Injury with Catalyst full, time to give back

[Wolfy]

Wolfy,



An excellent, informative post that forced me to consider avoiding short trips around town altogether with my new '08. Damn the EPA and the liberal hacks in Congress who have imposed this on us!



Harvey

Hi Harvey,



IMO, there is room for several philosophical perspectives on this.



We human-types have undeniably damaged our nest, by greedy, damn-the-consequences behaviour. When we choose to dance with complete abandon to loud music, for a long time, ... it is reasonable to accept that the piper must be paid.



Many of us agree, but often want someone else to do the paying, and we want payment to be made "someday".



In THIS case, we are picking up some of the check, and "someday" has come.



My rig is quiet, smoke-free, presumably poisons the atmosphere less, and is a delight to drive. It provides all the power I need, when I need it, i. e. , is a capable heavy-hauler... and can't be faulted for not-being an econo-errand car.



I wish it got 100 mpg, and that fuel was the 18 cents per gallon that I am old enough to have seen (gas wars, late fifties, Miami, Fl. ), but there is reality to contend with, ... and I am willing to raise my hand to volunteer to help clean up some of the mess all of us have made. The attempt to do so is costing us fuel dollars, ... and I don't doubt that the engineers are seriously trying to reduce that cost, while achieving the lessened-pollution goal.



We are where we are, along this path of tech-evolution, and all we can do is participate with crossed fingers, or sit things out while progress is made by the more willing.



I am reasonably certain that Cummins will accomplish as much as anyone in dealing with these issues,... I am absolutely certain that I could not do it better.



There are both societal and personal costs to be borne, if we are going to attempt to slow down the deterioration of the environment that we and the following generations will live in.



That being the case, and since I support the goal, I am reluctant to curse those who are attempting to lead the way. And I am disappointed enough in most of my fellow humans to have zero faith that things would be reversed voluntarily.



Best wishes,

 

[PaulBarker]

if somebody wants to lead the way it needs to be done where the environment is effected. Maybe someone needs to go the the factories in South America, Africa, Asia, Russia, and so on. The trucks we drive have so very very little effect on the world. Matter of fact it has so little effect that with all the other countries that dont follow the US(which they will not) it will only change the end of the environment by a few days. Yeah we can set the standard and you may feel good doing it. But if the whole world does not do it, it does not matter.



People are too easy mislead. Take Al Gore example. Global warming. he talks about many many ppl die each yr for the heat and how its a problem. What about the amount of ppl that freeze to death each yr. it is a overwhelming amount, thousands more than from heat. how about Malaria, more people have die from a moisketio bite off the small island of Malabo off of west africa than pple dieing from heat.



If you want to help the world you shouldn't be driving a diesel, it should be a golf cart(gets charged by a solar panel) or a bicycle.



ppl are so full of the right thing to say, sure you can attack my words and i am sure you will. it does not bother me. what bothers me is ppl attacking someones misfortune of a new diesel that left him stranded for him and his wife to walk. more than likely you are the same ppl that will destroy families, ppl, or a person to save a animal.



before yall speak again yall should explore the world as i have seen it. go see the real pollutants in the world.

 

[HBarlow]

To those of you who are "environmentally conscious" to say it politely, I apologize if an apology makes you feel better but I simply do not buy into all the save the environment cause. By that I do not mean that I consider it appropriate to dump used motor oil on the ground or other such acts but I simply do not believe that global warming is a real threat and do not willingly support or accept EPA-imposed hardware and software on new trucks.



As usual, the new emission control requirements almost certainly cause reduced fuel economy and greater fuel consumption which may very well add up to an aggregate greater polution not to mention greater costs, reduced reliabilty, etc.



I have seen very few things done by government in my lifetime that produce positive or desired results.



I'd like to see the EPA eliminated and also all the hacks in congress who support and empower the agency.



Harvey

 

[PaulBarker]

HBarlow, I like the way you think,

 

[catoiler]

To those of you who are "environmentally conscious" to say it politely, I apologize if an apology makes you feel better but I simply do not buy into all the save the environment cause. By that I do not mean that I consider it appropriate to dump used motor oil on the ground or other such acts but I simply do not believe that global warming is a real threat and do not willingly support or accept EPA-imposed hardware and software on new trucks.



As usual, the new emission control requirements almost certainly cause reduced fuel economy and greater fuel consumption which may very well add up to an aggregate greater polution not to mention greater costs, reduced reliabilty, etc.



I have seen very few things done by government in my lifetime that produce positive or desired results.



