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Observations: HX-40 & Moderate Fueling

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HEMI®Dart

TDR MEMBER
Installed my HX-40 and ATS Pulse Exhaust Manifold today. A guesstimate my truck has about 310/730 Flywheel HP & Torque. I am running the light AFC spring. Note signature for specifics.

Things I noticed on my 20 mile testdrive:

1. ) I maybe have 10% more turbo lag than an HX-35 12cm2. Maybe less. The throttle is not as responsive at low boost levels. You'll need to push the throttle slightly further to get the same result as a 35 at low rpm/boost levels. What LITTLE you lose in low rpm power, you get it back 10 fold in the mid & upper RPM range. There is not a flat spot. No big deal. A couple of clicks tighter on the governer spring retainers and I should have most of it back.

2. ) EGT's are the same crusing on the highway at 65 MPH. Boost won't register on my 0-50 psi gauge. Maybe 1 or 2 psi @ 65 mph.

3. ) Exhaust is louder, at idle that "airy" sound is gone. A deep pitched tone bellows from the exhaust tip. The turbo has a different noise than the 35. The whine is not as high pitched. You can tell by the sound the turbo is larger. Still sounds neat though. Engine seems to idle a little smoother too.

4. ) No more or less smoke than the 35 at low boost levels when you put your foot into it.

5. ) Boost comes VERY QUICKLY. It comes in ALOT faster than with a HX-35 12cm2. I went from 5 psi to 45 psi boost in about a second at 3/4 throttle. The little Bosch 215's seem to spool up the turbo fine. Will adjust wastegate to dump boost @ 40 psi.

6. )IMO, Truck sounds different and takes on a new personality at mid and upper rpm range with less backpressure. Gone is that hissing like noise that you get with an HX-35 at high boost levels. Like the exhaust is corked up. There is gobs of torque in the mid & upper rpm range. Unbeliveable!. Even with mild Bosch 215 injectors.

7. ) I couldn't get my EGT to go over 900º.


Overall very happy with the new 40 & ATS exhaust manifold. #ad


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Bill R
94 2500 SLT 4x4 5 Speed, 3. 54 LS, JRE 4" exhaust, Autometer Pyro, Boost & Water temp gauges, Bosch 215 HP injectors, Timing @ 14. 7º, JRE Stage III #4 plate 270/675, AFC spring kit, High performance delivery valves, Piers prepped HX-40, Governer spring kit, ATS Pulse exhaust manifold, Scotty Air, Bully Dog Propane Injection, Roadmaster Active Suspension, Optima Red Tops, Geno's Exhaust Blanket, Espar Heater (won it!), Synthetic lubes throughout.



[This message has been edited by HEMI®Dart (edited 05-03-2001). ]
 
Hemi,

Nice post. Keep us (or me at least) posted on driving impressions as you get more time behind the wheel.

You and I have been playing leap frog during the past year or so with bombing our trucks. The information you post really helps my decision making.

I'm still debating if I should go with an HX-40 or dive right into twins.

What do you mean by:
There is not a flat spot. No big deal. A couple of clicks tighter on the governer spring retainers and I should have most of it back.


Thanks,
-Chris
 
Hemi what happened to your 370 injectors? I'll bet they'll take care of your bottom end.

[This message has been edited by drawson (edited 04-28-2001). ]
 
HEMI:

Thanks for the great report on the HX-40!

I am getting ready to put one on my truck
also. All the problems with the broken
shafts kind of concerned me some. Is your
HX-40 "stock" other than "re-clocking" etc?
Also what size housing do you have on the
HX-40?

Thanks again for your report and advice!

-------
John_P

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Red '96 4x4 2500 Auto 3. 54, TST #5, Major Pump Mods(By "Scheid Diesel") 370 Diamond B Injectors, Gov. Spring kit, AFC Spring kit, Banks Exhaust, Prime Loc, Cummins Chrome Kit,Psychotty Air Filter, Pro-Torque Converter, BD Valve Body, BD Pressure Loc, Isspro Gauges, Sendel 16" Alum Wheels w/ 33" BFGs
 
Originally posted by HEMI®Dart:

7. ) I couldn't get my EGT to go over 900º.


