Is "Sea Foam" in oil at oil change OK?

[zzman]

I change my oil around 5k to 7k miles. I use 2-1/2 gal 15-40 Delo and 2qts Lucas additive. I avg 70k miles a year of hard pulling and have had no problems with the engine.

With over 340k miles I feel more and more like my turn is coming with a major engine issue. In attempt to extend the engine life, I thought it should help by reducing the exhaust soot in the engine.

At the last oil change I used a bottle of "Sea Foam" in the oil and ran it for 40 minutes before draining. The oil level was about a qt. low due to gasket leak from timing cover (been that way for a long time).

I read on other engine cleaners that said not to use with oil cooled turbos. The Sea Foam did not mention this (hoping it was OK).



My thought is the exhaust soot that cycles thru the engine can not be good for working parts. This I thought may be the reason the gasket on the timing cover began to leak. Now I'm concerned for more leaking issues or engine failure. The leak is too costly to fix for the amount of oil that is leaking. It just makes the underside nasty looking.



Soooo, what do you guys think about using "Sea Foam" as an engine cleaner in the oil?

Sorry I got too involved with the question.

Thanks

 

[Motorhead]

Why would you want to dis-lodge any dirt and gunk in a 340,000 mile engine? For you, you have found a program that works to get the engine mileage you have. Why change?

 

[zzman]

I thought the soot had harmed the gasket to make it leak. I'm trying to stop any more harmful affects in gaskets or seals.



I was just trying to find out if anyone else has used "Sea Foam" as an engine cleaner.

Thanks

 

[PBJ2500CTD]

I personally would not use it unless I had an abundance of disposable income. You'll need the abundant disposable income to repair any latent internal engine damage down the road. If you use a quality oil and a frequent maintenance schedule, which it sounds like you do, then you shouldn't concern yourself.

 

[zzman]

My concern is the oil leak, why did it start?

It seem to start real super slow about 50k miles ago.

I had the fan clutch replaced and the shop said the leak looks like the timimg gear cover is leaking. That was about 15k miles ago.

The procedures to replace the gasket is ridiculous and too expensive for such a minor leak. Almost a qt between oil changes.

But what made the leak in the first place? All I could think of is detrition of the gasket from the oil with all it's emission soot.

That is where I'm at now, looking for a means to help clean up the insides.

Bruce have you heard any ill effects from using an engine cleaner on 04. 5 engine?

Maybe there is another reason that I'm not aware of for a gasket to start leaking after 300k miles.

Any and all comments are appreciated.

 

[Road Dog]

Sea Foam won't fix your leaking gasket. If anything it'll clean away any buildup of sludge or varnish and leak more.

 

[chipster]

My concern is the oil leak, why did it start?

It seem to start real super slow about 50k miles ago.

I had the fan clutch replaced and the shop said the leak looks like the timimg gear cover is leaking. That was about 15k miles ago.

The procedures to replace the gasket is ridiculous and too expensive for such a minor leak. Almost a qt between oil changes.

But what made the leak in the first place? All I could think of is detrition of the gasket from the oil with all it's emission soot.

That is where I'm at now, looking for a means to help clean up the insides.

Bruce have you heard any ill effects from using an engine cleaner on 04. 5 engine?

Maybe there is another reason that I'm not aware of for a gasket to start leaking after 300k miles.

Any and all comments are appreciated.

I would take the timing cover off and clean and loc-tite all the timing case bolts, and do the kdp if it hasn`t been done. it`s been my expierence that when a gasket starts to leak the bolts are usually getting loose. thghten `em up and the leak will stop. if it still leaks after the bolts are tightened, clean the spot where the leak is with break cleaner or acetone and put a layer of "the right stuff" silicone sealer to cure the problem. I didn`t think too much about a small leak on my timing case that started at about 280,00 miles and one timing case bolt ate my camshaft (snapped it in two right behind the gear) at about 300,000 miles. soot is not going to deteriate the gasket. it`s not hard to get the cover off and tighten`em up. clean the bolts and holes with brake cleaner and use red loc-tite, you won`t be sorry. :-laf :-laf

 

[zzman]

Not trying to fix the leak, trying to stop any more due to harm from sludge.