I'd like to see the EPA eliminated and also all the hacks in congress who support and empower the agency.



Harvey

Hey something we can agree on!!:-laf Who healed the hole in the ozone???#@$%!

 

[JAaron]

Agree 100% Mr. Barlow

 

[bmoeller]

I certainly don't blame the store for my truck failing, or the components it was manufactured with. Chrysler built the truck, and made all the choices and decisions about its quality, manufactureing, and dependability.

I would one step farther. Chrysler isn't the reason they have put that crap on anyhow. Thank the EPA and f'in treehuggers. THEY are the ones who demanded it. Chrysler and Cummins wouldn't have built that crap otherwise.

 

[HBarlow]

Hey something we can agree on!!:-laf Who healed the hole in the ozone???#@$%!

Hey, welcome aboard. I'm glad to have one or two who agree with me. There are probably a few who are grinding their teeth and muttering unkind words about me under their breath but that's their right.



Good question about the hole in the ozone. I'm old enough to remember when the environmentally conscious (gosh, it's hard to be polite) were ranting and raving about global cooling and the coming ice age. If we listened to and took those folks seriously they'd return us to horse drawn wagons, wood stoves, and candles and then they'd be whining about horse manure polluting the streets and streams, wood smoke and ashes polluting the environment, and candle wax emitting toxins.



Harvey

 

[catoiler]

Funny how anytime their is a crisis(sp) like global warming or other, the only people who they seem to tout are the ones who support them. what about the others that have hard facts about it the other way. I also like how these stupid people will follow some nutcase actor or such and believe anything they say, don't they know they are paid decivers( thats whay acting is ).

 

[CMusgrove]

This thread has turned into quite the pitty-party.

 

[SBreaux]

I see a great bunch of loyal Chrysler/Dodge owners who Chrysler/Dodge do not care about. If even just one person would prove to anyone here that someone other than DodgeChrysler said "put that part on", I promise I will never say another word on this topic.

 

[HBarlow]

SBreaux,



Of course you see a bunch of loyal Chrysler/Dodge fans here. What did you expect to find? This is a website of paying members of the TDR, a Dodge-Cummins owner's club. The product, in large part, has been superior to any other for many years. But, if you are implying all of us are lifelong loyalists who continually buy a bad or doubtful product you are flat wrong. If you started a new thread and asked that questioni you would find that at least half, probablyi 3/4s of owners were not Dodge fans before they became Dodge-Cummins owners. I never owned or wanted to own a MOPAR product before I drove an HO 6 speed Dodge dually in early 2001. I had driven Ford pickups for years and earlier in my life I grew up in a GM family and owned GM products.



I'm not sure what you mean by "if just one person would prove to anyone here that someone other than DodgeChrysler said "put that part on. "" If you meant that Dodge Chysler decided, on their own, to install the complex and power robbing/fuel economy reducing new emissions standards you are naive or blind to the obvious facts.



I'm sure you've heard of the EPA and have heard somewhere that EPA has imposed new and very restrictive emissions standards that must be complied with in 2007 and even more so in 2010.



The blow-dried empty suit egos in the Congress imposed more restrictive emissions standards with little or no understanding of and less concern about the problems their rules would create.



The engine and truck manufacturers appealed the ruling and lost in court so they have no choice whether to comply or not. They must meet the standard or stop building diesel engined trucks.



The only choice they have in the matter is how they will design and build systems to meet the requirement imposed on them.



One of the beautiful things about being a congressman is you can be uneducated, uninformed, stupid, illogical, ignorant, wrong, dishonest, phony, and even criminal. All you have to have is enough votes to be elected and have a big ego. They can impose any stupid requirement they want without being forced to give the challenge or impossibility of their rules even one serious thought.



I understand that Ford, GM, and Dodge took three different and separate paths to the solution. It should be known and understood here that Ford and GM, to my understanding, are not yet complying with the 2010 emission standard, only the 2007. Cummins developed new engines that meet the 2010 standard with their typical practical solutions. The big truck industry is using urea and other more complex systems. Cummins, to their credit, tried to keep it simple. Ford and GM have their own challenges still to come.



Yes, Dodge and Cummins are having some problems. It is not clear yet if the problems were primarily on the '07s and have already been essentially corrected on the '08s but it IS clear that Cummins and Dodge are replacing parts and developing revisions of the software as fast as they can to resolve the problem. No new truck has had a block failure, a crankshaft failure, a camshaft failure, a cylinder head failure, a bearing failure, not even an injector or injection pump failure. Ford has suffered thousands of the failures I just listed with their 6. 0 nightmares and GM has suffered many of them with the Isuzu engine early in their experience although never to the degree that Ford has.



