Hub Bearing Assemblies

[GCroyle]

Ryan,



I have spent a little time with some guys from SKF and they are busy pushing the envelope on hub designs. I am sure they would appreciate your comments. Expect to see more from them in future designs, but remember their customer is the OE, Dodge, not the consumer so the design may get you to say what is this all about someday!

 

[CMNS PWR]

Ryan, when I got the hubs off (lots of soaking time in liquid wrench), they were actually still smooth as silk. Sort of surprised me since I've got 135k on the clock. Anyway, I didn't need new bolts, so I didn't find out what size they were. Getting the u-joints out was a PITA since they were both completely seized up.



If you get a long enough pry bar, that hub will come off. :-laf

 

[steved]

Ryan,



I have spent a little time with some guys from SKF and they are busy pushing the envelope on hub designs. I am sure they would appreciate your comments. Expect to see more from them in future designs, but remember their customer is the OE, Dodge, not the consumer so the design may get you to say what is this all about someday!

You'd think that they would make a hub for the aftermarket that would be better than the OE stuff... like say greaseable? And before you say it can't be done... what's the difference in making the hub greaseable than making another non-serviceable part (like a balljoint) greaseable??



Adding a zerk fitting would SIGNIFICANTLY extend the service life of these unit bearing hubs... I have already proven that... 252k on the original hubs that we took apart and greased at 86k. There was less than a teaspoon of grease in the entire hub before we repacked it.



steved

 

[HLewallen]

It is amazing how similar the front bearing assemblies on these AAMs look like the rear bearing assemblies on my 96 vette.



This probably doesn't even need to be said, but I will say it anyway. SKF's customer is the OEM. Thus the OEM drives the design requirements of the bearing. The OEM offers a 100k warranty, and if they are doing their job right, passes that on to SKF as a 100k service life requirement. SKF, if they are doing their job right, then designs to a 100k service life with whatever specified margin. Adding a zerk that increases cost to increase capability further beyond design specifications would be doing their job poorly.



And I agree - aftermarket stuff then has almost the opposite flavor to it. The customer is then expecting much more. I guess maybe it is in the math again - they already have the one design. The expense of producing a second design for the aftermarket, especially when most people are looking for OEM replacement instead of upgraded parts, would probably never break even.



I suspect there are similar motives behind these new extended oil change intervals the OEMs are specifying with their new cars. OEMs are good at math. If you want your new car to last just past the warranty period, use their suggested extended oil change interval . . .

 

[steved]

The OEM offers a 100k warranty, and if they are doing their job right, passes that on to SKF as a 100k service life requirement.



SKF, if they are doing their job right, then designs to a 100k service life with whatever specified margin. Adding a zerk that increases cost to increase capability further beyond design specifications would be doing their job poorly.

Umm, since when... the current warranty is 3/36k (what I was just quoted on a new truck)... the 7/100k warranty was gone in the early 90s... the most we have ever seen is 7/70k in the 3rd gens... so based on this logic, we can expect slightly more than 36k out of a bearing before it fails, since the supplier of the OEM part only needs to cross the warranty threshold?



And again, I restate... there is absolutely no difference in them adding a zerk (for the aftermarket crowd) than that of TRW or MOOG adding a zerk to balljoints/tierod ends. I would be more than happy to pay a little extra to have a zerk added for maintenance (and I'm sure there would be a few others that would too). I'm sure MOOG or TRW is the supplier of the balljoints/tierod ends in the axles (it's not like AAM or Spicer make their own balljoints/tierod ends)...



And there again, who cares if it is the OEM maker (SKF in this instance) that supplies the aftermarket assembly with a zerk as long as the quality is there... my point was the aftermarket should step up to the wants of the buyer, not just provide a (sub) standard part when they could make it better (at least give us the option).



steved

 

[ACoffel]

Umm, since when... the current warranty is 3/36k (what I was just quoted on a new truck)... the 7/100k warranty was gone in the early 90s... the most we have ever seen is 7/70k in the 3rd gens... so based on this logic, we can expect slightly more than 36k out of a bearing before it fails, since the supplier of the OEM part only needs to cross the warranty threshold?



And again, I restate... there is absolutely no difference in them adding a zerk (for the aftermarket crowd) than that of TRW or MOOG adding a zerk to balljoints/tierod ends. I would be more than happy to pay a little extra to have a zerk added for maintenance (and I'm sure there would be a few others that would too). I'm sure MOOG or TRW is the supplier of the balljoints/tierod ends in the axles (it's not like AAM or Spicer make their own balljoints/tierod ends)...



And there again, who cares if it is the OEM maker (SKF in this instance) that supplies the aftermarket assembly with a zerk as long as the quality is there... my point was the aftermarket should step up to the wants of the buyer, not just provide a (sub) standard part when they could make it better (at least give us the option).



steved

I am definitely one of those willing to pay extra for the assy. with a zerk and

I think as STEVED has said , most would.

