LORENZ vs Kore, A REAL WORLD BEATING and the RESULTS

[Skyd Ram]

Why does your truck weight so much? Isn't normal curb weight closer to 7000#

These trucks keep getting heavier. Between the extra weight of the 03-up hydro-formed frame, 6 speed Auto, 6. 7 motor, bigger Crew Cab, more accessories my truck came in at 7900 lbs totally stock with me and fuel in it. Now add some extra lbs for (5) 37" Toyo M/T's, Carli Radius arm conversion, Carli air bags, Bilstein 9100's, light bar and lights, probably 200 lbs of misc tools and crap plus the 500lb sled deck I would guess that I am around 9000 lbs. When I load up to head to our cabing to do some snowmobiling add about 400lbs for my son, wife, dog, and gear plus another 1100 lbs for the 2 sleds and I am rolling donw the road at 10500. I don't plan on jumping the truck loaded like this but I can tell you that the shock valving combined with the Long Travel air bags definitely works. And I may be considered a light used compared to what ENafziger puts his truck through. Maybe he will post some pics of him jumping train tracks and then towing a small town all the way from TN to AK and back.

 

[Skyd Ram]

This guys truck is over 11k when loaded and is running a Carli 2. 65 kit as well. They did the install at Carli in Socal and he drove out the next day for British Columbia Canada.



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[LVJUNIOR]

I running 9460# all the time even when offroading but most of mine is my heavy front bumper and flatbed. That is a nice setup he has

 

[Bob4x4]

This guys truck is over 11k when loaded and is running a Carli 2. 65 kit as well. They did the install at Carli in Socal and he drove out the next day for British Columbia Canada.



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I stopped by the shop when that CLEAN 2nd gen was on the rack. Talked to the owner for a bit and saw more of Sage's custom fab work on a 2nd gen.

Makes my old 94 look like a clapped out work truck :-laf

 

[Road Dog]

This guys truck is over 11k when loaded and is running a Carli 2. 65 kit as well. They did the install at Carli in Socal and he drove out the next day for British Columbia Canada.

Nice rig but it's hard to believe it's 11K. My 1T with a similar but slightly bigger camper is under 10K.

 

[Regcabguy]

Yeah,that 2nd with the Bigfoot is one fine setup. I don't know with all the leverage that the camper exerts on the handling that a multi-rate spring is the way to go. The soft initial rate might induce more body roll then desirable. Stiffening the initial valving might correct some of that but... ? Lots of variables there that don't exist on an unladen or loaded truck with the weight down low.



I do know that the addition of Hellwig's anti-swaybar helped with my body roll a bunch.

 

[pwerwagn]

I second the ride of the KORE kits. I don't care what their salesman says. We have 2 dodge Cummins that we chase and prerun with one has the top Kore Kit (I think it's called unlimited) and the other has a cheap Skyjacker kit with double front shocks. I am not usually a fan of Skyjacker but it has been flawless for 140,000 miles not counting replacing the shocks. I definately would like to upgrade to the Fox shocks on it. The Kore kit beats the crap out of us and has had to be overhauled 3 times in the last 2 years. The springs are so stiff we have actually had the suspension mounts crack. The heims failed as well. I guess we must not know how to drive off road good enough to use a KORE system properly but with Baja 1000, Baja 2000 and Mint 400 podium finishes under our belts I figured we would qualify.

What is the Baja 2000? Is that the white truck that has the DRC logo on the doors? "GR8 White" or something on the plate?

But yes... I agree. I have the older KORE "Race" with 2. 5's. I have spent a lot of time revalving Kores "dodge" valving (which on my truck was simply a stack of . 012's for compression and . 010's... on front). I played with flutter stacking and stuff and soon found out you cant make 2. 5" fox's work "right" under these trucks. I had to have parts machined to adapt parts from another brand shock to my fox's (Im not going to elaborate because it was Thurens idea... and im not sure he wants it spread around)... but I've been lazy and haven't ever got to the point of installing those parts.

For sure... but ACVs are supposed to help out ALOT with this as well. The valving ramps up with shaft velocity.



I plan on sending my 2. 65s in for the latest valving and ACV upgrade within the next few months.



--Eric

Perhaps a new G56 would be a better idea? Lol... just givin ya crap.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AEdelheit

Either way if you want to hit anything with speed you really need a truss, these AAM's dont hold up well to big hits.





With a CTD

Carli's Hemi truck is still untrussedand straight. It is also a very plush ride and still goes over anything at speed

Oo. Im only on my 3rd front axle. They arent THAT weak... wait... yeah... they are.

