K&N Filters, Any proof they are better?

[John_P]

Hammer:



AGAIN, excellent follow-up post! You and I both know

this subject will not be settled here.



--------------

sdalton:



I used to live near you over in Humble, Texas. Man

do I miss Texas fajitas!!!!



-------------

956:



I have had my oil analyzed with the K&N and the

readings are always normal.







______

John_P

 

[moparguy]

As I've followed the post on the BHAF, it's a real kick to see the passion we develop as we defend our opionions.



I installed my BHAF July 17, 2001, got 8,600 miles on it.



To address the oil analysis question, I've sent in one sample since going to the BHAF. Had 7025 miles on the Delo 15-40, a lot of dusty gravel roads driven in the summer in central Arkansas pulling loaded hay trailers and a backhoe (GCVW about 27k) were included in that change. The silicon number on the Fleetguard analysis was a 4.



This was my first analysis so I don't have a baseline to compare to, but based on the test others have done, a 4 isn't bad.



The BHAF and snow wetting the filter medium is a serious concern. I don't generally have that possibility where I live, if I lived in the snow belt, I might reinstall the stock filter and housing during the winter. I've never been able to catch the filter wet no matter how much rain, or pooled water I drove through.



If I change to something else it may well be a AH1196, this is basically a BHAF but it has a plastic housing with slots on the end. I'd like to investigate tying it into the 4. 5" hole in the Rams cowl duct and the factory fresh air duct in the fender.



If this filter is available with a inner wire support and can be connected to the fresh air ducts, it may be the perfect paper filter for my needs.



Have a good year guys, take care of those you love.



RJR

 

[redneckdr]

BHAF

i have checked mine several times after driving in heavy rain. not wet. also checked after hard interstate driving. not hot. i put a sock on it so, i think snow would not be a problem. i plan to spray with "water proofing" and flame retardant, when i get to it. for a pic, https://www.turbodieselregister.com/user_gallery/displayimage.php?&photoid=551&width=1

 

[moparguy]

Sock looks good.

redneckdr, I like the idea and look of the sock you're using on your BHAF. Tell us more, is this a custom item, or something you adapted. What material is used in the sock?



Thanks, Ronnie

 

[redneckdr]

sock

ronnie, the sock is my idea. i'm an old wornout redneck orthopaedic surgeon. the sock is orthopaedic stockinette. 6" tube, comes on a 25 yard roll. just whack off a chunk, roll it onto the bhaf.....

 

[pwr2tow]

your wife (if you have one) might not like this idea but use one of her nylons. Thant would be none panty hoe type

Ron

 

[JJW_ND]

Filters and Snow and water!

Those that have ever driving in snow (storms) might have had a sudden loss of power. Filter froze over from all the snow sucked in. In fact allot of things get sucked into the filter box. Water, bugs, snow.



I called Fleetguard right after the SETDR thread on colapsing BHAF filters. The Fleetguard rep said the number for the original BHAF (Moparguy filter) was designed for ON-ROAD us. Which means it is mean to get wet, full of snow, and bugs. It is specifically meant for Cummins B and C applications. He Said the Marine version is design to survive total flooding.



While some of you want heat shields, I wish I could hook up a shield to collect the heat of the turbo and suck it into the filter. Much better then the negative degrees F we are sucking lately.



BTW, I also had a silicon flagged on a Oil analysis when running a K&N. I blame it more on the poor airbox design then the filter. I also totally aggree with leaving the filter box shut (if using one) until the filter minder moves. Go bust some snow banks and You will get it to move.



jjw

ND

 

[jeff2]

the proof is in several of my customers faces when they

had to replace engines with a nasty unserviced k+n !!

this happens often, but i sell 10 k+n's per week with

upgrades i guess if they had just never looked in the air

box that would have prevented the ring failure? not!

maybe we could not look at some oil and it will clean

itself?

 

[illflem]

Jeff2, you miss the point entirely. What are you doing selling a product that ruins your customer's engines anyway?

 

[Cummins Corvette]

I would have to agree with illflem here. What the heck are you doing? I had a K&N on my first gen (NO SEALING ISSUES HERE!!) and that thing was always letting dust in to the intake. I never saw any oil after the filter, and I know it was oiled PLENTY. My new truck will never see one of those things. They don't do a good job with fine dust. If you doubt me just hold yours up to a light and you will see what I mean. If you can see pinholes all over then there is no way that all the dust is going to get filtered out.

 

[LarryB]

Yaaawwwwwnnnnnn... .....

 

[Cummins Corvette]

Shut up Larry. LOL

 

['956Wheel]

My lawnmower runs a wet (oiled) filter... conventionally aspirated. Now, put a "wet" filter on your precious 5. 9, turbocharged, intercooled engine and wonder how you can get boost... cause of those "pinholes". Besides, your intercooler does not require lubrication, my understanding is that the intercooler is of aluminum construction... why? for superior heat transfer, if you coat the inside with oil you will lessen the effectiveness of it. On large air compressors, with after coolers, the tubes are periodically acid washed or rodded out to bring back the efficiency lost to oil and other "contaminates.



