New Cummins Exhaust Gas Recirculation system

[John_M]

I believe this is the first info available to the public about the new Cummins/Fleetgurd Exhaust Gas Recirculation system which will be installed on the Cummins Diesel starting January 1, 2004.



http://www.cummins.com/na/pages/en/....cfm?uuid=000E7A79-1AA3-1EFB-91BA80C4A8F00000



Cheers,



John_M

 

[DBVZ]

I don't think so. This is not about exhaust gas at all. It is crank case oil mist collection, from blow-by, to prevent the escape of the oil out of the pan. EGR is a whole different thing.

 

[John_M]

Oops! Thanks for the correction, DBVZ. My posting this link indicates how little I know about Diesel technology. Sorry about the screw-up!



Cheers,



John_M

 

[RM]

if you want to learn more about egr go to this web site and surf around. theres quite a bite of information on the site as well as a video on egr. also it says with vgt there will be a engine braking effect. i think the 2004 will have vgt with it. im waiting to order a 2004 ho i hope in california. heres the site http://www.tougheststandards/cummins.com

 

[DLeno]

Here is a cumming article hyping EGR

 

[DLeno]

that would be cummins. seems that all the information on tougheststandards. cummins.com site has to do with the the ISX engine, not the ISB?

 

[RM]

www.tougheststandards.cummins.com

if you go on the site hit medium trucks and a side bar comes up for isb. hit that and it takes you to isb site hit emissions down on right and it pops up as ism but over on right it has isb. hit that and it comes up a news article about the isb has cooled egr added on and other things also the say it has vgt on over 265 horse and if you look around a video on vgt and cooled egr. they make you work for it but i found it all on there also i think i put a slash in the url and its suppose to be a period. sorry

 

[DLeno]

thanks. thats not a bad article. what I'd like to know is with respect to boming, what is the affect of the cooled EGR? According to the article the new EGR cummins engines have slightly improved economy, not poorer economy. that doesn't mean EGR is good, necessarily, as the increased soot levels show. And I have no argument with the "old technology" point either, and the fact that EGR is probably a short term solution to meet emmisions standards until they can do so without EGR. I'm just saying that all the "sky is falling" talk about poor performance becasue of EGR isn't all true.



What I do wonder about is the fueling box guys like Edge. their challenges are getting tougher the more junk they load into these engines and the more complex the fueling algorithms are.



Didn't take them long to come out with an 03 box. but if there is a "no egr" early 04 truck that has the new turbo, and then EGR comes out later, then we have a narrow niche "early 94" truck that might require special software different from the 03s and different from the 04s with EGR. So this is just conjecture but it seems to me that those with early 04s might have trouble finding a fueling box. I'd love to be wrong about that though. anyone know?

 

[jjdiesel]

no troubles... they will crank out the fueling boxes for every truck. The fueling parameters change all the time as each year they up the hp a little bit. Was the same way with the 2nd gen trucks.

 

[R.E. Miller]

The main reason that it is difficult to find info on the medium range engines is because Cummins is focused on delivering the heavy duty engines with zero down time for the customers. I work on these engines everyday, and can say that the egr engines are really running good. There are issues of course, but all are minor and under constant scrutiny. The facts on how well the new egr system launch went are very, very good. Remember, egr is not new in theory, does decrease economy slightly, and the new ecms and vgt's make the trucks a real blast to drive. Finally, EGR is not ACERT, ACERT is scary, and seems to be thrown together. I like and respect Cat, but Cummins proven base engines have egr added to them, Cat changed everything. Although few like the idea of egr (me included) it seems to be the best answer right now.



Russell

 

[A Johnson]

I think everyone is pleasantly surprised at how well EGR is working out on the Cummins products.



I for one, am a big convert when it comes to the emission control requirements. I just wish we could get away from burning fossil fuels. Not necessarily to not burn fossil fuels, but to at least make a statement to the rest of the world that we don't need their oil. Whether it would do any good is up for debate I suppose.



A Johnson

 

[Floor It]

The last talk with a cummins rep said that the EGR system was not offically been said to be on the 04's. Due to the cost of it chrysler did not want to pay for. They are really looking in to a type of catalitic convertor instead of EGR. So who know's until the 04's start rolling of the lines, AFTER january 1 ,04'.



John

 

[DLeno]

sure seems like the early 2004s will be sweet. before EGR or a cat, that is.