I spoke with my shock guy at the race this weekend about my truck. He said stay away from the bilstein shocks they are junk. He said the King shocks are way overpriced and the Fox shocks actually perform better than the Kings. He recommended going with a 2. 5 minimum but a 3 would be preferred due to the weight. He buys over $90k worth of shocks every year and usually orders them unassembled so he can put a better valving setup in them.

Like I mentioned above... 2. 5" fox's cannot be valved "easily" correctly (I guess correctly is relative) for the front of our trucks. BUT I do have to say this. I have had Kings, Fox's, SAW's and FOA's. The only brand of shocks Ive ever owned/dealt with that I have never seen a leak on is the FOX's. My 2. 5's are still all original seals and they have over 100K on them, and there has NEVER been a hint of a leak. My class 7 ranger has Kings... and 3 of them have leaked. One leaked before the truck ever even rolled out of the garage. Our old Class 10 car had Fox C/O's and bypasses at all corners... and again, dry as a bone. The FOA's we had did leak, but they were one of the first sets sold and we put them on a 10 car. Im not holding it against them, I hear they are better now.

I have never heard anything but good about bilstein however. I would run them in a heartbeat. The 7100's are one of the best values in a shock available, IMO.

 

[LVJUNIOR]

What is the Baja 2000? Is that the white truck that has the DRC logo on the doors? "GR8 White" or something on the plate?... .



... . The only brand of shocks Ive ever owned/dealt with that I have never seen a leak on is the FOX's. ... ... .

Officially the Baja 1000 was called the Baja 2000 (1726 miles) for the year 2000.



I am almost positive it is the "great white" truck. It was a magazine truck when it was built. We have renamed it the white rhino since it performs the duties the rhino used to.



I think you have been lucky on the Fox's not leaking. We have had a few leaks on the foxes on the truck and every once in a while on of the class 1 cars shocks will leak a little (I found out if you take a rock at 110mph the will leak a lot) We have beat the heck out of the fox's on the race car and had zero issues besides the aforementioned rock and have a 100% finish rate

 

[pwerwagn]

Officially the Baja 1000 was called the Baja 2000 (1726 miles) for the year 2000.



I am almost positive it is the "great white" truck. It was a magazine truck when it was built. We have renamed it the white rhino since it performs the duties the rhino used to.



I think you have been lucky on the Fox's not leaking. We have had a few leaks on the foxes on the truck and every once in a while on of the class 1 cars shocks will leak a little (I found out if you take a rock at 110mph the will leak a lot) We have beat the heck out of the fox's on the race car and had zero issues besides the aforementioned rock and have a 100% finish rate

If its the one that has the DRC emblems on the doors, solteks, tire gate etc, I'm sure it is the same truck. I actually checked that truck out a few years ago, at the time it was a twin to mine except mine has walkers (now they are a lot different). When I saw it, it had toyo A/T's though.



You are probably right on the luck with the fox's, but it is what it is. In fact, my exhaust even dumps on the right rear fox... and still no leaks (and I tow a lot and heavy). I always wished I had kings on it, which is why I put them on the 7 truck. I haven't been super happy with them thus far however.



Im building another prerunner/chase truck right now and I am going to give FOA's another shot on this one.

 

[LVJUNIOR]

If its the one that has the DRC emblems on the doors, solteks, tire gate etc, I'm sure it is the same truck. I actually checked that truck out a few years ago, at the time it was a twin to mine except mine has walkers (now they are a lot different). When I saw it, it had toyo A/T's though.



You are probably right on the luck with the fox's, but it is what it is. In fact, my exhaust even dumps on the right rear fox... and still no leaks (and I tow a lot and heavy). I always wished I had kings on it, which is why I put them on the 7 truck. I haven't been super happy with them thus far however.



Im building another prerunner/chase truck right now and I am going to give FOA's another shot on this one.

Yes it does have billit DRC badges on it. I finally got him to junk the Toyo's. I hated driving it with them on it. He switched it to the 37x12. 50 BFG KM2's and the ride and handling is greatly improved. The tire gate is long gone and it has a stock tailgate on it. The front bumper is in the scrap pile and a new custom unit is in its place with a winch you can see it in the pics. He also fabed a chase rack in the bed to hold a few tires. We have been working on trying to get it to live without having to rebuild the front end every 6 months.



The only reason I can see whatsoever to buy king shocks is to get Carli's valving and custom piston they designed for our trucks. It is also easier to get a custom length short stroke shock made through them but then it's really going to cost you.