Hemi,
What were your exhaust temps before? Do you measure temp in the manifold? I have been kicking around the idea of going to a bigger turbo but I don't want to lose the exhaust brake. I get to 1500 now in just a couple seconds.
Steve

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1998 2500 Quad Cab, 12V, 5spd, 4x4, HD Transfer Case, 370HP Diamond B Injectors, #4 TST, 16cm2 Housing, AFC Spring Kit, BD Governor Spring Kit and other governor modifications, Walker Muffler, 285/75-16 BFG AT's, Stainless Steel Tube Steps, Reese Fifth Wheel Hitch, Leather, CD, LSD Dana 80 Rear, 60 Front, McLeod Dual Disc Clutch, Rancho RS9000 Shocks, Rancho Steering Stabilizer, ATS Exhaust Manifold, Psychotty Air Induction, BD Exhaust Brake, Enterprise Engine Delivery Valves
 
Strick-9,

I had to back off my governer spring retainers because of a real touchy throttle off idle. Now with less boost and back pressure at low end, maybe I can go a few clicks tighter and see what happens. Not sure if it will make any difference. If you could get the twins at a decent price, by all means try them. There are a few members putting together a twin turbo package. This might be worth looking into. Dave Mitchells $4,000 twin turbo kit was not worth looking into. #ad



drawson,

I ended up selling them. Wanted to try the DD III's instead. After I read Joe D's thread on the DD injectors. Tough call on which way to go. I'll bet a stronger injector would cure the low end too. #ad


John,


I had Majestic balance & lighten the turbo blades and turn the compressor side so the OE intake hose would slide right on. It seems the 2 or 3 turbos Majestic did early, they clipped the vanes. This might have contributed to early failure. Piers had an HX-40 with a larger shaft and it still broke at 45 psi boost. I have not gave the truck full throttle yet. Still a little apprehensive myself. #ad
I have the 16cm2 exhaust housing.

Dieselburner,

I could hit about 1,100 degrees before the HX-40 on an all out run. Never really had a high EGT problem. I didn't give the truck full throtle to see the max egt. An HX-40 will drop egt by about 250 degrees. This has been documented. My pump is not as strong as yours. Whith some big injectors, that would probably change. My pyro is in the exhaust manifold.

------------------
Bill R
94 2500 SLT 4x4 5 Speed, 3. 54 LS, JRE 4" exhaust, Autometer Pyro, Boost & Water temp gauges, Bosch 215 HP injectors, Timing @ 14. 7º, JRE Stage III #4 plate 270/675, AFC spring kit, High performance delivery valves, Piers prepped HX-40, Governer spring kit, ATS Pulse exhaust manifold, Scotty Air, Bully Dog Propane Injection, Roadmaster Active Suspension, Optima Red Tops, Geno's Exhaust Blanket, Espar Heater (won it!), Synthetic lubes throughout.



[This message has been edited by HEMI®Dart (edited 04-29-2001). ]
 
I got most of the low end power back by turning the no-load fuel screw on the rear of the AFC housing in a couple of turns. It was just touching the diaphram.

IMO: Very little difference, if any in turbo lag between the HX-40 16cm2 & HX-35 12cm2.

BTW: It was nice working on the right side of the engine for a change. Lots of room to work. #ad


------------------
Bill R
94 2500 SLT 4x4 5 Speed, 3. 54 LS, JRE 4" exhaust, Autometer Pyro, Boost & Water temp gauges, Bosch 215 HP injectors, Timing @ 14. 7º, JRE Stage III #4 plate 270/675, AFC spring kit, High performance delivery valves, Piers prepped HX-40, Governer spring kit, ATS Pulse exhaust manifold, Scotty Air, Bully Dog Propane Injection, Roadmaster Active Suspension, Optima Red Tops, Geno's Exhaust Blanket, Espar Heater (won it!), Synthetic lubes throughout.
 
Hemi,,You say you noticed a difference in the low end power(gone) before you adjusted the no load screw with the HX40 and a loss of boost pressure in the lower rpm range,,So my question to the panel here is,If the only advantage to the HX40 is egt temps and you need to run into the rpm stratosphere now to make power with a engine designed not to,has anyone got a legitimate answer as to what other benefits it has?(hx40 with a 16cm vs hx35 with a 16cm),,Reason I ask is these engines we run and all love are designed to perform in the 1400 to 2800 rpm range WITHOUT major problems,,I use a hx35 housing with a 16cm exhaust and have not seen critical temps to warrant the change,,Realizing that these engines were designed to run in the above rpm range also means they will not encounter the dreaded valve float problems,,Yes I know guys are using the exhaust brake springs on both sides to control valve float at higher rpm,but it is a proven fact once float is encountered,the ONLY way to stop it is by bringing the engine back to an idle(it a proven fact and can be backed by the Superflow dyno sheets off race motors we have dyno'd in the past),,Reason I put is to examine if it is a worthy purchase or not,,Having just had mine tied up to check power(344. 5 hp at 2350 rpm and 848. 4 ft lbs of torque at 1850 rpm) and never twisting it past 2800 one would wonder why the need to twist these things exisists,,There are alot of owners that would love to make the big power in the rpm range and most of us are daily driver trucks we depend on,,All of my pulls showed a drop in the power and torque the more it was twisted so I do not understand the hx40 choice,Can this be explained??,,Sorry I'm so windy tonite,just searching for a way to turn the juice to my ride and make it live.....