If more leaks accure, then good, I'd like to get all the gunk out before reparing the first leak.

I'm still not sure if Sea Foam will not harm bearings, rings or damage seals itself.

Thank you

 

[zzman]

Chipster, I have a 04. 5 engine, no kdp (killer dowl pin) problem here.

I am told that the cam has to be removed to replace this gasket. So when I get this leak fixed it will be a major thing that I can not do. I hope to do other things at that time too.

Thanks

 

[chipster]

Chipster, I have a 04. 5 engine, no kdp (killer dowl pin) problem here.

I am told that the cam has to be removed to replace this gasket. So when I get this leak fixed it will be a major thing that I can not do. I hope to do other things at that time too.

Thanks

if the bolts are loose the gasket will leak, and tightening `em will stop the leak. loose bolts inside the timing cover cause leaks and "get" more cams than the dowel pins. just my expierence.

 

[rscurtis]

Save your $ on the Seafoam and Lucas. An engine that has regular oil changes shouldn't have any deposits in it regardless of the mileage.

 

[rbattelle]

Why would you want to dis-lodge any dirt and gunk in a 340,000 mile engine? For you, you have found a program that works to get the engine mileage you have. Why change?

Amen.

Sea Foam won't fix your leaking gasket. If anything it'll clean away any buildup of sludge or varnish and leak more.

Amen.

Save your $ on the Seafoam and Lucas. An engine that has regular oil changes shouldn't have any deposits in it regardless of the mileage.

Amen.

I assume by "timing cover" you really mean "gear housing cover".

Gaskets (all seals, actually) eventually deteriorate. It's just part of the circle of life. I doubt it has anything to do with anything you've put or not put in the oil system (including soot).

I like chipster's suggestion to check torque on the gear cover screws.

Replacing the gear cover gasket doesn't require pulling the camshaft. You simply have to remove the PS pump, fan drive, tensioner, coolant recovery tank, windshield washer tank, upper radiator hose, and crank pulley. On install, you need to also replace the front crank seal.

Does anyone know whether these have a gear cover gasket from the factory? Because the service manual says nothing of a gasket - they say to use a bead of silicone.

-Ryan

 

[chipster]

Amen.







Amen.







Amen.



I assume by "timing cover" you really mean "gear housing cover".



Gaskets (all seals, actually) eventually deteriorate. It's just part of the circle of life. I doubt it has anything to do with anything you've put or not put in the oil system (including soot).



I like chipster's suggestion to check torque on the gear cover screws.



Replacing the gear cover gasket doesn't require pulling the camshaft. You simply have to remove the PS pump, fan drive, tensioner, coolant recovery tank, windshield washer tank, upper radiator hose, and crank pulley. On install, you need to also replace the front crank seal.



Does anyone know whether these have a gear cover gasket from the factory? Because the service manual says nothing of a gasket - they say to use a bead of silicone.



-Ryan

I just looked at an`06 timing case and cover. it looks like the case uses a gasket to the block and a bead of grey silicone for the cover. when I put on a timing case I only use silicone ("the right stuff") between the case and the block (no gasket) and a bead of the right stuff on the cover. no leaks. :-laf

 

[Prairie Dog]

I've used just silicone on the timing covers and intake ends of two V8 ferd engines I rebuilt and neither one one has leaked. I got tired of the lousy paper gaskets leaking after a while and since I use silicon on each side of the gasket I thought, why bother with the paper.

 

[timelessconstructionllc]

not to try to hijack the thread but y'all have me concerned about the torque on the bolts you are speaking of cause i've had a leak (very slow) for quite some time and i had just assumed it was the front crank seal. can anybody tell me exactly which bolts need tightended and how to get to them?

