I Just Don't Get It !

[maint.man]

For what its worth I personally have got a few thoughts I've got to get off my chest. What the he11 is wrong with people? I have a 12 year old son who is a normal kid for his age. The wife and I never have any big problems with him BUT aparantly the school thinks he needs Ritalin. Now I'm not sayin' that this drug does'nt benifit some, but if they can't prove to me with a test or something that he needs it then there is no way that i'm going to pump drugs into him for no reason. All I can say is if ya' don't want to teach when the're not straight A students then don't but don't just drug em' up and forget about em'. I remember when I was in school, nobody even knew what Ritalin was, I believe the drug that was used to correct problems was uh let me see, an a$$ whoopin' yeah that was it and if you deserved one ya' got one and that was a good reason to do better. Also I seem to remember if you brought a gun to school it was to go hunting after you got home ,not to shoot your classmates. I'm sorry but I believe a time out and prescribed drugs just aren't cutting it for most of the kids in the world 'and heaven forbid you use good ol' fashion disipline cause you just might end up in jail for child abuse. All I know is things have got to change of I think this ol' world will be a poor place to live in another 10 years. Sorry to vent here but I just don't get it and to be very honest I think it's just plain sad .

[This message has been edited by maint. man (edited 03-06-2001). ]

 

[danandamy]

I hear ya man! I heard this nimrod on the radio this morning talking about how his kid keeps being ugly to his dog and he keeps puting the kid in time out but the kid keeps it up and he just doesn't know what to do... I wonder why spineless idiots like this even have kids #ad

 

[joesoot]

Sorry if this isn't very PC but an @ss whoopin' seemed to work well for my old man on me. Hope this doesn't get too personal but when I was a wee one in the 4th grade if I remeber right, a friend's mom saw my dad spank me on the @ss with his hand. She called the school, the school called social services and I had to present my bum to the social worker for inspection, guess it was clean since nothing else happened aside from my folks giving the social worker a piece of their collected minds.
sarcasm~>I know, if and when I ever have a child, it will be treated to the best aromatherapist and psychoanalysts money can buy for all that positive reinforcement/mind opening/meditative/incense-burning/****e.

 

[LSMITH]

It is true that a good spanking does a kid good. Worked on me, works on my kids too. If they know that doing something wrong has consequences they will at least think about it. Also, you do not have to do it very often, just often enough to remind them. It is really sad that some people do not care enough about their kids to teach them right from wrong

 

[rich m]

This is what happens to any profession when there's too many participants: They diversify into greater variety of activity within that profession. Let's face some cold (rich's opinion/views, presented here as though "factual":

Lawsuits are what puts groceries on attorneys' tables. 2 at a time, and it doesn't matter which one "wins". They both collect from someone. Doesn't even matter to them whether there's a right,wrong,or "keep out/mind own business!" involved. IMHO, we should close at least 1/2 of the so-called law schools, (with the students locked inside!) and then begin subjecting the practicing attorneys to the same scrutiny under which we conduct our own lives. If some certain %(keep it a low number) of that lawyer's working career has been litigation or political campaigning, disbar him/her. Prosecution, Defense, and corporate contract should be the majority of the attorneys' time consumption. if not, then they are only in it for the $$$$,

 

[weber1048]

Maint. man

Get a copy of feb 26 Newsweek there is a good article on this topic. ADHD and such needs more that a school counselor to say what's needed

Doug

 

[Champane Flight]

Is your kids teacher female?I have heard in most case they are. The teachers in this case want all their kids to act just like the little girls(teachers pets). Anything from that norm they figure give the kid a pill!They did this with my grandson. He(grandson) asked the teacher at recess"why is my a$$hole round"? And was almost kicked out of school. Bear in mind he was only in second grade. I think this is a legit question don't you?

We are begining to see the results of no disipline in the schools in the form of passive agressive behavior,by the teachers and the students. This finally leads to headlines. School shootings!

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95 Dodge 2500 Luverne grill guard,headache rack,running boards and Amzoiled. Soon to be mildly bombed. 84 Dodge d-150, 318 Hooker headers,Edelbrok intake,mallory ignition,Carter Afb,Accel coil,and Custom dual exhaust. Boat,fifthwheel,motorcycles,and shop. 72000 as of 3/1/01,not even broke in yet. Old Dodge 126000 miles and running better than new.

 

[Sled Puller]

She probably owns stock in the drug company!

If the kid is a REAL problem, I would watch what and when he eats. Excessive junk food, or even good food that he is allergic to can cause all sorts of problems.
Treat the problem, not the symptom.
Gene

 

[Hale on wheels]

I hear all you guys. When I got in trouble at school, my parents informed the teachers and principals that they were to whip me. Then, when I got home, my dad finished where the school let off, and that hurt a lot worse. It only took a couple of times for me to figure out what not to do. Now all these two-bit parents have the mind set that "nobody is spanking my kid. . they do no wrong... . " This constructive critisism so as not to hurt anyone's self-esteem bull**** is for the birds--Now Johnny, we don't need to bring guns to school and shoot everybody. I'm going to put you in time out until the paramedics get all the bodies cleaned up, OK?

