Lorenz/kore/carli Comparison Test

[jtnm]

The nitrogen charge technically doesn't "soften" the ride, but rather keeps the shock from cavitating. When the shock is valved heavy as needed on these trucks, the actual internal piston force can over-ride the nitrogen force. What this does is create an internal air bubble for a split second, and this is where the "rough" impression comes from. Smaller diameter shocks cavitate easier at the same nitogen pressure. .



Nitrogen charge is only adjusted to prevent cavitation with heavy valving, and with a heavy truck, but on light vehicles the nitro force can have a spring rate effect and shock seal stiction. As far as we are concerned, actual internal valving changes are the only thing that can be done to really change the ride. .

Great info

How does this come into play as far as a fox steering shock or a shock similar that you would have to let nitro psi out for your truck not to pull to one side while goin down the road at recommended charge? Is it likely going to cavitate easier? I was wondering because when I ran the fox shock I had to drop the nitro to around 70 or 80 psi for the truck to drive straight down the higway and fox says to have a 200 psi charge, if having that psi would defeat the purpose of the shock or is that not going to be a factor with that type of shock?

Thanks

jtnm

 

[THUREN]

Great info

How does this come into play as far as a fox steering shock or a shock similar that you would have to let nitro psi out for your truck not to pull to one side while goin down the road at recommended charge? Is it likely going to cavitate easier? I was wondering because when I ran the fox shock I had to drop the nitro to around 70 or 80 psi for the truck to drive straight down the higway and fox says to have a 200 psi charge, if having that psi would defeat the purpose of the shock or is that not going to be a factor with that type of shock?

Thanks

jtnm

With a steering stabilizer, the actual forces usually seen are much less than are capable in a suspension shock. Problem is, a steering stabilizer MUST not cavitate, or it lets the shaft float just enough where the stabilizer is ineffective. . You need every bit of tightness in a steering stabilizer. .



I've found that about 100psi is the minimum to run in 2. 0" diameter steering stabilizer, and still have it be effective. This puts about 30lbs of force on the shaft, and about 240 actual psi on the oil itself. I prefer to run about 125psi in the stabilizers, and if it pulls a bit you can roll the driver side caster cam lobe forward about 1/8th a turn, to tune out the pull. .



I think Fox uses the 200psi number as a general valving base point in suspension shocks, but not steering stabilizers. .

 

[Buffalo]

JSellars,



Thanks for the information. That's what I was looking for. Especially, the stock tire sizes.



Also, my truck is a single rear wheel model-3500.



Joe F. (Buffalo)

 

[Tinman]

Don't for get that the aftermarket springs are a very important part of the package. It's not just shocks. They also allow for the increase front travel. Something you won't get with a puck/spacer. However, some people might not need the travel/heavier springs. I think there was post a while back about KORE having the 2. 0s for the stock springs. This might be a good option for some. The extra ride height in front does look a little fun without bigger tires. Bigger tires work good off-road, but on-road the stock tires will ride smoother, better mileage and accerate better. So what ever suits your needs is availble.

 

[kparker]

Nice job guys. Your test evaluations make sense on several levels. This is good, but it can use a little more explaining.



The Toyo AT is a much softer riding tire than the MT. Even when they are both in E rating. This would explain the difference between the Carli and the Lorenz systems. Once in the dirt 40 psi is way to high. These big trucks like lower air pressure than that. All of those trucks, regardless of load rating, would have been much nicer at 30 in the front and 25 in the rear. Those are very safe pressures off road that would make a massive difference. Had the tires been the same there probably would have been no difference in the two Bilstein equipped trucks. The truck with the softer tires wins assuming springs are comparable.



Suspension systems using the Bilstein 5100 shock are very soft on the compression side. It's digressive valving makes for a very good street ride as well as light off road. We know because we did all of the original testing and eventually Bilstein adopted our final valving specifications for their off the shelf shocks. The Bilstein 5100 will not give as controlled a feeling offroad in the bigger stuff as the Fox 2. 0. The Fox 2. 0 is a superior shock when pushed hard. Your evaluation agrees with this as well.



