 20-22 psig.

So every second your going down the road your over 20-22 psig of boost?



Rusty I respect your thoughts, and wouldn't debate like this with too many, i don't do the "hair pulling" thing anymore.



Andrew

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by TxDieselKid

So every second your going down the road your over 20-22 psig of boost?

Andrew, I don't understand your question here. Can you clarify?

Rusty I respect your thoughts, and wouldn't debate like this with too many, i don't do the "hair pulling" thing anymore.

I agree. As far as I'm concerned, we're having an enjoyable technical discussion - us old f@rts used to call it "bench racing". When it ceases to be enjoyable, we'll end the discussion. Agreed??



Rusty

 

[TxDieselKid]

Originally posted by RustyJC

Andrew, I don't understand your question here. Can you clarify?

The way your posting, makes it seem like your rig is always over 20-22 psig when towing. Am I false in seeing that this is the case?

I agree. As far as I'm concerned, we're having an enjoyable technical discussion - us old f@rts used to call it "bench racing". When it ceases to be enjoyable, we'll end the discussion. Agreed??

Agreed, and I think WAY too many people take things WAY to seriously on these boards, and get into arguements. Maybe it's just hard to argue with someone in your local breakfast club. :-laf



Andrew

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by TxDieselKid

The way your posting, makes it seem like your rig is always over 20-22 psig when towing. Am I false in seeing that this is the case?

No, generally we'll see around 12-15 psig boost and maybe 650-700 degF EGT at 70 MPH on level ground with no headwind when towing. Boost will go over 20 psig on hills and generally requires 3/4 throttle or more to max out at 30-32 psig and 1100 degF. Obviously, the truck is overaired - not a bad way to run for towing. But with the excess air, the truck could use more fuel (if it had a clutch that would tolerate the additional torque). That's why I'm looking at the South Bend Con O-FE and DD2's now - the truck has the air (hopefully) to handle the bigger injectors without driving the EGT's through the roof.



Rusty

 

[HOSS]

If you don't mind the noise or music to some ears (mine) go with a strait pipe and save a ton of $$$$. Then get an AFE and a PE EZ! If you are anything like me you'll love it. But you will have to be ready to think about a clutch before much else.

 

[RSnaith]

I'll throw my bellybutton into the works too



We've outfitted a pile of heavy towing trucks, and found that the following combination yields the best bang for the bucks, while keeping everything safe:



1) Edge EZ or other low end fueling/timing box (if you plan on stepping up to even greater power, consider a Comp or TST PM3 Adjustable, and leave it turned down). The fueling/timing box pulls your torque peak down lower into the RPM range, giving you useful towing power while climbing hills. It will also give you a wider RPM range in which the truck is making power. A truck with bigger injectors will keep its factory torque curve which is a dog under 1800 RPM. The fueling box will also act as a boost fooler, getting you ready for future injector upgrades without the added expense of a boost fooler now (In my opinion, you _need_ to get the boost up with bigger injectors, even 275s, while towing to keep EGTs under control).



2) Aftermarket air intake.



3) Open up the banjo bolts to high flows.



4) Clutch



5) Injectors. These will now give you some bottom end fill that the box didn't get to, as well as give you a higher peak. Depending on the size of injector and which air intake you picked, you may need to look into a 4" exhaust at this time.

 

[Chipstien]

OK, get a boost module. Somebody knows how to make one for under 20 bucks. Not sure who it is though. I just think injectors give the most usable power without taxing your clutch like boxes do by bringing the power on too fast and too early.

Just my bellybutton's worth.

 

[rodmeyer]

thanks all, great suggestions.

 

[Got Smoke?]

Originally posted by rodmeyer

I do tow a lot summer thru fall. 20,000 gvw.

I can't believe I'm not the first person to mention he tows heavily, but I am the first to mention spending the money on an Exhaust Brake.



If you click on the my profile then look up my olds posts I started a thread about a week ago about Pac Brakes. There was a link to a site in there that had the best price on the Pac, and you would still have $300 towards bombing