I considered FOA for a while but I left many messages and sent emails and never got a call back so I figured if I ever had a problem I would be screwed anyway. Their customer service leaves a lot to be desired. Their address on their website was a Vegas address but when I drove by it was a vacant area in a strip mall. I haven't heard much good about them. Most people compare them to swayaway

 

[pwerwagn]

I've talked to Chris at FOA numerous times... never had them not answer! But I do hear that from quite a few people. They were great with our last set, replaced parts instantly everytime.
Fox shims are cheaper than king. But I hear of a lot more of them breaking and u need a lot more of them under the front of our trucks than u will king shims.

Strange about the toyos. I've never ran the AT's, but my toyo mt's drive way better and last longer than my KM2's did. But I tow a LOT so maybe that's why (bfgs were D).

 

[pwerwagn]

Nice rig but it's hard to believe it's 11K. My 1T with a similar but slightly bigger camper is under 10K.

How heavy is your camper?? My 98 with my old 10'8" lance was 10,850 lbs ready to roll. Took 100+ psi in the bags to almost level it.

 

[LVJUNIOR]

I've talked to Chris at FOA numerous times... never had them not answer! But I do hear that from quite a few people. They were great with our last set, replaced parts instantly everytime.

Fox shims are cheaper than king. But I hear of a lot more of them breaking and u need a lot more of them under the front of our trucks than u will king shims.



Strange about the toyos. I've never ran the AT's, but my toyo mt's drive way better and last longer than my KM2's did. But I tow a LOT so maybe that's why (bfgs were D).

I tow about 25% of the time and run 9500# empty I have had the current set of KM2's on for about 30k including over 4k in the dirt. I am just now past the siping which theoretically is around 50% but is farther than I would like to run them. The toyo's were getting about 20k till they were almost bald. They also took ruts in the road really poorly. I couldn't convince him to change until he wore out his second set and I was still running my same tires

 

[Road Dog]

How heavy is your camper?? My 98 with my old 10'8" lance was 10,850 lbs ready to roll. Took 100+ psi in the bags to almost level it.

It's a 10' Somerset and empty it's 1,000kg (2,200#). Empty it just touches the overloads on my 1T. No need for airbags.

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[AEdelheit]

It is also easier to get a custom length short stroke shock made through them but then it's really going to cost you.

Through Thuren I have 12" travel King 2. 5's front and rear, they are threaded bodies so the top cap threads externally and a few other tricks to get the 12"s of travel.

 

[pwerwagn]

I tow about 25% of the time and run 9500# empty I have had the current set of KM2's on for about 30k including over 4k in the dirt. I am just now past the siping which theoretically is around 50% but is farther than I would like to run them. The toyo's were getting about 20k till they were almost bald. They also took ruts in the road really poorly. I couldn't convince him to change until he wore out his second set and I was still running my same tires

Cool. My buddy wants KM2's but was afraid to get them with my bad experience. Maybe I'll tell him to give them a shot. I did get over 30k out of mine... but I got just shy of 50k out of my first set of toyos and I'm at about 39k on this set and they still look good

 

[LVJUNIOR]

Through Thuren I have 12" travel King 2. 5's front and rear, they are threaded bodies so the top cap threads externally and a few other tricks to get the 12"s of travel.

I have talked to Don. What a great guy. Very knowledgable and not pretentious at all. I wish his shop was closer. I could see myself doing lots of business with him. At these fuel prices I could buy a pair of shocks with the money I would spend in fuel.

 

[AMcCormick]

Those extra two inches could mean keeping a tire on the ground. Eventually I will upgrade, hopefully next year with either Thuren or Carli parts. Possibly a further combo. It seems like Don and the Carli guys have the valving figured out for these trucks. Doesn't Don do some different layout in the back as well to get 14 inches using the normal mounting points. I like the idea of getting 12 in the front and a much cheaper tower. I also like the tower brace Carli uses.

 

[AEdelheit]

Those extra two inches could mean keeping a tire on the ground. Eventually I will upgrade, hopefully next year with either Thuren or Carli parts. Possibly a further combo. It seems like Don and the Carli guys have the valving figured out for these trucks. Doesn't Don do some different layout in the back as well to get 14 inches using the normal mounting points. I like the idea of getting 12 in the front and a much cheaper tower. I also like the tower brace Carli uses.

Well in the rear since the shocks arnt mounted completely vertical you will get more then 12" of travel though I dont know exactly how much, but both Don and Carli use stock mounting points unless you do Dons cantilever setup then you can pull around 18" in the rear. Well the only other difference is Dons short 12's like I have, I dont know how long of a shock Carli uses in the rear. Im actually doing my front limit straps today and stainless steel brake lines since the front are really too short with those 12's.

 

[AMcCormick]

I think that he uses some custom shock body lay out that King does for him with the bypass body shock to get 14 inches of travel