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98, Flame Red, Quad Cab, 2500, 4x4, 5spd, Autometer and Cyberdyne gauges,Edelbrock Performer IAS shocks,TST#10 plate,16cm housing, B-D Exhaust Brake,Timing Advanced,K&N,Totally Amsoiled,Cat Muffler and Silencer ring ALL M. I. A. ,A BOMBING IN THE PROCESS!!
 
HEMI:

Thanks for your response to my questions!
Also thanks for that old "HX-40" thread
Joe Donnelly posted. I had not seen that
prior to today.

Bill, I appreciate all your input!
Thanks again!

------
John_P
 
Bill,

I am wondering how much boost your delivery valves added. I was getting about 40 psi out of my Majestic turbo with my current setup (see below). I then plugged the wastegate and saw about 42 psi. I will probably edge the torque plate up to get around 45 psi. EGT's aren't a problem until I let it sit on the governor in 5th for awhile.

Just to back Bill's opinion, I ran my HX40 with just the stock plate full forward & governor springs for a couple of weeks. It was entirely drivable and actually felt better on the interstate. I was and still am seeing almost the exact same boost pressure, but lower EGT's at highway cruise speed. (Compared to HX35/16) I do have 4. 10s in my truck so my cruise rpm is higher than most.

Oh, If anyone wants to have some real fun. Weld up your own 4" downpipe. I built mine out of straight scraps from the rest of the exhaust.




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Brian
97 2500 SLT 4x4, 5sp. , 4. 10 LSD 285/75, Isspro boost and pyro, TST #10, McLeod clutch, BD governor springs, 370hp injectors, TST AFC kit, HX40-16cm2, Holcomb Air, BLH 4" exhaust, BD Remote Brake
 
Thank you Hemi,,Seems all my answers are in the thread,, I appreciate the help for the slightly brain dead newbie...

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98, Flame Red, Quad Cab, 2500, 4x4, 5spd, Autometer and Cyberdyne gauges,Edelbrock Performer IAS shocks,TST#10 plate,16cm housing, B-D Exhaust Brake,Timing Advanced,K&N,Totally Amsoiled,Cat Muffler and Silencer ring ALL M. I. A. ,A BOMBING IN THE PROCESS!!
 
Hammer,

If you go to the HX40-16, you'll be able to increase your fuel plate & keep the EGT down. For reference, I had the #11 full forward, which allowed more plate travel & fuel than the #10. With the 12cm housing on the HX35, that config results in around 340 hp. You bet the EGT could get to 1400 degrees. The #10 with the stock turbo is around 330hp, according to TST. I'd guess you're getting more because of the 16cm housing.

The #8 plate, which is designed for the auto transmission, allows more fuel than the #10 in the 215 pump. Top end is around 10 more hp, centered. I've got the #8 slid 3/4 of the way forward, which picks up the low end big time. The top end is about 380 I figure, with less EGT & smoke than the #11 & the stock turbo. #ad
Add the HX40 & injectors ... what a ride. #ad
All with the stock AFC spring. Boost rockets up, with a little lag at the bottom end. Just what the doctor ordered. #ad


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Money Sink - 96, 5 speed, TST 380, HX40-16, 300 HP Injectors, Scourge BD 4200rpm Governor kit, McLeod, 4", CATless, straight out back, chrome turn down, ISSPRO Pillar, Delvac 1 & Amsiol, K&N, Mag-Hytec, 3:54, Michelin 235s on Alcoas, Rancho 9000's, Valentine One, Garmin.
Dutchmen 27' 5th Wheel.
GoldWing.

[This message has been edited by Forrest (edited 05-01-2001). ]
 
See I knew I joined here for a reason,,I appreciate all the info from all,,The HX40 was ordered today and I'll give her a spin,,I was a little unsure due to not wanting to give up the low end power or torque,,Well guess next month's addition will have to be the injectors,,Hope I can stay busy in the shop,,The mission continues... ... ...

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98, Flame Red, Quad Cab, 2500, 4x4, 5spd, Autometer and Cyberdyne gauges,Edelbrock Performer IAS shocks,TST#10 plate,16cm housing, B-D Exhaust Brake,Timing Advanced,K&N,Totally Amsoiled,Cat Muffler and Silencer ring ALL M. I. A. ,A BOMBING IN THE PROCESS!!
 