This is why I wear boots, I don't mind stepping in it, but I don't like to get it between my toes #ad

 

[Switca]

Maint. man:

And you will never get it. You're trying to use common sense and we dont allow that anymore.

Dont let them pump that crap in your kid!!! Get a second opinion if you have to, but dont let them start that Ritalin crap.

It's the only brain your kid has. Dont let ANYONE mess it up with drugs!


Champane Flight:

Your grandson asked a good question. Probably phrased it wrong, but it's a good question.

Would it have been so hard for the teacher to admit she did not know?

 

[radixr]

If you want to reduce lawsuits (especially frivolous ones), bug your gov't reps. to enact a "loser pays" rule (i. e. , the losing ambulance chaser has to pay all of the winner's legal costs). That's the way it is in most other countries.

 

[maint.man]

Power Wagon,
I know what you're sayin'

And as far as the Ritalin goe's i've seen info that since 1990 it's use in school has gone up 700% (gee small %)
I personally am a firm believer in disipline when it's called for and even though I think sometimes people can be a little extreme, it's still better than kids that don't fear the reprocusions of their actions.

The biggest complaints come from female teachers , and the biggest gripe i've got is that if someone takes a swing at him and he does nothing we hear nothing and nothing happens to the other kid. BUT DEAR GOD don't let my boy ever do that cause if he does it'll be a one way trip home!

Still no happier but at least I found out i'm not alone.

 

[Power Wagon]

I have a child that was dignosed with ADHD, and they prescribed drugs for her too. We found the drugs worked... SORT OF.

What happened, was when she took them, she became quite calm, but when they wore off, she was unmanageable... completely.

Now, becuase the stupid doctor decided to claim something was wrong with her, she seems to think there's an excuse that's outside her control for everything that doesn't go smoothly or has trouble doing.

Instead, if she learns to deal with her problems herself, learning to concentrate, learning to overcome a wondering mind (hey, I did, it's possible)on her own. Frankly, the biggest single curse in her life and the thing that's caused the most trouble for US, is that diagnosis. She blames EVERYTHING on that, including misbehavior, including failing tests, not doing homework, temper trantrums, you name it, she uses that as an excuse to try to avoid the consequences of her behavior.

I would, if at all possible, try EVERYTHING ELSE first. Here's things we found that helped:

1. music lessons. In fact, anything that he/she enjoys doing a lot. Karate, even those darn video games... They all demonstrate how to concentrate and make a habit of it.

2. Organization. Structure his/her time on paper, make every day the same routine, with only a certain amount of unstructured time.

3. Time. Maturation will help.

There's nothing "dumb" about kids with ADHD... in fact, they are very bright, very curious, and have a very busy mind. They are, however, a challenge when it comes to trying to get them to focus.

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ICQ 3807791 Power Wagon
www.my2kcity.com/powerwagon
Mark Koskenmaki, General Diesel Moderator

 

['956Wheel]

I had a neighbors kid always messing with my dogs, and trees, cars you name it, I really felt he was just a little a$$hole. Then one day he walks into my shop and we get to talking, I learned a lot! This kid was smart as a whip and could pay attention as well as any management at work. . o. k. better! Found out he was on that crap. I asked his mom if it was allright for him to come over when he gets to be a P. I. T. A. This kid was just plain bored, if you kept him occupied he was a real good kid.

Power wagon hits this point. I think a lot of folks are to lazy for their kids own good. How many parents do you know that come home hit the couch and a beer and thats it. I know too many!

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9535hundred

 

[DHRA]

maint. man, when I was a wee one, I had hyperactivity disorder (disorder?) and I am still very active, but my mom kept my sugar intake down, and told me that I needed to learn to control the hyperactivity. It took the military to help me control the hyperness! Just think about the future, we will have to give these people that were/are on Ritalin breaks from work because their attention span is only 20 minutes and they are diagnosed ADHD. A psych professor told me that there are organizations already trying to get ADHD covered under the disabilities laws!

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Eric
GLTDR

 

[danandamy]

Talking about the sugar intake thing. When I used to work for TYC (that's where they send all the little gang bangers that are too young to go to prison) every Christmas or Easter or whatever, the social working liberals that ran the place would come through and give the "youts" #ad
all this candy and then we were supposed to get them to bed down at night. When we complained, they told all of us in that "I'm a college educated social worker" condescending way that their "experts" say that sugar will not effect their behavior that way #ad
Man, some "experts" seem to educate themselves into total stupidty.

