Proper Registration Weight

[HBarlow]

In Texas, when a buyer purchases a new truck, the dealer prepares the title application and sends it over to the local court house for the county tax assessor/collector to collect fees, register the vehicle and send documentation on to Austin (capitol city) for the title to be issued.



The dealer writes in the empty shipping weight of the truck provided by the manufacturer and the tax clerk at the court house adds 1000 lbs. if the truck is a Class 1 "half ton", 1500 lbs. if it is a Class 2 "3/4 ton", and 2000 lbs. if it is a Class 3 "one ton. "



The maximum legal weight the truck can be operated at when loaded is then not the GVWR specified by the manufacturer but a figure far less based on the fee collected and the numbers typed in by a tax clerk in the basement of an old court house.



My Ram cab and chassis has a GVWR of 12,500 pounds but it was only registered at 10,600#. Pulling my fiver I'll exceed that figure by about 2,000 lbs. I could get a ticket for being overweight.



They do the same in every Texas county I have registered a vehicle in. Apparently they haven't figured out that the old terms 1/2, 3/4, or one ton are no longer officially used and were long ago superceded by the actual carrying capacity of modern light trucks.



I never paid much attention to that before I pulled trailers commercially for three years and had to comply with DOT regulations and cross weigh scales and undergo DOT inspections.



Now, since I am aware of the rules and regulations, I didn't want to take a chance on getting pulled into a scale. Some states, California in particular, ignore pickups pulling trailers, even commercially, but with a flat bed I might be expected to weigh, even pulling my own trailer. If I was weighed and my documents inspected to prove I am not commercial I could still be cited for overweight if my truck is registered for only 10,600# and weighs 12,500#.



I'm leaving early Saturday pulling my trailer on a trip to San Diego and then on to May Madness in Pahrump, NV. I decided to get legal. I took my current registration and went down to the county tax assessor/collector's office this morning and told the clerk I wanted to increase my registered weight. It cost me $12. 45 to increase my registered weight from 10,600# to 12,500#. Well worth it for peace of mind.



I don't know if other states still register light trucks using the old-fashioned weights or not. Also don't know how many of you pull heavy trailers. But with the increased attention state DOT officers and state police are giving to trucks on their highways it might be a good idea to check your registration weight. It is illegal to operate a vehicle overweight, even over registered weight, even when you are pulling your own RV in non-commercial activity.

 

[DonTX]

A most interesting post.

I had to run out to my one ton and check, did not think there was a load showing. Sure enough, my one ton registration says it is a 5620 empty truck allowed to haul only 2000 lbs! One would think you would have a sticker on the tag saying something about that. I think I weigh almost that much empty, and when hooked to my fifth wheel, I weigh just about 20k even! I am a disabled vet, so my Texas tags are totally free - up to a one ton truck! I feel it would be a whopper of a bill if I retagged it for 20k, but am going to check tomorrow on that. .

Did you get a sticker or something, or does the new registration just say a larger load? You should be ashamed of yourself, I was fat, dumb and very happy before your post!

 

[HBarlow]

Don,



Sorry for spoiling your "fat, dumb, and happy" bliss. Most readers will just ignore it and many won't really care.



No, the tax office doesnt' offer any weight tags. The only place the weight shows up other than in the computer that any TX LEO could pull up on the screen of his cruiser, is on the registration receipt. And last time I looked, unless the truck is used commercially I don't think the owner is required to carry the receipt in the vehicle. So the only way for a LEO to know we aren't legally registered is by looking in the computer, I think.



When I was transporting I was registering my truck for 26k because the trailers I was pulling were unregistered ie cargo so the truck had to be registered (fees paid) for the combined weight. It think the cost was around $215 for that weight. For 10,500, which is what I think your Gen II dually is, it shouldn't run more than about $80-$90 I'd guess.



TX is a little outside the norm, I think. I believe most states issue a registration document that is required to be in the vehicle. I got so accustomed to carrying and producing all the documentation when I was commercial I wouldn't want to drive across country without the registration receipt.

 

[Bill Stockard]

In Texas, the proper way to register a Cab & Chassis is to weigh the completed truck(after the bed is installed) at a certified scale. The weight ticket is taken to the tax office with the title application, proof of liability insurance coverage, and the Manufacturer's Certificate of Origin. A Cab & Chassis is considered an incomplete vehicle and the weight on the MCO is not used (if the title clerk handling the registration knows what he/she is doing).



I imagine in your case Harvey, the title application was sent to the tax office with a stack of car and pickup registrations from the automobile dealer (not a real truck dealer) and the clerk didn't notice the Cab & Chassis on the MCO.



BTW, I handled hundreds of medium duty and heavy duty truck cab and chassis title applications at the real truck dealership where I worked for 23 years. If the title applications were incorrect, "Austin" sent them back causing delays and very upset customers.