I'm just a little heasitant about the VG turbos though. I mean, with respect to bombing. suppose you mash it, while the turbo is operating with a small housing. It might spin up faster than its VG can respond. sounds like an easy way to blow up a turbo. and the new VGs are going to be expensive too.

 

[Floor It]

I agree,I dont think that I would ever want a VGT, EVER! They are expensive and as fast as I want my motor to respond and rev, I think the VGT is too risky!



John

 

[R.E. Miller]

The Holeset VGT design is not new, and has been around in one form or another for years. Trust it, for it is the best design out there period. Bombing a VGT will be ok providing that the VGT actuator, parameters (based on compressor and turbine specs), fueling, boost, egt, engine speed, vehicle speed, ambient and intake air temps, and other things are all accounted for and molded into the program language to make it all work. Bombing with cheap parts will not result in good things, but the possibilities are infinite with quality R&D.



Russell

 

[DLeno]

thats a good point. what it means probably is that the fueling boxes will need more careful R&D and that we should give mfgr's plenty of time to come to a reliable solution and to prove that the turbo is managed probably.

 

[FATCAT]

Something to think about for EGR ...

I know that with the EGR used in the VW TDI's that unless you get the communications software package to turn "off" the EGR, you will get a gunked up Manifold after many thousand miles (40, 50, 60K or so I hear).



Also, if the EG is introduced into the system prior to the Intercooler, now you will have an oily mess in the Intercooler's hoses and intercooler itself ... this would be VERY BAD news.



It would be nice if someone could make some product to put into the intake that would clean out the oil mess from EGR and blow it

out the exhaust.



I would hope that if Cummins introduces EGR into their engines, we (the consumers) can get a hold of the computer software (like VW owners can do with the VAGCOM software), and "turn-off" the EGR in order to save the engine over time.

 

[ab7fh]

Re: Something to think about for EGR ...

Originally posted by FATCAT

I know that with the EGR used in the VW TDI's that unless you get the communications software package to turn "off" the EGR, you will get a gunked up Manifold after many thousand miles (40, 50, 60K or so I hear).



Also, if the EG is introduced into the system prior to the Intercooler, now you will have an oily mess in the Intercooler's hoses and intercooler itself ... this would be VERY BAD news.



It would be nice if someone could make some product to put into the intake that would clean out the oil mess from EGR and blow it

out the exhaust.



I would hope that if Cummins introduces EGR into their engines, we (the consumers) can get a hold of the computer software (like VW owners can do with the VAGCOM software), and "turn-off" the EGR in order to save the engine over time.

I'm going through this right now with my TDI at 70,000 miles. The intake manifold was blocked with about a half pound of carbon. I'm not exaggerating.



I've yet to clean the intercooler and I have an appointment with a guy with a VAG-COM to adjust my EGR valve.



I already performed the PCV mod so I'm no longer sucking in blow by gases at least.

 

[FATCAT]

ab7fh



What is the PCV Mod???? I have'nt check yet on the TDIClub page, but what did you do to the PCV?



As yet, I only have 18,000 on my 2003 Jetta. I would like to have the VAGCOM mod on my EGR, but since I have 32,000 left on the warrenty ... I'm kinda of skiddish on making any changes that would give VW a reason to give me the boot on anything that might come up before the 50K mark.

 

[ab7fh]

Originally posted by FATCAT

ab7fh



What is the PCV Mod???? I have'nt check yet on the TDIClub page, but what did you do to the PCV?



As yet, I only have 18,000 on my 2003 Jetta. I would like to have the VAGCOM mod on my EGR, but since I have 32,000 left on the warrenty ... I'm kinda of skiddish on making any changes that would give VW a reason to give me the boot on anything that might come up before the 50K mark.

From what I understand the EGR mod won't void your warranty since it doesn't completely shut off the EGR it sets it to the bottom of it's limit in the range of accepted specs.



The PCV mod is easy. Just run a 3/4" heater hose out of the valve cover and down to the bottom of the chassis. Block off the opening where the PCV tube originally hooked up to on that little solenoid. Mine is setup with a breather filter attached to a T in the line. Below the filter is about 18" more hose and the bottom is sealed with a bolt. That way the tube will vent vapors to the atmosphere and any excess oil will collect in the tube so it can be drained. Sorta like the CTD setup on my '01.