To me clean, dry and cool as possible charge air is the ticket! IMO



I can understand those who are loyal to a given product, but be certain it is a well informed decision rather than hype and pretty stickers.



What is the micron rating on a KN? They more than likely cannot say due to the numerous variables.



Mike

 

[LarryB]

 

[WadePatton]

Absolutely no HP advantage apparantly

Yeah, I'm reviving a dead horse so we can beat it some more.



Anyhoo- I waded (I'm good at that) through 70+ posts here and I don't see any answers to the man's original question. He even restates the question. Ya'll turn it into a free for all on stock vs. aftermarket/ flow vs. filtration issue.



All he asked is for real rear wheel numbers. NOBODY HAS ANY obviously. Will the defendant please rise if he does!



Jannetty says use a fancy filter and exhaust.



Blue Chip Diesel says your factory system moves plenty of air up to the higher levels of mods.



UH OH, I just figured it out. Since a 450HP (guesstimate) engine needs more flow and us wide-eyed kids see them monsters running K&N and 5-inch exhaust, we think that it'll make our wheezer 200-300HP setups run better--and we just know that we'll need more flow later when WE have the BEAST under the hood.



Oo.



Well, okay that may not fit everybody but I'll bet it sells more filters than anything.



I did remove my exhaust with no expectation of a performance increase. I just wanted the sound. Too bad I didn't dyno it. (straight 3" after the resonator welded in for $40).



I will be dynoing from now on--just found out that I won't be the first kid at the dyno shop with a diesel.



Some buddy went up there with his PoS Ford after he'd spent $2000 on it-something about a wastegate and three-position box. They say he got plumb irate when his truck made more power on "economy" mode than the higher two levels. LMAO



Dynos rule.



My plans are: guages, dyno (base), injectors, dyno, edge box, dyno, etc.



I may even dyno with the SR in and out. No fancy air cleaners for me. If any dyno anywhere could tell the difference in an air filter--we'd know about it.



But if'n you want one, fine by me.

 

[Steve Roseman]

EGT'S, EGT'S, EGT'S.

That's where you'll see the difference in air filters. Anybody making mods should have gauges, watch the gauges. When you add fuel, the egt's go up. If you add enough fuel, you're egt's will go beyond the safe level. THEN go spend the extra money on an air filter, then turbo exhaust housing, then fancy exhaust.

 

[Steve M]

With all the chattering about Cummins and DC voiding warraties because of using a K&N air filter, why isn't K&N criticized for their absolutely worthless million mile warranty? It's all hype. Read it for what it is. They state in writing that they will NOT be liable for any damages or injuries as a result of using their filters. This tells me they have no faith in their own product.

Here's the part that keeps me away. Even Fram's warranty covers your vehicle if damaged by a failed Fram filter. And Fram has paid up on occassion when their filter has failed. Here's the words from K&N's warranty.

EXTENT OF WARRANTY:

Any defective Filtercharger® element properly returned to K&N will be replaced by K&N. K&N will not be responsible for any other expenses incurred by the customer under the terms of this warranty, nor shall it be responsible for any damages either consequential, special, contingent, or otherwise; or expenses or injury arising directly or indirectly from the use of the Filtercharger® element. Any Filtercharger® element returned to K&N must be sent at customers' expense along with a completed Warranty Claim Card and proof of purchase. K&N reserves the right to determine whether the terms of the warranty, set out above, have been properly complied with. In the event that the terms are not complied with, K&N shall be under no obligation to honor this warranty.

 

[redneckdr]

k 'n n

so, steve m. are you using a k 'n n on the fatboy? i won't run one on the CTD, but i've used thme on most of the gassers i've had including my '90 FLH. i just don't think they filter well enough for the turbo charger... ... seem ok for naturally aspirated engines.

 

[Steve M]

Naw, the FatBoy just received a new HD filter for $23. and some change. It looks like cotton gauze but it's dry and thick. They say no oil on it. I'm sure it's restrictive but I don't think a stock HD draws much air anyhow. It has more than enough power for me and the HD filter works fine. I cannot buy anything that the manufacturer states in writing that they WILL NOT stand behind if it fails and causes damage, and install it in one of my expensive vehicles. They lean heavily on the Moss-Frankenstien act. Why should DC have to pay up for damages if caused by an aftermarket filter. If the aftermarket filter causes damage due to a defect and not misuse, then the aftermarket filter manufacturer should pay up. Fram does and has done so. I won't use a Fram oil filter either but I have more respect for Fram as a company. I've used Fram air filters with good results. Yes they are more restrictive and they don't come with the WOW factor or a sticker! But Fram stands behind their product. If the filter minder doesn't move, then the filter isn't too restrictive. When it starts to move, I change the filter. $18. 00 a year isn't too much for air filters.

 

[RKelly]

WadePatton nailed it:

I asked if anybody had dyno data pre and post changing ONLY the air filter.

It's not a likely event that someone would do that, but, ya never know, especially with all the gear-heads on this site (that's a compliment !!!).

I don't have egt worries, so for me, It's whatever Gino's has on sale !!!

God Bless America !

Ray