I have worked in the service department of an automobile dealership and have sold cars and worked for a time as the "F and I manager" in a dealership. It is widely known and understood that buyers are sometimes unhappy with new products for many reasons. One of the surprisingly common reasons that has been observed and laughed about in dealerhips for 50 or 100 years is what is called "buyer's remorse. " It frequently happens because buyers buy new cars or trucks for emotional reasons then when the shiny new car or truck is parked in their driveway and they get the payment book in the mail they realize they've made a huge mistake. Sometimes it is because the buyer bought the wrong vehicle for his needs, bought a vehicle that is too expensive for his income, or sometimes it is because he or she simply can't afford the payments or regrets taking the cash out of his savings account or retirement portfolio. Buyers have buyer's remorse for many reasons but they are usually nobody's fault but the buyer's and nobody else is responsible or willing to accept the financial loss because of the buyer's bad decision.



If you don't like your Dodge sell it, trade it for whatever you like. park it alongside the road and leave the key in it, or set fire to it. It is your truck and you can do whatever you wish to do with it. It is your right to continue complaining about it if you wish but I for one am growing tired of your whining and blaming others. You started this thread with a childish title that implied that you believed that because you claim your truck wouldn't start or run while snow was on the ground and you used bad judgement and walked home and you and/or your wife slipped and fell on the snow or ice that Chrysler corporation should take back your truck and give you your money back. You have probably learned by now that it is simply not going to happen. You are an adult and responsible for your own decisions. If your truck experiences problems return it to the dealer every time. Unless you treat the dealershlp personnel with contempt they will probably do their best to repair it as Cummins and Dodge release new solutions.



I wish you satisfaction in whatever you decide to do.



Harvey

 

[cojhl2]

Harvey,



Well thought out and very well written.

Sometimes it is because the buyer bought the wrong vehicle for his needs,

I think this happens quite often with these big diesel engines.

 

[Bob4x4]

I see a great bunch of loyal Chrysler/Dodge owners who Chrysler/Dodge do not care about. If even just one person would prove to anyone here that someone other than DodgeChrysler said "put that part on", I promise I will never say another word on this topic.

:-laf The entire pkg was designed by Cummins including the after treatment pkg. Yes,the actual parts have been out sourced from around the globe. For example the throttle body is from seimans/vdo.

Dodge bought the powerplant assy they did not design,build or develope the software.



Bob

 

[RVTRKN]

Bob4x4,



Dodge dealership never gave me an 800 Dodge number, but if it works like their truck I shouldn't expect much if anything. Also as this was purchased to be my daily driver that tries to accumlimate more than 1. 3 mile trips daily, it left me 68 highway miles from home today. It is now 2:31am central time, and I was lucky enough to get a ride ride back since late this afternoon.



No I don't feel any sorrow for Dodge, after all they have the say when the truck is ready for market. Dodge has all the say on how it is built. Making Dodge's engineering problems mine, just isn't my problem. I would be willing to bet any amount of money that not a single person here bought their truck to have it leave them somewhere, stay at the dealership weekly, or spend extra money and time taking long trips because that is what is what is needed to make a truck run at $3. 50 a gallon reliably. The dealer could always quit selling Dodge trucks and then the problem of being at the mercy of Dodge would be eliminated. I just made the mistake and purchased unwisely. I sure hope the over 2000 views on this post has saved someone from the same pain and suffering.

I see a great bunch of loyal Chrysler/Dodge owners who Chrysler/Dodge do not care about. If even just one person would prove to anyone here that someone other than DodgeChrysler said "put that part on", I promise I will never say another word on this topic.

I was looking at my owners manual packet and found this (look at pic) and I remembered this thread and just thought I would give you heads up on were it was when I purchased my truck. Because I ordered the truck, nobody was in it except necessary personnel and was clipped to the steering column and is for customer to remove only. If this was not in your truck when purchased you may have a legit lawsuit. You should be able to read it, but incase you can't, it explains about your emissions system and the need to drive a certain way to clear the "Catalyst full see owners man" on your overhead display. It does direct you to read the owners manual for specifics. Hope this helps, there part number is on the upper left in yellow.

Now your starting to sound like a troll. You know, that is what the TDP members label you if you post anything negative about their trucks. Here is some good advise, call the number below or check out the web site I have provided you at the bottom of this post and do something about your POS as you call it.