 

[chipster]

not to try to hijack the thread but y'all have me concerned about the torque on the bolts you are speaking of cause i've had a leak (very slow) for quite some time and i had just assumed it was the front crank seal. can anybody tell me exactly which bolts need tightended and how to get to them?

the bolts needing to be tightened are the ones that hold the timing case to the block. you need to remove the damper, fanpulley and mount, and any other stuff that will be in the way of taking off the timing case cover. this "stuff" will vary by year and engine style. 12 valve or 24 valve, etc. after the cover is off you will find some bolts that hold the case to the block. take`em out one at a time, clean the holes and bolts with spray brake cleaner at least twice, then put the bolt with red loc-tite back and tighten to 18 ft lbs. you`ll have to turn the crank to get to the bolts behind the cam (put two damper bolts back in the crankshaft and use a BIG screwdriver weged between the bolts to turn the crank) gear and hold your mouth just right to get`em all behind the cam gear, but it can be done. if your engine has a dowel pin right above the cam gear and it has no tab to keep it from falling out make one out of 10 ga sheet metal and use the bolt next to the dowel pin to secure it . common rail engines do not have the dowel pin inside the case. put a new crank seal in the cover, clean the gasket surface on the case and cover, put a bead of silicone on the cover and bolt it back on. reinstall all the "stuff" you removed and have a brew, or whatever, and be assured that the dowel pin or case bolts will not cause any problems.

 

[zzman]

I guess I need to double check this then, I was reading a manual with the machanic when it stated to remove the cam shaft. He told me that there was a cover over the gears then the other plate was behind the cam gear I assume. I figured the cam gear and cam must be a one piece item. I don't know but the labor he stated was way to much to fix a small leak. He tried to tighten the bolts that he could reach.

Perhaps this is not as intense as I thought.



If the gasket or silicone is not affected by the sooty oil, then this is a good thing. I just can't imagine a good thing with exhaust circulating through the engine.



Thanks guys

 

[rbattelle]

I guess I need to double check this then, I was reading a manual with the machanic when it stated to remove the cam shaft. He told me that there was a cover over the gears then the other plate was behind the cam gear I assume.

No, wait, I'm mistaken. I guess there are 2 sealing surfaces here - the cover and the gear case itself.



If the leak is between the gear case and the block, then you're absolutely correct the cam has to come out.



If the leak is between the cover and the case, then the cam doesn't have to come out.



Sort of unfortunate that the case isn't cast into the block.



-Ryan

 

[cerberusiam]

I guess I need to double check this then, I was reading a manual with the machanic when it stated to remove the cam shaft.

Your mechanic is correct. The cam has to come out to fix a leak on the timing CASE.



First off, find the leak then you will know better what has to be done.



Are you seeing oil leaking on the passenger side of the engine and dripping off the AC compressor and on the timing case cover at the front seal? You might have to clean things up good and take it for a short drive but thats where this type of leak usually shows.



The normal leak point is going to be under the fan mount, and I mean compeltely hidden from view. The oil runs down a slant in the case across behind the water pump then down onto the AC compressor and spills onto the front cover from the fan blowing it around.



There are few bolts inside the case cover to tighten. The bulk of the bolts that hold the cover to the case also hold the case to the block. You can tighten them until they stretch and it won't make a difference. The problem is a warped case and gasket creep.



If your leak symptoms match what I described, here is a cheap easy fix:



Pull the fan and fan mount



Clean the slanted area above the water pump to top the case so you can see a leak



Start the engine (make sure it is up to operating temp before pulling the fan) and run it at high idle for 3-4 minutes. You should see the oil starting to leak out betwen the block and case on the slanted area. Check and make sure the leak is not from a cracked case as they will do that also.



If so, clean it up real well with carb cleaner and lay a heavy bead of silicone from the flat spot behind the water pump to the top of the case. Let it setup overniight.



What happens is the gasket between the case and the block is thin right there and the case is also. Heats cycles and the constant barrage of oil throw from the gears eventually cause a leak. So far that has held for over 10k of driving. Beats the heck out of pulling the cam unless you want to change it.

 

[bheiting]

In regard to oil, if you're using a good diesel engine oil, you don't need and should not use additives. It you introduce additives that are not compatible with existing ones, you can do more harm than good. Valvoline Premium Blue Classic 15/40 is a joint venture with Cummins for pre 6. 7L engines. I wouldn't mess with a proven, balanced formula. It has the best additives in existence.