Kore Chase with Welds/Toyos - Worth $6000?

[LightmanE300]

Hey guys. I'm contemplating upgrading to the Kore Chase with Welds and 35" Toyo m/t's. Wow is the price staggering when you look at the total! Kore just recently raised their TDR member prices on the wheels , was $435 TDR member price and now they are $500! Nice little $260 extra per set they are throwing in their pocket as of Jan 1st. I have an email from 2 months ago quoting me $435 now that price will not be honored, which was pretty disappointing. Anyway the chase system is $2500, and the tires are around $1500 mounted/balanced, plus an alignment. I mean I like how they look at the reports of the suspension are great, but $6k is a lot of money - a new jetski or quad, box and twins, or a full trans upgrade and a box. To those that have done these upgrades, if the money was back in your pocket, would you spend it again? Greg Boardman - you are not allowed to answer - no offense but you're simply too biased! Thanks in advance guys for your thoughts.

 

[Punkineater]

So you save your wheel bearings with their wheel design... ... ... . the extra money you save by not buying their wheels would buy enough wheel bearings to outlast the truck. Sorry, not a fan of the hyped Kore suspension. It looks to be a great performer, but it is way overpriced IMO.

 

[JCleary]

Overall I'm glad I spent the money. I've replied in another post as to why I went with the Kore Welds. Death Wobble is not a funny subject, and you're going to greatly increase your odds of getting them by having the wrong offset.



I put a set of 20"s on my '01 Land Cruiser, and it ruined the driveability of that SUV. Granted, it's an IFS and more sensitive to funky offsets, but I returned the wheels/tires for that reason, plus the fact that the wheels were not hub-centric. No matter whether the tires were spin-balanced, road-force variation balanced, eyeball balanced, it didn't matter. The lug-centric design always left a vibe in the steering at 45-70mph. Not fun.



If you get the Kore system, you will be happy. I like mine a lot. It's firmer in the front than stock, and softer in the rear.



The one thing Kore advertises is the elimination of expansion joint bounce. Yes, the kit does improve it, but by no means does it eliminate it.



I called Kore and talked with Kent, and he said that the shock valving is set up for a good mix of ride and control while towing. He said that he came up with a new valving setup that will make the expansion joint bounce even better, but at the expense of some stability when towing.



He offered to re-valve my shocks and send them back at no charge. That's customer service! Try getting Skyjacker or Rancho to do *that*



If you don't like the product, they seem willing to make it the way you like it. I think that's what contributes to the high price. But, IMO, that's part of what makes a product worth the money. All in all, I'm very satisfied.



BTW- I found those tires at $309/tire. Do a little hunting with smaller shops and you'll get a better deal than on the internet. Also, try and find a shop that will sell you the kit, wheels, tires & install, and I'll bet you'll save over $500.



I really do want a TST and twins, but I figured I'd wait until the B to B warranty is expired. That's why I went with suspension first. Plus, it looks sooooo sick.

 

[LightmanE300]

Thanks for the replies. Jcleary - when speaking with Kore on the phone the other day, SaraMae said there was a charge for revalving - which surprised me because I previously thought it was free.



That $1500 for tires is at $318/tire, mounted, balanced, and with road hazard warranty. Don't forget about an alignment and tax my friend! Also have to pay/find someone to charge the shocks with nitrogen as well.



Part of me wonders how much better the Chase is than the Pace, considering I do mostly on road driving. I just think if I get the Pace I'll always be annoyed/wonder what the chase might be like.



It really irks me that they upped the price of the wheels for TDR members. SaraMae at Kore came up with what I consider to be a very lame excuse/lie attempt in saying that Weld wants them to charge more for the wheels. I work for a manufacturer that sells through distribution, and let me tell you , that aside from advertised price, as long as the manufacturer gets their cost from their distributor, they really don't care what the consumer pays. That price jump from $435 TDR price to $500 is quite a hike. This is the first thing that has slightly tarnished my feelings toward Kore, which were previously those of admiration.

 

[Kry226]

It really irks me that they upped the price of the wheels for TDR members. SaraMae at Kore came up with what I consider to be a very lame excuse/lie attempt in saying that Weld wants them to charge more for the wheels. I work for a manufacturer that sells through distribution, and let me tell you , that aside from advertised price, as long as the manufacturer gets their cost from their distributor, they really don't care what the consumer pays. That price jump from $435 TDR price to $500 is quite a hike. This is the first thing that has slightly tarnished my feelings toward Kore, which were previously those of admiration.

Actually, there are agreements between certain manufacturers and other entities that state that the products have to be sold at a certain price or higher. When I was shopping for BFGs, I was speaking with a manager at Discount Tire and he told me that they could get into trouble (contract violation) for underselling what BFG wants for the tire. This prevents different distributors from undercutting other distributors. I believe this is called predatory pricing, done to eliminate competitors. I am not marketing wiz, but I believe this is the jist of it.



