New Toyota Turbo diesel set to lead the class

[y-knot]

As reported in the December issue of Motor Trend, Toyota is hard at work on a Turbo diesel for a heavy duty version of the 400N. The new 2007 Full size pickup the Japanese automaker will build in San Antonio, Texas, beginning in 2006. The goal for the engine is to make 390 horsepower and 700 pound-feet of torque. Aisin, a company in which Toyota holds a stake in, may be called upon to build the stout transmission. The 2007 400N is a major reworking of the Tundra standard and extended cabs, previewed by the 2004 FTX show model. The double cab will get it own full redo in 2009.



I think a major player like Toyota will build a heck of a diesel powered truck, I have no doubts that it will be every bit as reliable as the Cummins, they have never built anything half assed. This new truck is every bit as large as the current Dodge, and will offer the buying consumer a valid 4th choice while contemplating the purchase of a heavy duty diesel powered full size truck. Ford seems to be ahead of the big truck market right now, but Dodge and Chevy are not. Maybe the extra competition will inspire Dodge to make the changes it needs to stay competitive? Hope so.

 

[RustyJC]

Let's see if they offer a dually with a 26,000 GCWR and about 13,000 or better GVWR for us 5th wheel pullers.



Rusty

 

[CATCRACKER]

thanks for heads up y. i am glad others are getting on the diesel bandwagon. how much you figure it will cost? 43-46K. ?

 

[CATCRACKER]

its my understanding that it will not be long before nissan has diesel option also.

 

[gonzo2]

Maybe the extra competition will inspire Dodge to make the changes it needs to stay competitive? Hope so.

Actually the Dodge still represents the closest thing to what I want in a pickup. If that doesn't coincide with what the majority of buyers think they want, it is quite fine with me.



I have no desire to drive what everyone else is driving, and if Dodge is not selling number one, I actually prefer it as long as they make what I want.



There are still a few minor improvements I would like to see made but, overall, I figure we get a pretty good package. If the competition brings on a few things I like or want then that's great.

 

[y-knot]

I personally like to see other manufacturers enter the diesel wars, I like the competition and see it as healthy for the industry. Toyota has a reputation of producing high quality cars and trucks, so I see no reason to think this diesel won't be class leading in both quality of construction and in efficiency. The horsepower and torque figures would put them right in the mix and I would not be surprises to see them come out with an industry leading 5- or 6-speed automatic. The company they have working on it is well know for HD truck and car trany's.

I do not feel threatened by the introduction of a Toyota diesel, but I think it will be fun to see what happens. Toyota had to build an all new V-8 just to go NASCAR truck racing, and it's kicking but this year. Same goes for the Indy cars, they have a very solid engine. I can not think of anything Toyota has produced that can be called bad, or not well engineered? Many have said they would like a pickup with the reliability of a Toyota and the power of a Cummins, well this might just be your chance?

On the price end, I don't think it would be any higher then the current Fords, Chevrolet's or Dodges. They will wont to come into the market competitive.

 

[nickleinonen]

aisin already makes some good auto trannies in 4, 5 and 6 speeds. there have been rumors on allpar that DC is going to get an aisin 6 speed auto... if toyota gets it, DC is going to look bad...

 

[QRTRHRS]

I think a major player like Toyota will build a heck of a diesel powered truck, I have no doubts that it will be every bit as reliable as the Cummins, they have never built anything half assed.

I don't agree with that thought. I can tell you at least two examples of Toyota truck problems on new model entries. Admittedly, the last Toyota truck I had was an 88' so it's been awhile. Anyway, when they first introduced the 4x4, the transfer case had problems that were expensive to fix. The diesel pickup? What little torque the non turbo slug made was to much for the transmission. Like any maker foreign or domestic, Toyota did not exactly stand behind the product without a bit of prodding. They did issue a recall for the latter but made no effort to contact owners who had purchased used.

 

[RHARVEY]

My dad has an 85 Toyota Diesel 2wd that has nearly 250k on it. Its a non turbo version but it still gets around great for all those miles on it. It sounds like a little garden tractor running...

He bought it in Hot Springs Arkansas brand new . . and according to the saleman it was the very first and the last one sold in the state. .



Rick

 

[gonzo2]

I personally like to see other manufacturers enter the diesel wars, I like the competition and see it as healthy for the industry.

I agree, I'm sure the reason the CTD's have come so far in 15 years is a direct result of competition. I just don't care if Dodge sells more trucks than the other brands. I usually find that the real mass market appeal brands (take Mcdonalds burgers, for instance) aren't for me anyway.



When a buddy buys a Ford, Chevy or Toyota that's fine with me. If everyone drove Dodges, they would probably lose some of their appeal to me. It would Also get awfully boring b. s. ing around the Campsite. :-laf



It is going to be very interesting to see how the Diesel truck market develops over the next few years.