This site is not owned by Dodge and as you can tell you have been given all the courtesy in posting, but now it just seems your trolling. I was a member of TDP for a short time and know of what I talk about when its about trolling, for I was accused of it when I defended Dodge on the TDP, because some smart mouth punk started something he couldn't prove and I confronted him on it. It got to the point of a moderator blocking my access until the members had insulted me and tried to twist what I had written. After that the moderator asked me if I wanted to still post, he would take the block off. Well you can imagine what I wrote back and now I just visit to see what success or problems they are having on the new DPF issues and there are plenty of problems as well as all the manufactures are having issues.



1-866-86-lemon or Oklahoma Lemon Law Rights: 1-866-86-LEMON : Free Oklahoma Lemon Law Info and Help! Alex Simanovsky & Associates, LLC

 

[SStrano]

Has anyone seen pictures of the skies around industrial centers from the late 1800's and early 1900's? Even into the 1950's? Pollution isn't a myth, and it's better now than it was then even with many more people and cars and trucks, and houses, and powerplants.



But it isn't good, and it won't get any better as the population continues to expand. I like Wolfy think it's time we grow up and start showing a little responsibility. Saying that our trucks don't pollute and the plants need cracked down on is crazy. I don't disagree there are terrible polluters out there but the fact is it's easier to make us clean up than the big time contributors who run those dirty plants.



None the less, we do add to the pollution. Saying we don't is like saying a quarter isn't worth taking because it's not money. Well, 40 quarters is $10. It all adds up. And if we can't deal with the gross polluters a lot of "little" help does indeed add up.



This is not a time to be selfish, act like we're 3 years old and say "he doesn't have to share, why should I?".



And as for the US vs. the world on pollution: We're the riches country in the world. We were once the leaders of technology. Why shouldn't we stand up and do our part (at least start) and be a leader?



Anyone who thinks we don't have a bad effect on this planet can't add. It's simple. We haven't always been here. More and more of "us" arrive everyday and each of us uses natural resources and leaves a trail of waste in some form or another. We make heat, we burn Carbon, we use oil, we cut down trees. That stuff doesn't magically re-appear, and the use of it has after-effects.



I'm not a tree-hugger. I have a Cummins. I'm taking a chance trading my 04. 5 for an '08 partly because I think I can do a little (and I want a new truck). I also have a Mustang GT. It's not a Prius, but it gets better mileage than the truck does, and reduced my useage. I don't take plastic bags from stores if I can carry what bought without one. I have fabric grocery bags (which are better because they actually hold more and don't cut my hands or tear). None of those things has made my life suck, and I don't live off the grid. I'm as much a part of the problem as anyone, but at least I'm trying to do something about it instead of saying it's not my problem. It's ALL our problems, you can't move to Mars or the Moon.



I would have loved to be around during the Muscle car days. I know the 70-80's sucked for performance. But you know... we make more power now, cleaner than we did then, and with less fuel which is good for your lungs AND wallet. I see this as an extension of the same.

 

[RVTRKN]

Has anyone seen pictures of the skies around industrial centers from the late 1800's and early 1900's? Even into the 1950's? Pollution isn't a myth, and it's better now than it was then even with many more people and cars and trucks, and houses, and powerplants.



But it isn't good, and it won't get any better as the population continues to expand. I like Wolfy think it's time we grow up and start showing a little responsibility. Saying that our trucks don't pollute and the plants need cracked down on is crazy. I don't disagree there are terrible polluters out there but the fact is it's easier to make us clean up than the big time contributors who run those dirty plants.



None the less, we do add to the pollution. Saying we don't is like saying a quarter isn't worth taking because it's not money. Well, 40 quarters is $10. It all adds up. And if we can't deal with the gross polluters a lot of "little" help does indeed add up.



This is not a time to be selfish, act like we're 3 years old and say "he doesn't have to share, why should I?".



And as for the US vs. the world on pollution: We're the riches country in the world. We were once the leaders of technology. Why shouldn't we stand up and do our part (at least start) and be a leader?



Anyone who thinks we don't have a bad effect on this planet can't add. It's simple. We haven't always been here. More and more of "us" arrive everyday and each of us uses natural resources and leaves a trail of waste in some form or another. We make heat, we burn Carbon, we use oil, we cut down trees. That stuff doesn't magically re-appear, and the use of it has after-effects.