Also, keep in mind that some dealers, as well as manufacturers, could be their own distributors.



And then again, maybe KORE is just jacking their prices up. :{

 

[GTani]

Yes,I would spend the money again. If I didn't need to run miles of washboard road at speed than I probably wouldn't. My BFG 315's on stock rims work fine and would take some justifying to buy the Weld rims and Toyo tires. I have also ordered the stabilizer and it should be here anyday.

Consider what you are going to use your truck for and decide if it's worth the cost.

 

[Caveman]

I'm looking into the KORE suspension Chase package. I'm wondering if anyone can tell me what the tallest point on the truck is after install with the 315/70-17 BFG KOs.

 

[LightmanE300]

Actually, there are agreements between certain manufacturers and other entities that state that the products have to be sold at a certain price or higher. When I was shopping for BFGs, I was speaking with a manager at Discount Tire and he told me that they could get into trouble (contract violation) for underselling what BFG wants for the tire. This prevents different distributors from undercutting other distributors. I believe this is called predatory pricing, done to eliminate competitors. I am not marketing wiz, but I believe this is the jist of it.



Also, keep in mind that some dealers, as well as manufacturers, could be their own distributors.



And then again, maybe KORE is just jacking their prices up. :{

Very few manufacturers are imposing Minimum Sales Price policies, as they are walking a VERY fine line in regards to Antitrust violations - although there are some. . What's becoming very common is MAP - advertised price policies. Most people as it filters down the line of distribution fail to make the distinction - or use it as an excuse to charge higher prices. These policies are put in place to keep one's products from being footballed over the net or other channels at ridiculously low prices - which negatively affect brand image and drive down everyone's profit margins. In any case, they are typically aimed at advertisements or published prices. I can definitely see weld pushing Kore to advertise/sell at a high retail price, but never putting pressure on them to raise the prices of a 'special deal' which is the TDR discount.



To me, what it comes down to is that Kore is building up a good name for themselves finally, and are able to get a bit more for their products due to their 'brand'. Maybe the change in business structure from trex to kore has caused higher gross profit requirements. Who knows, who really cares. The fact is that they've jacked up the prices and we the TDR now pay $240 more per set of wheels.



I may contact Weld. Kore makes it sound like the wheel is made specifically for Kore - however I doubt that weld has made the wheel an exclusive KORE product. I contacted one web vendor about the wheels, and he contacted me back in a few minutes - with a price of $496. He called weld to check on them because they were too new to be in his book. The guy at weld told him they are putting them on a lot of dodges and I'm assuming it's the same Cheyenne 8 , 18x8. 5. If anyone finds a good price, plz post!

 

[Bertram65]

I thought the story went that Kore had to front $200K to have the wheels made for them and pre buy them all from Weld, it would seem strange that Weld would have any control or influence over the price if Kore owns all the wheels.

 

[LightmanE300]

I'm just repeating what Kore told me Bertram (nice boats!). Anyway, I dont intend on focusing on this wheel price issue - if others could comment in response to my first post that would be great!

 

[jjdiesel]

Just to add some perspective... . the price increase was forecasted, we knew it was coming Jan. 1, I guess either we heard about it or we did'nt. Also, even though 5 smokes a wheel is a lot of cash, Kore is still giving TDR guys a discount, his website lists them at 575. 00

 

[Fred Swanson]

100% Yes. I would buy the RACE suspension again. Some people will say it's too expensive for what you get. I say, your getting more than you think for the money spent.



The overall ride characteristics have improved dramatically, in all aspects. And the off-road manners are nothing like stock. LightmanE300, essentially, all kits use the same springs, it all comes down to the shocks, and what your intended use of the truck is.



I chose the RACE, as I wanted a suspension that I knew would eat up anything I threw at it. The road manners just cruising at highway speeds is superb compared to stock. The feel driving is of more confidence, less stressful making manuevers, especially real urgent ones.



Can't answer about the wheel and tire situation, as I didn't purchase those. I run factory alloys with 37" MTR's. This setup works for me.

 

[Desert Proven]

I was an early adopter of the RACE system and I love it. I run it on an 02 and am pretty hard on it. I couldn't imagine driving anything else. Yes, it was more expensive than a Skyjacker lift kit or something of that nature, but it isn't designed work the same way. It is designed to improve the performance of your truck. You cannot compare it to other lift kits out there. You have to compare it to other high performance suspension modifications. These can run you $5000-$15000 easily.



Some people here choose to spend their money on performance upgrades for their engine. I chose to spend for performance for the ride. I decided that even if I had the most powerful engine out there, I still would have to ride in that POS stock suspension to get where ever I was going. I'm a pretty frugal person, so spending the cash wasn't easy, but I'm glad I did.