Bill

 

[DonTX]

Well, I used to be commercial (house trailers, then owner/operator with a Kenworth with 53ft dry van) broken up by a stint as a Kansas truck road cop, so I DO worry about such things. Somehow being transplanted from KS, I assumed that no sticker on the tag, no weight limits. WRONG!

I don't know exactly when or where they got the 5620 empty weight.

 

[HBarlow]

Bill,



In my case, because I ordered the truck in Gainesville from my favorite dealership then had the bed installed here at home at a local trailer/truck bed dealer, my registration application could not even be submitted to the tax assessor's office until the bed installation was complete and I faxed a copy of a certified scale weight ticket back to the dealer.



The correct empty weight, 8,600#, was sent to the court house in Gainesville by my dealer along with the fees, application for registration, and title.



The problem occurs because tax assessor/collectors across the state apparently still operate by the rules of the 1950s when registering pickups and similar cab and chassis trucks: A 3500 is a "one ton" with carrying capacity of 2,000 lbs. Dealership title clerks also do it wrong because they calculate the registration fees and send the checks over to the courthouse.



Hopkins County did the same when I lived in Sulphur Springs when I was in school, Lubbock County does it the same way, and Gainesville County has followed the same procedure for the three Dodges I've bought from Glen Polk in Gainesville.



The tax clerk added "one ton", 2,000 lbs. to my empty weight of 8,600 lbs. and registered it for a maximum gross weight of 10,600. A cab and chassis with an empty weight of 8. 600# and registered gross weight of 10,600# is not very useful. The counties and the State of Texas are giving up millions of dollars in tax revenues by registering trucks with the outdated 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, and one ton designations rather than using the factory GVWR numbers. They are also leaving owners vulnerable for overweight tickets by law enforcement officers who happen to weigh them.



I'm sure it is different with "real trucks" because they don't have a simple weight designation like 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, or one ton. Title clerks have no clue what their carrying capacity is

 

[rvaughn801]

"TX is a little outside the norm, I think. I believe most states issue a registration document that is required to be in the vehicle. "

I was pulled over in Colorado 2 years ago. The LEO made a big deal about my not having KS registration in the glove box. I always carry registration now.

 

[RVTRKN]

I just went through that on my C&C in California. I did weigh the truck after bed installation and it was #9050 and did not notice on my registration and title it showed the incomplete vehicle weight at #5600, It even had the wrong vehicle type. A clerk noticed it at DMV when I was increasing my registered weight to #26K. I had to have it recertified at its weight and reinspected or verified by DMV to change the title and registration. Its a good thing that the dealer still had the original weight certificate, because I would of had to empty my truck of all my tools and ladders. I don't know who made the mistake but it could have been costly if caught out of state on a scale.

 

[HBarlow]

"TX is a little outside the norm, I think. I believe most states issue a registration document that is required to be in the vehicle. "



I was pulled over in Colorado 2 years ago. The LEO made a big deal about my not having KS registration in the glove box. I always carry registration now.

I think state registration systems are changing over to a computerized system where paper receipts are not necessary but LEO is still working with the old paper system.



I don't want to get caught at a scale in another state and end up getting a ticket for something loose on my bed or a bulb burned out after annoying a trooper by proving I am private, not commercial, and don't have to carry a paper registration. The citizen often loses in a contest with a trooper.

 

[jelag]

Guys, we run up and down the west coast with 3500 duallys... . We've never been asked about what the registration says other than in our home state... . as long as the combined weight of the truck and trailer are withing the GVW rating of the truck and trailer and other DOT issues are met...

Some of our trucks are local trucks that carry just WA plates, others are apportioned plates that are listed and registered with the max GVW we are going to haul... of course with the apportioned plates are the division of the fee's based on the states you are traveling in... .

AZ, UT, always stop every out of state truck in bound into their state and check their registration to see that their state is on the cab card... other scale houses seem to spot check... if your not using apportioned plates than as a commercial carrier your required to purchase a permit as you enter a state... .

Passing through without apportioned plates or permit usually results in a fine and if your log isn't up today a 24 - 36 hour grounding... .

Since Jan 07 there is an additional fee for commercial carriers that is a new federal fee that has allowed all states to merge their computer system into the federal system... I was in a scale house in BC Canada, and as the trucks were crossing the scales the guy would input their plate number... in the time it takes to roll across the scales they would have a result back from the US Federal system of that truck and its cab card information... and if BC was on the cab card... . In the 10 minutes they reviewed my log book and papers they had red lighted 4 trucks for not having BC on their cab card... .

The computer system is here... I know we've taken steps to upgrade what we do... also if you've had trouble in another state it now shows on the federal record...

Hope this helps... .

 

[HBarlow]

Jim,



You're right, I've experienced the things you wrote about.