 

[DPelletier]

I agree that the competition is a good thing. Like Rusty, I'm waiting to see if they actually offer a 8' box, DRW, and at least 12000 lbs GVWR and 23,000 GCWR; Personally I doubt it, but we'll see.

One thing is for sure: the new Toyota will cost AT LEAST 50% more than the equivalent Dodge. A new Tundra can be up to $48,000 Canadian and for reference my truck listed for $53,160 and I paid $47,000. Toyota (and the other Japanese manufacturers) have always been much less willing to "deal" in my experience and usually don't offer competitive financing packages. I bought my truck for 0% over 48mo. If the Tundra ( a light duty little truck) costs around the same as my 1 ton dually diesel pickup, you can rest assured that thier larger HD diesel will cost significantly more $'s.



my 2 cents.



Dave

 

[y-knot]

Well to be honest there is no sense comparing 1980's models to the 2005 and 2006 models, the sharp difference in time makes any argument pointless. What was Dodge doing in 1988?? Producing the lowest number of pickups sold in America and holding on to a design that had been around for over 10 years. That isn't the case now for Dodge and Toyota sells three times the amount of cars and trucks Dodge does.

Want to know who has the highest rated Truck sold in America according to Consumer Reports? Toyota And for the record, Dodge has never made it to the number one or two spot. Don't get all twisted up, I obviously like Dodge, but the facts are the facts. Cummins has also never made it too the top of any list of most trouble free engines. So as good as we like to think out Dodge/Cummins setup is, their is plenty of room for improvement.

Toyota makes several small diesel engines, but they don't show up over here, just as many diesel engine power plants used in Europe don't make it over here. In Europe, 50% of all the cars are diesel were over here it is less then 5%, so I can see we have much to learn from the foreign country's.

Yes the Nissan was reported not that long ago about coming out with a diesel for their trucks, but I have not heard anything lately. I hope they continue along with their plans. Also, Honda allowed the Saturn to use their V-6 with the understanding that they would allow Honda to use one of their diesel engines, the diesel was slatted to debut in 2006 for Honda??



I really get jazzed up with all the new diesels coming out, I smile every time I hear some little car clanking along under diesel power, until now that always meant hearing a VW. The liberty is also suppose to start diesel production eerily into 2005.

 

[HoleshotHolset]

That's good news. Toyota does not mess around when it comes to designing things.



390/700? If that's true... it's going to be a stout running little beast!



I just hope it doesn't have a timing belt...



Matt

 

[klenger]

I remeber back in the 70's/80's Datsun had a 1 ton truck mini-pickup. I think that 1-ton to them ment that it had a GVWR of 2000 lbs.



I suspect that what the Japan considers to be a HD truck and what we consider to be a HD truck are very different. Time will tell.

 

[NVR FNSH]

Wasn't it a Nissan I-6 diesel that IH put in the Scout II in the early '80s?



I'd love to see Toyota & Nissan build a truck comparable/better than the Dodge/Ford/Chevy diesels.



Brian

 

[Todd G]

Doesn't Toyota make the Hino brand of trucks? I know Nissan makes UD. Both have diesels similar to our Cummins.

 

[LightmanE300]

Toyota is not as 100% trouble free as some of you seem to believe, and it's not limited to older models. They have recently had MAJOR engineering issues, and have spent many millions of dollars fixing their sludged v6's. The engine was in camrys and many other models, and they have had to replace engines and extend warranties due to their jackass engineeering on that product. The way people talk about Toyota is the same way ATV'ers talk about Hondas - like they are immune to problems due to their superior design. Yep, I've pulled out more than a few hondas from the trail after they've broken down, and toyotas have problems too - thats why they have repair facilities, not just quick oil change places at Toyota dealers...



I agree the more diesels the better though!!

 

[DPelletier]

Cummins has also never made it too the top of any list of most trouble free engines. So as good as we like to think out Dodge/Cummins setup is, their is plenty of room for improvement.

Wrong,

There was just such a list posted a week or so ago. The Cummins was at the top of the list. Where it should be. Honestly, there isn't "plenty of room for improvement" with the Cummins engine. Just how much more reliable, powerful or long lived should they be. I dare you to find even one such engine used in any other passenger vehicle.



Ken is right, the Japanese idea of HD and America's idea of HD are two totally different things. I strongly suspect that any Toyota/Nissan diesel will be lighter duty and VERY expensive. There will be no solid axles, cast iron transmissions, 11. 5" ring gears or 1200 lb engines, I can tell you that.



Dave

 

[Tcolesanti]

One more thing to consider will the consumer be "allowed" to mount a snow plow to this new "superyota"??? I know for a fact doing so to a Tundra will void the warranty as Toyota states the frames will crack.

 

[nickleinonen]

... cast iron transmissions...

dodge is loosing that too come the 05. 5 model year... goodbye nv5600, hello getrag g56