I can drive my truck all day down washboard road, through washes, etc. and I don't feel the fatigue that I used to have just driving down the highway.



As far as the wheels and tires go, I can't help much. I did upgrade to the Toyo Open Country M/T in a 315/75/16 and I think they are great. I run them on stock alloys.

 

[blake underwood]

BTW- I found those tires at $309/tire. Do a little hunting with smaller shops and you'll get a better deal than on the internet. Also, try and find a shop that will sell you the kit, wheels, tires & install, and I'll bet you'll save over $500.

Hey Fred,



Is this something your shop can do? If so, can you PM me a price? Thanks



Lightman,



The expensive price on the suspension is because of the shocks. You won't see Skyjacker or Superlift w/ Fox Shox! As for the wheels, I can't comment, but $435 a wheel would have been a steal. Makes me kind of Po'd I didn't take advantage of that offer. I missed the inflation notice :{ .

 

[Yo Hoot]

I have the Kore leveling kit and purchased the rear shocks as an add-on.



For that kit I felt the price was decent... I spent about $600 shipped.



That's springs, bump stops and four Bilstien 5100's.



I love the ride and was very happy with Kent's willingness to answer questions.



And finally... . have you read where someone was not happy with their Kore suspension? I haven't and I now know why.



Kore is good stuff.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

I may contact Weld. Kore makes it sound like the wheel is made specifically for Kore - however I doubt that weld has made the wheel an exclusive KORE product. I contacted one web vendor about the wheels, and he contacted me back in a few minutes - with a price of $496. He called weld to check on them because they were too new to be in his book. The guy at weld told him they are putting them on a lot of dodges and I'm assuming it's the same Cheyenne 8 , 18x8. 5. If anyone finds a good price, plz post!

Lightman keep in mind the Cheyenne wheels from Weld won't have the proper offset, and it's possible KORE won't guarantee their product fully using wheels that stick out too far and were not designed with their system (you'd have to ask them).



About the wheels. . . it's true they are only available from KORE, you cannot get these Weld wheels from Weld or anyone else. Kent did have to pull over $100,000 out of his pocket to make them happen, it took him MONTHS and a LOT of hard work and continual pressure to finally get Weld to make the special run of 18" wheels. My guess is he's been selling them at a loss to get some sets out there and promote the product per se, and now he's probably selling them at a break-even cost at $500. I really doubt he's making much on them, and probably won't until he at least sells the initial run of wheels.



Kent really put his neck on the line to make these wheels happen, I am sure if there was any way he could do it I'm sure he would not have raised the price of the wheels.



Vaughn

 

[Punkineater]

Hey Fred,



Is this something your shop can do? If so, can you PM me a price? Thanks



Lightman,



The expensive price on the suspension is because of the shocks. You won't see Skyjacker or Superlift w/ Fox Shox! As for the wheels, I can't comment, but $435 a wheel would have been a steal. Makes me kind of Po'd I didn't take advantage of that offer. I missed the inflation notice :{ .

You do realize you can get custom valved Fox shocks to work with any kit don't you? I plan on running custom valved Bilsteins with the kit I'm building and while I am building a kit with different specifications and my particular needs are different than those who invest in the Kore I am comfortable that it will function and ride much nicer than stock. My point is simply that with a little ingenuity you can create a very nice setup. It all depends on your needs and wants and can be done for less than the Kore.

 

[WoodChuck]

I got the "leveling kit" and rear shocks too and absolutely love it. I installed it Friday and the one of the first places I took it was dirt Mulholland and what a difference. Very smooth on smaller bumps/washboard but firms up instantly if you hit anything bigger or harder. Riding on the highway is very smooth too. The more I drive it the more I love it. Maneuvering I traffic the truck respondes instantly too. I'd have to say that most of us will be very well served by the Bilstein 5100s. How much off road do you really do and how fast do you want to do it is what it really boils down to. Unless you do lots of off road travel at higher speeds or just want the best of the best the 7100s or the Fox shocks aren't necessary. I plan on installing the "mini leaf packs" within a month to smooth out the back a little more. Maybe after the truck's payed off I might upgrade to the 7100s but moneys too tight right now. Also Toyo is going to be releasing the MT in a 35x12. 5x17 very soon so save your money there too.

 

[LightmanE300]

Lightman keep in mind the Cheyenne wheels from Weld won't have the proper offset, and it's possible KORE won't guarantee their product fully using wheels that stick out too far and were not designed with their system (you'd have to ask them).