Hammer,

You had a very good question. I'm not gifted with journalism, so I gave you a link from a thread that I think answered your questions. I also was tired. #ad


Let us know how you like the HX-40. Fitting the new downpipe to the exsisting exhaust is the hardest part. Its a PITA. Make sure the HX-40 is clocked for the Dodge Ram application. This will be a nightmare if its not. Ask Forrest #ad


You should try Governer spring kit. Even if you don't spin the engine past 2800 rpms, the new springs wake up the whole powerband. From off idle to redline. The engine won't start defueling near redline like it does stock. Its a GREAT improvement. Feels like a 30 hp increase. I won't rev my engine past 2500 rpms. Even with the Governor spring kit. No need for it. Remember, the HX-40 was available for our trucks LONG before the governor spring kit came out. Everybody still liked them.

bholcomb,

I didn't really check to see how much more boost the delivery valves gave me. Enterprise Engine says 6-8 more lbs. They are a good improvement over the stock ones. I'm glad I did mine. They make the engine stronger & smoother at all rpms. When I took my truck out for a test run with the new HX-40 I hit 45 lbs of boost in about a second. Almost had a heart attack. Adjusted the wastegate. Piers said set it to dump pressure at 40-45 lbs. Anything more is a waste. Joe D hit 600 HP on the dyno at only 43 lbs boost.


------------------
Bill R
94 2500 SLT 4x4 5 Speed, 3. 54 LS, JRE 4" exhaust, Autometer Pyro, Boost & Water temp gauges, Bosch 215 HP injectors, Timing @ 14. 7º, JRE Stage III #4 plate 270/675, AFC spring kit, High performance delivery valves, Piers prepped HX-40, Governer spring kit, ATS Pulse exhaust manifold, Scotty Air, Bully Dog Propane Injection, Roadmaster Active Suspension, Optima Red Tops, Geno's Exhaust Blanket, Espar Heater (won it!), Synthetic lubes throughout.



[This message has been edited by HEMI®Dart (edited 05-01-2001). ]
 
Another thing I noticed is I have been driving for 5 days to & from work and noticed I have used very little fuel. Needle has went down about an 1/8". The HX-40 has got to be good for a 2 MPG increase. Maybe not that much. but it sure seems like it.



[This message has been edited by HEMI®Dart (edited 05-03-2001). ]
 
Hemi,

So did mine. #ad
What a benefit. #ad
More mileage with more power on tap, what a combo. #ad
By the way, make sure your firewall blanket isn't too close to your downpipe. Mine was just touching. Equation for fire. #ad
Jim Leonard cut mine away while he was putting the clutch in. Jim had worked on a truck that caught fire when the blanket came loose & fell on the exhaust.
 
Good tip Forrest. The downpipe is touching the firewall insulation. I'll have to cut & reweld the front hanger (attached to the transmission plate) and move the exhaust an inch more to the drivers side and rotate the downpipe. Don't have a welder. I do have the downpipe wrapped up like a mummy with header wrap, and a piece of aluminum flashing as a heat barrier in between the pipe & firewall. Also have a fire extingusher in the truck. #ad
I'll trim or reposition the exhaust ASAP.


Forrest,

Did you have a tough time Clocking your HX-40. ? I told hammer to buy one already clocked, or very close for the Dodge Ram application.



[This message has been edited by HEMI®Dart (edited 05-03-2001). ]
 
Hemi,

Well, the answer is yes, until I figured out how to rotate it. #ad
Once you get the big C ring out, it clocks easily. The right answer is to buy one pre clocked from one of the reputable places. Mine was not clocked & the wastegate ran parallel to the turbine shaft. BD removed it & put on the stock wastegate & clocked it all at the same time. #ad
Great place to get work done.

I don't have any insulation around the downpipe now. The downpipe is the BD mandrel bent piece & gets close to the firewall. Jim L left a couple inches of relief all the way around. #ad


Looking @ your options, I'd guess it's easier to get in their with a razor blade type knife & maybe scizzors than dick with the exhaust system. I don't know for sure, but those kinds of exhaust temps are only with lots & lots of fuel with load. One things for sure, no worry once it's free & clear.
 
I Have another wonderful observation on the HX-40. #ad


1/4" side to side movement on the cold side impeller. Bearing is shot. Builds no boost. It let go @ 35 lbs boost. Had it on a whole EASY 90 miles & 2 weeks. Yes, its a Majestic prepped turbo.

UNBELIEVABLE!! #ad




[This message has been edited by HEMI®Dart (edited 05-12-2001). ]
 
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