proof we are getting screwed on diesel

[JasonCzerak]

ohh I was tried lastnight when I posted that. I forgot to mention, the tax breaks the truckers are getting. Around MI area, I was told they are really paying $1. 25/gallon.



While you and me, we are paying $2. 50.

 

[HBarlow]

Do you even know what a monopoly is? One SINGLE company.



Who do you think developed the medicine? The company who had the financial incentive (potential profits) to invest and risk huge amounts of money to develop new drugs.



Where do you think oil comes from? Do you think it is easy to find? Do you think it is easy to develop the technology to refine and process crude? Why do you think companies explore for oil, and develop new methods of extraction and processing? Could it be because there is a potential for financial reward for their efforts? Where do think we would be without the potential for individual profit? We wouldn't be the most technologically advanced country on the planet. Our average quality of life would be far worse than it is today.



My motivations are simply, I want to share my opinions, and maybe even get a few people to think on a little bigger scale than their own wallet. It is very easy to follow the masses and complain about things that seem very simple on the outside, but are actually very complicated once you consider them deeper.

Mark,



Thanks for the intelligent presentation of facts. I applaud your attempt but unfortunately it was a waste of effort here. These guys have their opinions and misunderstandings of facts and events and are proud of them. The only thing to do is either avoid reading these "big oil company" threads or read them and chuckle.



Harvey

 

[mschoenheider]

No technically there is not a monopoly but if believe that big oil did not and has not used this situation to the utmost advantage then you are fooling youself.





ABSOLUTELY!



Ducking behind technical textbook definitions is pure evasion and denial of the MANY individual instances posted MANY times in threads and forums like this one, as well as abundant supporting articles in various media!

You're right Gary, what was I thinking, if it is written on the internet, it MUST be true. Especially if it it plays on our emotions, and is repeated.

All it takes to effectively construct a working monopoly is a working agreement - not necessarily in written form - between appropriate business heads - totally illegal in cases like discussed here, but the steady stream of memos, quotes and specific instance related by individuals out in the field in positions to know, CONSISTENTLY point to a dedicated and focused backround intent by big oil and its confederates to totally manipulate supplies and refining - and PROFIT!

I agree that oil companies are in business to make a profit, but I disagree that they all cooperate (all 150 refineries) and have formed a monololy. Do you have any good insight into who killed Kennedy? Any other good conspiracy theories?

It does NOT include various methods of forcing out competitors at gunpoint in order to control your particular market, with the ultimate goal of eventually naming your own price and holding your customer base hostage for that price!

Do you think you might be being a little bit dramatic????? Has someone actually held a gun to your head while you filled your tank? Me neither.....

Oil based energy has become more than simply a frivelous "product" owned and distributed by a handful of "owners" or governments - it has become far more like the air we breathe and the water we drink - and NO ONE can or should be allowed to "own" those, or control their distribution or name their own price for it!



We understand the principle as it applies to air and water - and recognize government controls over public airwaves (FCC), Public Utilities (PUC) and a number of issues in the best interests of society as a whole - why do some have problems with the energy that we ALSO rely upon to survive?

Handful of owners? How many fingers do you have?

Do you think no one owns water? Do have any idea how private water rights, or even municipal water supply systems work? I guess not.

When you BUY land, you may or may not have water rights on that land. They are part of the PURCHASE of land. Exactly the same way that oil and mineral rights are part of the purchase of land. If you have water rights on your land, you can drill a well, and extract the water from the ground and use it. Same goes for oil. Alternatively, you can BUY water from your local municipal who pulled it out of the ground and treated it to make it potable, or from a company like Culligan if you want. Wow, that sounds a lot like fuel, either you could pull it out of the ground yourself, or you could buy it from someone who pulled it out of the ground and refined it for you.

Anyone deliberately choosing to NOT see the difference between the natural resource of energy this country and others RUN on, and Levis or computer programs, is being deliberately dense or attempting to confuse the issue.



ON a related issue, in earlier decades, carriage and bicycle makers such as Studebaker and others, saw the handwriting on the wall, and realized that if they wanted to stay in the transportation business, they would have to develop a vehicle conforming to the growing trend towards engine-driven vehicles.



In other words, the current business they had been successfully involved in was drying up, and they would either have to branch out into something new and different, or close their doors.



WHY is it that big oil has so steadfastly dragged their heels and resisted intense research and development of alternative energy sources on a massive scale? It would SEEM to be in their best interest to do so, and then be the major supplier of THAT technology and product, just as they have been with oil-based energy...



Could it be they like the game they are already in control of, and really have no FEAR of the future?

So Gary, what would you suggest? What is your solution? Government control of the oil industry? How about alternative fuels, what is the miracle answer? Solar, wind, hydrogen? What do you think it would take to get the R&D complete to develop a viable alternative energy source? Let me take a shot, might it be potential profit? Or maybe in your world, all it would take is some "good" people who want to make the world a better place with no thought of themselves, and a huge supply of money to fund their research.



Gary, I hope you don't take anything I have said in the wrong way. I do not mean any personnel insult, I am just trying to open peoples minds and get people to quit repeating the crap they hear without at least thinking about it.



Mark

 

[RGardner]

Mark how many companies do you think it takes to effectively control the refining industry? The things you say are true to some extent but I find it hard to believe that you think that big oil had no hand in this price spike. I totally agree that we need more refineries, we need to tell epa to take a hike, we need on blend of gasoline for the country instead of one for every little town that wants one, but the extent of the profits are too much. I am certain that everything legal (and maybe some questionable) accounting practices were used to bring those profits down to the level reported The place I believe that we are abused now is by the either local stations or distributors that chased the price up . 20 to . 40 per day on the fuel in their tanks on the excuse the the replacement fuel was going to be higher but now won't come down because the paid tooo much for the fuel in the tank!

 

[Xtremewheeling]

Fuel Taxes

Why is it no one remembers the 50 to 60 cents a gallon tax on fuel I would call this a wind fall profit for the goverments. You never here them cutting tax on fuel do you.

 

[GMincher]

It definitely hurts!!

I'm a small time contractor. We have 2 Cummins powered trucks, a diesel generator (Kubota), diesel skid steer (New Holland) , diesel mini excavator(Komatsu) and a multi-fuel bullet heater that we usually burn... yes, diesel fuel in. The company is my brother and myself. I'm the one responsible for purchasing, or swaying the thought process toward this machinery. Fuel prices are literally killing us. And I'm afraid my brothers gonna' kill me!