Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) KSB1B - I want to lower the rpm at which boost starts to rise significantly

[PC12Driver]

My mistake! When rweis first stated that his turbo was NOT wastegated (in the initial post), I assumed that his turbo was not wastegated. The boost elbow from Edge just bleeds off air pressure that the wastegate actuator "sees", thus delaying its opening 'till a higher pressure. So, I guess I need to understand how an elbow change will effect the opening pressure (therefore limiting boost) on a wastegate that isn't operational?



Or maybe this wastegate isn't as non-operational as originally thought?

 

[Alphacowboy]

this is the boost elbow, the copper deal.



#ad






Also, before I tapped the wire on mine... drove like crap, turbo lag was horrible, soon as I tapped the wire... alot better. BUT, I still have the same sorta problem as you, as there is a tag in the turbo until I hit about 1600RPMs, they the boost shoots up to 40PSI and runs like a raped ape, but its so SLOOOOOOW right away on any setting under 5.

 

[Roger rodbolt]

You should pressurize the entire system, make an adapter to introduce the air to the turbo inlet, ie where the air cleaner hose attaches. This will pressurize all your piping, the aftercooler, air horn, gaskets etc. If you have a boost elbow in your turbo it will leak a bit. Use soapy water in a spray bottle to check for small leaks but I've tested running trucks that had the aftercooler split so badly that my test compressor/adapter couldn't build pressure and the leak was so bad that it was hard to feel the leaking air.



I use a hardware store purchased rubber connector that is made to join PVC pipes that have been cut in place. The connector has two worm drive clamps on it and I think an ID of 4. 5" but will fit our turbos of ~ 4. 25". Since I'm cheap I also purchased a threaded PCV pipe plug to seal off one end of the adapter, then drilled it to fit a common tire, rubber valve stem to supply the air compressor fill. I also tapped the pipe plug and installed a pressure gage but you can watch the boots on the aftercooler piping expand with air and judge that 25psi makes the stock aftercooler boots look like balloons :-laf . I'm late for a trip so sorry for a very quick post but HTH's. Larry

 

[rweis]

That is exactely what I needed, the measurements, and some ideas.



On the way home I was thinking I need a little information about the KSB1B wastegate actuating lever. My KSB1B does not have anything attached to the wastegate lever. So is there a spring in the KSB1B that holds the actuating lever closed or open? What if it is just floating freely. I was thinking about puting a spring on the lever and hold it in one direction. Drive the truck and see what happens to the boost. It might get a lot worse if I am now holding the waste gate open, or it might get a lot better if I am holding the waste gate closed. It could just be "fluttering in the "breeeze"".



I looked at the compressor housing. There is not a wastegate actuating hose, pipe thread, fitting of any kind. Not even a hint of a boss to drill a fitting into.



I think I will first hold the waste gate lever in one direction, test it, then if not that direction, hold it in the other direction.



Second I will pressurize the piping system from the filter to the turbine. I wonder if the valves and piston rings will seal the air from the compressor enough to pressurize the whole air system. Don't know but will tommorrow .



Now what pressure to pressurize to? Say about 20 psi? That is what the SM says to pressurize it to. Thoughts?



BTW, a huge thanks to all that responded to help with the ideas. More than one approach really does work.



Bob Weis

 

[Idaho CTD]

If you think your wastegate lever is loose then wire it towards the front of the truck or towards the fender depending on it's arrangement. That is in the closed position.



The front of our turbos are 4". You can get a rubber boot as suggested to attach a piece of straight 4"PVC and then glue and cap on it. Then drill and tap the cap for either a schrader valve or a or a pressure regulator followed by a air compressor fitting. Usually 20psi is more than enough to hear a leak that might be present. You might be wise to hold onto the plastic part as you pressurize the system so it doesn't come flying apart.

 

[JHerrlich]

I don't know about the KSB1, but I have a regular B1 and the wastegate has a bolt screwed into the cover to permanently hold the wastegate shut. I would agree with everyone else about the boost leak. With what you have, you should be able to drive that KSB1 just fine.

 

[rweis]

Tonight I looked at the waste gate actuator lever. Without the waste gate actuator mechanism attached the lever is free to move. Which could be the problem.