It's too bad there was not a KORE Recon system there so apples were apples, but it is a good comparison none the less.



Once again, great work guys, looks like you had a great time doing what these suspension systems were designed to do.



Easy on the AT@T cage fighter pose. That's funny... .



KP

 

[firemansdiesel]

Nice job guys. Your test evaluations make sense on several levels. This is good, but it can use a little more explaining.



The Toyo AT is a much softer riding tire than the MT. Even when they are both in E rating. This would explain the difference between the Carli and the Lorenz systems. Once in the dirt 40 psi is way to high. These big trucks like lower air pressure than that. All of those trucks, regardless of load rating, would have been much nicer at 30 in the front and 25 in the rear. Those are very safe pressures off road that would make a massive difference. Had the tires been the same there probably would have been no difference in the two Bilstein equipped trucks. The truck with the softer tires wins assuming springs are comparable.



Suspension systems using the Bilstein 5100 shock are very soft on the compression side. It's digressive valving makes for a very good street ride as well as light off road. We know because we did all of the original testing and eventually Bilstein adopted our final valving specifications for their off the shelf shocks. The Bilstein 5100 will not give as controlled a feeling offroad in the bigger stuff as the Fox 2. 0. The Fox 2. 0 is a superior shock when pushed hard. Your evaluation agrees with this as well.



It's too bad there was not a KORE Recon system there so apples were apples, but it is a good comparison none the less.



Once again, great work guys, looks like you had a great time doing what these suspension systems were designed to do.



Easy on the AT@T cage fighter pose. That's funny... .



KP

Thanks we appreciate the compliment. A magazine article will be coming out later in the year of the comparison.

 

[justme]

Looks like we are asked to write up a 2-3 pg. article write up w/ our pics and captions w/ Off Road Magazine. Kersten (Kore Truck) was contacted by ORM after he left a couple of messages w/ them. They were very interested and told us to write it up into an article w/ pics and captions. I will let you guys know the release date.

Great job, ensure that you let us know when the article will be released or published.

 

[jtnm]

With a steering stabilizer, the actual forces usually seen are much less than are capable in a suspension shock. Problem is, a steering stabilizer MUST not cavitate, or it lets the shaft float just enough where the stabilizer is ineffective. . You need every bit of tightness in a steering stabilizer. .



I've found that about 100psi is the minimum to run in 2. 0" diameter steering stabilizer, and still have it be effective. This puts about 30lbs of force on the shaft, and about 240 actual psi on the oil itself. I prefer to run about 125psi in the stabilizers, and if it pulls a bit you can roll the driver side caster cam lobe forward about 1/8th a turn, to tune out the pull. .



I think Fox uses the 200psi number as a general valving base point in suspension shocks, but not steering stabilizers. .

Thanks Don for the info, greatly appreciated. So basically it is valved & with the correct nitro psi it is the same equal pressure on rebound & compression either way? Reason I ask cause it seemed I had more rebound on the shock I ran causing the bump steer to be more amplyfied (steering wheel jerking harder) even when I was running lower pressure to keep the truck from pulling goin down the road. Maybe I had a problem with the shock or was not valved correct but when I put the stock shock back on the bump steer went away going over the same terrain - wash out dips across the road or when I was in a turn hitting these type of bumps. The stock seemed to have equal pressure push and pull.

jtnm

 

[Lorenz]

Any word on getting the article published?

 

[firemansdiesel]

Any word on getting the article published?

It will be coming out in January's edition. So I am assuming it will be in the stands in December (since it's usually a month ahead). It will be in Four Wheel Magazine. Not to be confused w/ Pertersons' Four Wheel Off Road Magazine. I was going to post on here when it hits the stands.



Also, Kersten is in the works to put on another suspension day this spring. There are some sponsors interested in the event (thanks to Kersten). I/we will post on the boards when there is a date and location.

 

[Lorenz]

Just got word that I have a couple mags in the mail today. It's printed and ready for the new stands!

Congratulations on getting published gentlemen. It looks good on a resume...