About the wheels. . . it's true they are only available from KORE, you cannot get these Weld wheels from Weld or anyone else. Kent did have to pull over $100,000 out of his pocket to make them happen, it took him MONTHS and a LOT of hard work and continual pressure to finally get Weld to make the special run of 18" wheels. My guess is he's been selling them at a loss to get some sets out there and promote the product per se, and now he's probably selling them at a break-even cost at $500. I really doubt he's making much on them, and probably won't until he at least sells the initial run of wheels.



Kent really put his neck on the line to make these wheels happen, I am sure if there was any way he could do it I'm sure he would not have raised the price of the wheels.



Vaughn

Vaughn, that's a nice story, and I'd hate to think it wasn't true, but here's what I found out from weld after hanging up the phone with them a few minutes ago. They do offer the wheel through other distributors, and it is the dodge specific wheel. The part number is 408-885942 , and they told me it has a 6 and a half inch backspace and positive 40mm offset for dodges. If that is the wrong spec for our trucks I stand corrected, however Scott at Weld Racing told me this wheel is available thru any distributor, and retails for $575. Same price on Kore's site, so it really sounds like the same wheel. I just called Jegs with the part number and they can get the wheel - although they wanted $575 as well :-laf

 

[Greg Boardman-RIP]

Lightman,

For some reason you think I shouldn't post here because I am Biased?

Well I am a little biased. It isn't because I have great suspension now. It isn't because after I met Kroeker at the Motocross track I went home and changed my DRW to a SRW truck. It isn't even because of being affiliated with his race effort and working on the truck with him. It is because of the integrity that I have learned from Kent. It is because of his Valor. He has something that most of us have. Pride!!! We are proud people , us Americans, ( even the Canuks). We are proud about being Americans. We are lucky to watch what Kent has done. To have and idea and run with it. He has given more to america than most of us. A war Veteran, a scholar, an innovator, and finally, just a humble American.

So you say I am Biased??? Yes I am!! How could you not be influenced by a guy like this. Do I love my suspension, you already know that answer. Am I friends with Kroeker, know that one too. I am an insider with KORE, volunteer for the race effort, and even a product tester. That would make me biased? I think not!!! I have much more integrity than that . . If something sux I say it!!!! Do I run crappy stuff on my $40K truck? Not even close. That is what makes us alike. We want the best for our trucks. What kind of guy puts the stuff on a truck to make sure it is running at its best? Guys like us!! Thats who. Kroeker is that guy too.

Now you complain about paying alot of money for something you can get no where else. How many complaints have you seen from the guys who, like me, have spent that same money??? I dare you to find 5 out of the member base of the TDR!!! Most replies I see say " I would have spent double" or Wow, What great customer service" . Life is all about relationships. That is true in business too. Kroeker have a great friendship. Does that affect the way he does business? I think not.

Now to the wheel issue:

Kroeker spent something like $200 large to have a wheel built for Dodge truck enthusiests. I have seen the stack of wheels. They are made by weld but follow his specific design. Not the same as the wheel that you can get from summit. Your buddy at weld must be mistaken, Kent has the exclusive deal, from designing it, with Weld for a couple of years. Will they be available to the public in the future. Yes!! I bet you can even find them for less than the $495 that was quoted. But in the real realm of money. How much is $240? I spent that on fuel and groceries last week. If I needed to, I could have spent it on alot of stuff. How many of us use a SBclutch instead of a Napa clutch? It is almost $500 more than napa but nobody wines about that. Kroeker even went above and beyond the call of duty. He mad a system affordable to all. The leveling kit is only $500. The stupid kid down the street can afford that. I bet it even comes with a cool KORE sticker! Now upgrade to a complete lift/ leveling kit. Double that price. Now go to Billet towers and remote resivors, not even available 3 years ago anywhere, then he even offers the Race system for psychos like me. Most suspension companies ignore the Dodge, and he has embraced us. Made something better than anything on the market, and kept it at a reasonable price. Shocks alone are $600 or something, at the local off road shop. Then take them to Fox and ask to have them revolved. The build your own custom Billet towers, test springs and find a maker of a spring that doesn't fail, get another company to build you some awsome leaf packs for the rear. Then you can post what a great deal you got doing it yourself. I have said before, the hours spent under that stupid truck, bumping our heads, laughing in delirium from lack of sleep, and making things better is what it takes.

If you don't believe in what is happening here that is fine. I am sure you can get something that fits you budget somewhere else. There are more that one wheel company and more than one guy making flares to cover up the wrong offset. I just wouldn't start ripping on everything a guy like Kent does. He reads this stuff too! He has put his heart and soul into the stuff he sells. He and SaraMae work 14 hour days to make us happy. He does whatever it takes to keep us happy. He has done a fine job of it too. Like I stated earlier, post 5 bad reviews of product and service> I dare you!!



Greg Boardman

Desert Racing Concepts