Daniel

 

[The patriot]

MGM youre not too far off. The school will get extra $$$ if a student is on ritilin. (sp?)
Seem as though theyre classified as "special learning children" when they are.
~BUT~ I'm sure the opinion the teacher gives is a professional, unbiased opinion. #ad

Sometimes I'm happy I dont have any kids. If they misbehaved like I did, I'd be on the social services' daily route! #ad

Eric

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98 Quad cab 4X4 2500 12 valve,5 speed,3. 54 rears, 8' bed. Michelin 265 75 16 lr-E. Boost and egt gauges but basicly stock except for a "properly adjusted" AFC. Cat in the garage. Uniden HR 2510, Texas Star 1200 amp. 63,000 Mi as of 1/27/01.
NRA life member. High power/IDPA.

 

[Max340]

Maint, glad to hear you are against drugging a kid with ADHD. My mother once suggested (right after they found this "miracle drug") that I might have benefitted from it. I promptly told her that I would have had more benfit from teachers that were not afraid to give me a challenge instead of trying to figure out why I was bored off my tookus. I wasn't a discipline problem (unless snow balls on the school bus is a discipline problem??) I was simply bored to sleep in many classes. In order to avoid sleeping and trouble, I read... alot. Took in the entire Time/Life series on WW2 during algebra class.

In the end, its the administration that makes the recommendation for such treatment. Many teachers now days have no time for a student that is different or not totally attentive. Speaking as a teacher in search of a job, I can tell you that I never had a kid in my classes acting out of hand, simply becauseI treated them all as respected people. Some were more active than others, but none were out of control. Keeping their interest is a challenge, BUT, its a challenge, not a time to drug a kid into submission.

Its my opinion that I will likely never find a job in a public school system as long as I continue to submit my "standard application" which includes an essay (required) on discipline where I plainly state that I keep strict control on discipline and loose control on kids focussed on the subject at hand.

In today's schools, you are expected to put up with crap from the kids, and keep tight control on what is taught. That is garbage. As long as the kids are moving forward and asking questions on topic, it is acceptable to me to allow humor, guesses, and teamwork, even if that teamwork is one student giving the answer to another one during class, not a test. Remove the spontenaity, and the kids lose interest, wouldn't anyone? Remove the discipline and how much work gets done?

Spontenaity includes putting joke (but incorrect) choices into multiple choice questions, and on occasion putting a deliberate screw up on my part into the test. This does a couple of things, it lightens the mood, kids ENJOY tests if they figure they might get a laugh out of it. Lower stress equals better grades. Would kids on behavior modifiers even notice this?

Planted wrong answers on the teachers part mean that the kids might get "one up" on the teacher, IF they catch it. My standard answer to that was, ok, prove it. Suddenly I have 120 kids looking for proof of my mistake, with a 5 point increase on the test grade for the right answer. Sound a bit stupid? Yeah, I got 120 kids to start working on research skills, without a bit of effort on my part. Still sound stupid?

It does if the kids are all on some sort of behavior modifier. How do you teach a droid? How does a robot learn? How do you joke around with a kid who doesn't have full emotional capacity because he or she has been drugged out of it? Its time we were allowed to teach kids instead of cram info down their throats and told to drug them if they choke.

Sorry, having been one of those kids that they couldn't figure out a way to teach, I HATE it when they come up with these half a$$ed solutions. Kids deserve better.



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Y2K 2500 QC Sport 4x4 LWB
72 Dart 340
89 LeBaron GTC 2. 2 TI

 

[BCFAST]

Well, now as a 40 year-old, I understand more about kids and social behavior. When I deserved it, my folks beat my butt! When I was good, I received a reward and praise. I dont believe there is more ADD than there was 35 years ago, just a lack of discipline. We have produced an entire generation of Beavis & Buttheads that cant read, write, or think for themselves... mostly because of the demise of the 'nuclear family'... where Dad goes to the office, and Mom stays home and waits for the kids to get home from school. There a an awful lot of kids today who go unsupervised for several hours each day... they get into trouble with NO consequences. I cant imagine what would have happened had I stollen a car or robbed a Circle K as a teen... certainly not the slap on the wrist and into my folks' recognisance!

 

[N8LHG]

Maint. man,

I had a first grader who was constantly in trouble at the public school near me. My wife and I had meetings with the school psychologist once a month, and he had notes sent home from school quite regularly. We were told that he was a problem child, and questioned our parenting abilities. The straw that broke the camels back was the recommendation was to put him on this control drug you are facing right now. My wife and I then pulled both our kids out of that school and enrolled them both in a private Christian school. My boy has skipped two grades now, and has never been in any trouble.

The fault was totally due to the incompetence of the public school system here in central Ohio. My boy was simply not being challenged, he was board.



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Mark Wardell
1996 Dodge 3500, 4x4, Duel, Green and silver, Shocked farm pin hitch, Goose Neck hitch.