 

[HLewallen]

Jeez dude - didn't mean to pee in your cereal. 100k is just an arbitrary number to illustrate the logic in requirements flow down. But you obviously didn't read my post that closely anyways. Or understand what it would take to implement a design change in a part they already offer, as it is not trivial. But you obviously think there is a market in upgraded bearing assemblies, so I suggest you start looking at industrial property locations for your plant. But if you just want to argue about it some more, please post again and wait right there for me to reply . . .

 

[steved]

Jeez dude - didn't mean to pee in your cereal. 100k is just an arbitrary number to illustrate the logic in requirements flow down. But you obviously didn't read my post that closely anyways. Or understand what it would take to implement a design change in a part they already offer, as it is not trivial. But you obviously think there is a market in upgraded bearing assemblies, so I suggest you start looking at industrial property locations for your plant. But if you just want to argue about it some more, please post again and wait right there for me to reply . . .

It doesn't matter what they supply to the OEM, they should NOT forget about the end user/consumer (which ultimately is NOT DCX, it is the truck owner. )



With the sales of these things for more than 13 years (with all very similar designed unit bearings, as well as other shared components)... how many owners are going back to DCX to have unit bearings replaced? I know I wouldn't for what DCX charges, the short warranty provided, and their work quality. This leaves a demand in the aftermarket by the truck owner (not DCX) for a part that will either last longer, have serviceable pieces, or (the most common) a extended warranty.



Changing the design?? You mean modifying an EXISTING design? It's not like they are recreating the wheel...



steved

 

[Jeff_K]

Great find Ryan! Thanks for all the research on the part number.

 

[DBraswell]

napa has the hub bearing part # br930502 same for left right 176. 00 in nc

 

[JEstes]

Out of curiosity, how hard do you think it would be to add a zerk fitting to the new hubs?

 

[Smokey 01]

I pulled out my abs sensor and filled it up with grease when I changed my brakes. I'm not sure if it helps but it only takes a minute and makes me feel better.

 

[HBarlow]

Ryan,



I guess I missed your excellent post when you wrote it but am glad I found it now. That was excellent perserverance and research and a professionally presented post reporting to the membership. Well done! I'd give you a grade of A on that work.



I only have 119k on my '06 but I think I'll follow your lead and order a pair because before long I'll exceed 200k and that was about the life span of similar bearings on my '01.



Thanks for saving all of us several hundred dollars.



Harvey

 

[EErmert]

Thanks for the effort, really good info!

Eric

 

[NUKEMAN]

I only have 119k on my '06

ONLY?? Some of you guys just amaze me as to how you can rack up the miles in the matter of a year. And I thought my 15k a year was alot!

 

[steved]

ONLY?? Some of you guys just amaze me as to how you can rack up the miles in the matter of a year. And I thought my 15k a year was alot!

I averaged over 60k a year on my trucks until I bought a daily driver car to drive back and forth to work... I have a 108k on my 2004. 5...



steved

 

[rbattelle]

Out of curiosity, how hard do you think it would be to add a zerk fitting to the new hubs?

I think it might be possible, but I'll have to look at the old ones I removed to see where a good spot would be.



And that'll have to wait until the weather gets at least to 30°F.



Glad you guys found this thread useful... that's why I wrote it.



Ryan

 

[steved]

I think it might be possible, but I'll have to look at the old ones I removed to see where a good spot would be.



And that'll have to wait until the weather gets at least to 30°F.



Glad you guys found this thread useful... that's why I wrote it.



Ryan

I agree, I think it might be possible... the main issue would be clearance and keeping the metal cuttings out of the bearing assembly...



steved

 

[RDHamill]

I added grease fittings to mine many years ago, in fact I think

I even posted it at the time.

I removed the ABS sensor bolt and drilled down into the space between the inner and outer bearing. Long story short, I have 500,000kms on one hub, ( greased once a year) the other has 350,000kms on it.

I did the same thing to another truck, it has over 270,000kms of hub bearing trouble free kilometers.

I wrote up my procedure and have emailed to those that were interested.



thanks

 

[JEstes]

I added grease fittings to mine many years ago, in fact I think

I even posted it at the time.

I removed the ABS sensor bolt and drilled down into the space between the inner and outer bearing. Long story short, I have 500,000kms on one hub, ( greased once a year) the other has 350,000kms on it.

I did the same thing to another truck, it has over 270,000kms of hub bearing trouble free kilometers.

I wrote up my procedure and have emailed to those that were interested.



thanks

Would you mind emailing me that procedure? I've got 60k on mine, so I might want to add something before the bearings go out...