I need someone with a KSB1B to look at their actuator lever arm. It is on the manifold side of the turbine and a little under the turbine down by the oil return line that goes back to the engine.



As I look at the lever from the mouth of the compressor toward the truck firewall, it will move from the 11:00 o'clock position to the 9:00 o'clock position.



Yours without the engine running should be closed so the turbine gets full pressure. Now, is your actuator lever at the 11:00 o'clock position (ie closed) or at the 9:00 o'clock position (ie closed).



Could very well be where the boost is going.



Thanks,



Bob Weis



I did not see the above post about wiring it toward the fender before I made this post. I do have a screw on the cover to ??? but I can move the lever through about a 20* arc.



Might take it off tommorrow and open 'er up and see what is what.

 

[jerrethomas]

the wastegate lever wouldn't have to move much to make a difference in performance. 20*'s as you said might be enough to affect it.

 

[rweis]

Well, could not wait till in the morning



I did go out and check the waste gate tonight. It was locked down by the screw in the cover. However it was locked OPEN.



The screw has a lock nut on it and it seems somewhat tempermental, but I did get the waste gate lever loose and wired to the fender side of its travel (a true bailing wire job). The acceleration was significantly better. The max boost still seems to be 20 psi, the max temp is 1200* with the Comp on 1x5. I will pressure check the air system in the morning (I mean when there is day light, and Home Depot is open for parts.



I really appreciate the inputs. I would not have known that the CLOSED position was toward the fender (only been 2 years locked open ). I'll report back when I get the pressure checked.



I'll check it further for a stock boost elbow. The 20 psi limit certainly has something to do with it.



Thanks again,



Bob Weis

 

[Idaho CTD]

If the wastegate is disabled then it shouldn't have a boost elbow at all. They are used to assist the wastegate opening.

 

[rweis]

FIRST I WANT TO THANK EVERYONE, I know it is yelling, but THANKS!!!!!



I went to Home Depot and got the 4" PVC rubber coupling, a 4" slip / threaded end, the screw plug for that, and a air hose coupling with a 1/4" NPT thread. I assembled the rubber coupling, the slip end with the threaded plug and threaded the air hose coupling into that, as I have regulated air in the bed of the truck for my USG exhaust brake.



I do have to amend the earlier threads in that I had to use 2 LARGE C clamps to keep the adapter on the turbo inlet while I was presurizing the air system. At first the adapter blew off two times. It would air seal, but not strong enough to keep it from blowing off. I got a couple of large C clamps and clamped between the turbine compressor housing and the screw in PVC plug.



I pressurized the system to 20 psi (If you have a Westach boost gauge I found that you have to turn on the accessorys to get the boost gauge to read. You would think it is a mechanical gauge, but apparently not, needs DC power). Verified the boost gauge is calibrated correctly. Soap and watered every joint, found a few leaks, easily tightened.



Took the KSB1B off and made absolutely sure the waste gate was CLOSED and LOCKED down (a little better than the bailing wire job I did this wee hours of the morning this morning).



Test drive - 33 psi, 950* WOT. An improvement over 21 psi, 1200* WOT. It (comp on 1x5) smoked a little in the first second or so from a standing start, then ran completely clear once the boost got over about 8#. An out of O/D run like I tow the 5er - accelerated unbeliveably, just the slight smoke (comp on 1x5) at first and when it got up over 20# psi in 3rd (locked in 3rd) it really tookoff.



I WANT TO THANK EVERYONE FOR THEIR INPUT AND IDEAS. TDR is truly an AMAZINE group of people!!!



If you need to pressure test your system I would be glad to loan you the adapter or give you a list of the Home Depot parts (cost was about $20).



THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, to all



Bob Weis

 

[jerrethomas]

that's what this site is all about. helping others. another job well done.

 

[SnoKing]

rweis



Try this with your Comp in EZ mode. Set it to 1x1, 2x2, 3x3, 4x4, and 5x5. As the main levels do not do anything without the wire trap, you then select the sublevel based on what main level you are set at. Seems to work on mine! SNOKING

 

[OPoole]

Your the 2nd person with the wastegate lock open Bwillard had the same problem with his B1-2 turbo

 

[I-6DZL]

Would you please list the parts and possibly the #'s that were used?? Just in case someone searches for an identical problem, they have the info right away!!!