I'm not a tree-hugger. I have a Cummins. I'm taking a chance trading my 04. 5 for an '08 partly because I think I can do a little (and I want a new truck). I also have a Mustang GT. It's not a Prius, but it gets better mileage than the truck does, and reduced my useage. I don't take plastic bags from stores if I can carry what bought without one. I have fabric grocery bags (which are better because they actually hold more and don't cut my hands or tear). None of those things has made my life suck, and I don't live off the grid. I'm as much a part of the problem as anyone, but at least I'm trying to do something about it instead of saying it's not my problem. It's ALL our problems, you can't move to Mars or the Moon.



I would have loved to be around during the Muscle car days. I know the 70-80's sucked for performance. But you know... we make more power now, cleaner than we did then, and with less fuel which is good for your lungs AND wallet. I see this as an extension of the same.

Yes, the auto industry did finally get it right but almost bankrupted our industry, so how long do you think it will take to ketch up to the DPF crap EPA has wrongly imposed on us? Will the US auto industry go bankrupt now before there is a better solution? Remember the auto industry was saved by the big SUV's and HD trucks that the imports couldn't compete with and now that the regulations are so strict it will open the door for Toyota. They will have a diesel in a half ton soon and it will erode our market. I believe there should be pollution controls but not at the expense of our industry. After all it was the auto industry that won WWII for us and will hurt our ability to industrialize if needed when they are gone.



The volcano's have more to do with warm house gasses than we can even begin to comprehend and to try to blame the U. S. for it because we have diesels is pollution to say the least. In california the EPA ruined a bowling lane manufacture I used to work for because they outlawed the bonding agent (epoxy) that they used in the synthetic lanes we were manufacturing. The replaced "approved" epoxy was working until the lanes started to fall apart all over the world and they had to warranty them, which cost me my job.



I'm for responsible pollution control, not blind laws that the tree huggers like, or some politician that hasn't a clue, but will get more votes because of the propaganda as to the cause of our pollution, no mater what the cost.

 

[PKitzman]

Question for the guys with the particulate filter problems. Are most of the problems showing up during cold weather? Since the exhaust gas is wet I wonder if there is some moisturefreezing issues in the associated pressure taps. If not moisture, maybe the taps are plugging with particulates?



I have a hard time believing that these filters are plugging up as fast as they are on a few problem vehicles unless they have bad fuel as a few guys have mentioned. I suspect bad fuel or bad instrumentation... more than likely there is a combination of both.



You can't do too much about the computer in these trucks, but maybe check the fuel on the ones that are acting up and any associated instrumentation with the particulate filters. I don't know what instrumentation they have, but I would guess that they have a temperature probe, a dP transmitter or two, and a pressure transmitter at the very least.



My view on this long thread is that we should stop pointing fingers and hugging trees and maybe try and help figure out what is wrong with these trucks...

 

[PaulBarker]

i had the dpf problems, i had the dpf fail and leave me stranded with 1200 miles on the dash. that truck shut down on the high way at high way speeds. i was on the high way for a couple of hrs at that moment. before i started my truck i was offshore for 4 weeks, and before i arrived offshore my truck and i was on the road for 450 miles. mind you this was around May and i live in south texas and i was driving to and from "loozeeanna". so i was doing everything that you, cummins, EPA, and DC say i have to do to drive a new dodge with a DPF. It failed and others have too, so dont give me accuses why it failed. also i did not have anything after market on that truck, it was stock. i lemoned that truck cause of soo many problems.



There are trucks out there with major problems and others with non. the 6. 7 i have now is great. when i had the dpf on there i had no problems with it. i have drove that truck in nothing but stop and go city traffic for weeks with no 20, 30, 40, or 50 min runs at high way speeds. i did not have problems with it. It is a individual case by case. It is the truck, some just have that many problems and others are great trucks.



when the dpf was on this truck i would try to force a problem by letting it idle in the drive way for a hr or so to see if i was going to have the problems again. i had no faith in this truck when i got. after everything i went through i wanted this truck to fail cause i wanted a 5. 9. i could not get it to fail.



i hate the poor mph i get and its all from the dpf and egr. the new way the injectors work is not all that great either, IMO. This three injection spray, I feel makes for poor mph. but until i get the EGR blocked i will not see the improvement i have been looking for.



But yall feel the dpf and low mph is the way for you to feel like you are helping the pollution problem, i feel that no DPF and No EGR with a much better mph is my way to better help the pollution. also not to mention that i know none of you can answer this question, i don't know either,



What do you get when you burn carbon and everything else the DPF catches with diesel? What pollution are you providing us with? Is it any better when you combine it with horrible mph?

 

[grasmo]

PaulBarker hows your truck doing?? ... Just curious. . Grasmo.