Thanks

Curtis

 

[rweis]

Sure, I would be glad to:



parts were from Home Depot:



1@ 4" x 4' rubber coupling. HD # 018578000124 4x4flxcouplg $6. 98



Used to connect 2 each 4" PVC pipes together. Like when you had to cut a piece (less than 4" long) out of the middle of a 4" PVC pipe. This piece has a 4 1/4" ID. My KSB1B had a 4" OD compressor inlet. The rubber coupling has a hose clamp on each end. Tightening the hose clamp when the coupling is on the compressor inlet clamps it air tight to the compressor inlet housing.



1@ 4" PVC fitting that glues into a 4" PVC pipe. It slips into the ID of a 4" PVC and has screw threads on the other end to accept a 4" PVC screw in plug (like for an PVC pipe inspection plug). HD # 012871559259 fitting $4. 98.



You put this in one end of the 4" rubber flex coupling and tighten the rubber coupling's hose clamp down on it to make an air tight fit. You are then going to get a screw in plug and screw it into this piece and thread a air hose fitting into the screw in plug.



1@ 4" PVC screw in plug. HD # 012871559426 fitting $1. 98.



This is the 4" screw in PVC plug that screws into the above adapter. You are going to drill and tap this for your air hose adapter.



1@ quick release brass air hose 1/4" NPT coupler. HD # 087817620188 brass adapter $1. 49 (also comes in steel @ $1. 19)



This is what I plugged my air hose quick release hose end male coupler into. You drill the 4" screw in plug and tap it for the 1/4" NPT pipe thread coupler.



With my KSB1B, after I assembled the adapter it was real close to the alternator. I cut 1" off the rubber flex coupler to give me a little more room. Also my C clamps would not quite span the distance from the compressor housing (side towards the turbine bearings) to the 4" PVC screw in plug where I had the air coupler mounted. After cutting off the 1" of the rubber flex adapter the C clamps would span from the bearing side of the compressor housing to the 4" PVC screw in plug where the air coupler was was threaded into. Next paragraph is why I had to use C clamps.



Initially when I pressurized the adapter it did not physically hold onto the KSB1B compressor inlet when I got to 20 psi and it blew off twice. I then cut the 1" piece off the flex coupling and used 2 large C clamps to provide a physical restraint to the whole adapter to stay on the KSB1B compressor housing. I pressurized the system up to 20 psi and it held just fine, and I eventually upped the pressure to 30 psi.



I found out that the Westach boost gauge has to have DC power to read. Key to accessory position did that. I then checked my boost guage against a air pressure gauge to validate accuracy of the Westach boost guage. I pressurized the intercooler system to 30 psi as read in the Westach boost guage.



I did the soapy water squirt bottle on all air connectors. Found a few slight leaks. Tightened the Dodge air tubing spring hose clamps and stopped the leaks.



I also found out that there is some minor crank case blowby that comes out the crank case ventilation blow by bottle (I have removed my blow by bottle and extended that hose to down on the bottom of the frame on the drivers side). The reason I bring this up is I could not figuer out why the air compressor kept pushing air into the intercooler system and would occassionally run the air compressor to recharge it's tank reservoir. I could not find any leaks and was sure I had them all sealed. Then I traced it to the crank case blow by hose. I guess it is the air pressure that gets by the piston rings and dumps into the crank case.



I have read on TDR that you DO NOT want to plug the crank case breather hose up or you will blow seals somewhere, so I just left it alone. The blow by is fairly minimal. I understand as the engine wears (100k, 200k, 300k, ???) the blow by will increase.



I now have a way to easily pressure test the entire intercooler air system from Home Depot parts total cost of $15. 43



Bob Weis



THANKS AGAIN to everyone. I am one hell of a happy camper! Can hardly wait to tow the 5er next weekend.

 

[DHayden]

Glad you got it figured out and relatively cheap. Since it was asked earlier, my boost numbers with the comp turned off is 31 pounds, my max boost on 5X5 is 42. 5 pounds and my wire IS tapped.