But I'm not sure all that information such as registered weight is available in the shared nationwide computer system for private use light trucks.

 

[Ragain]

If I was running my Dodge non-commercial, I would tag/register it with the lightest tag possible... ... . the tag on the trailer would cover the extra weight you have while towing. (Thats what the girls in the tag office recommend)

 

[HBarlow]

Ragain,



No, they're mistaken. The trailer is registered for its own max GVWR and that is the loaded weight of most of them. If the truck is over the registered weight, and mine is by about 2k pounds, it would be considered overweight.



It only cost me $12. 45 to get legal and avoid any worries about a ticket.

 

[Pavemen]

My 3500 is registered in CA as 01500 lb, its a typo and my 1500 trail rig has a higher weight and associated fee. I didn't realize it until I compared the two DMV registration bills (they are due a month apart and I've only had the 3500 for just over a year).

Not sure what will be required to have the weight updated as its a correction, not a change to a different weight.

at least for right now, unloaded my truck is over weight!

 

[HBarlow]

Pavemen,



Normally you should be able to walk in a DMV office with old registration in one hand and your check book in the other and declare the weight you want to register for. California is a little more bureaucratic than TX but all you're asking them to do is take more money and allow you to operate your truck at the factory maximum weight.

 

[jelag]

HBarlow, Harvey isn't it????

I"m getting off subject here...

All my work above is with trucks that bear our DOT number and we run commercially... . I drive a 3500 dually as one of my daily drivers... before the company uses it... . I don't do commercial stuff and never run it into the scales... . except when they are closed to check the weight of my truck, 5er etc... .

Since we have the company name and DOT # on the side we follow the rules... even if I use one of these for personal stuff and its in a state where we have to scale... ... we pull in.....

To make matters worse... in the 4 closest states and BC we have to scale at 16K, 20K, 26K, All commercial, and 4500 KG. depending on which state.....

In MT the S10 Napa deliver pickup is a commercial and must scale by MT law... mind you most don't and the commercial enforcement don't seem to care... . but we've found with the new computer system... . you'd best know and follow the rules...

One last comment... we've just been told that Canada now has gone away from our FED DOT rules for log books... giving their drivers more drive hours in a day... . no one seems to know, but we've just followed our DOT rules, in Canada so we are legal when we come back to the US... I can only assume an only Canada driver should follow those rules in Canada... ... ...

 

[Bill Stockard]

The problem occurs because tax assessor/collectors across the state apparently still operate by the rules of the 1950s when registering pickups and similar cab and chassis trucks: A 3500 is a "one ton" with carrying capacity of 2,000 lbs. Dealership title clerks also do it wrong because they calculate the registration fees and send the checks over to the courthouse.



Hopkins County did the same when I lived in Sulphur Springs when I was in school, Lubbock County does it the same way, and Gainesville County has followed the same procedure for the three Dodges I've bought from Glen Polk in Gainesville.



The tax clerk added "one ton", 2,000 lbs. to my empty weight of 8,600 lbs. and registered it for a maximum gross weight of 10,600. A cab and chassis with an empty weight of 8. 600# and registered gross weight of 10,600# is not very useful. The counties and the State of Texas are giving up millions of dollars in tax revenues by registering trucks with the outdated 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, and one ton designations rather than using the factory GVWR numbers. They are also leaving owners vulnerable for overweight tickets by law enforcement officers who happen to weigh them.



I'm sure it is different with "real trucks" because they don't have a simple weight designation like 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, or one ton. Title clerks have no clue what their carrying capacity is

You are right Harvey, the tax assessor/collectors are still in the 1950s! It used to drive me up the wall when I wanted to register a medium duty truck for 32,000 lbs gross, a certified weight slip with 14,000 lbs on it, and the title certificate showed the truck rated at 3 tons. They would try to register it for 20,000 lbs. Each time they hired a new clerk, we had to have a little education program. The couldn't figure why I was paying for more weight.



Bill

 

[CumminsPower98]

My 2500 was originally registered for 12k GCW. I then went commercial transporting RVs and found out the hard way. I had no problems for a long time and then one day at the UT/AZ scale there at St. George while getting a permit I got fined $75 after the officer saw my registered weight. He even joked around with me that it was just a money issue. Well I got back home from that trip and had the DMV raise my GCWR to 24k, which it still is until next year when I will lower to 16k, which is what my truck is rated for from the manufacturer. I didn't go on up to 26k because I don't have a CDL and 24k was high enough to cover everything but the two largest trailers in the yard that would require a CDL (18k and change). I'm with you HBarlow, it doesn't cost much more to register at its rated weight and then I don't have to worry. Being that I am no longer commercial I would probably not have any problems but I feel better this way. I showed my registration in many other states while getting permits and they never said a thing so its probably more of a home state thing.

 

[RVTRKN]

My 2500 was originally registered for 12k GCW. I then went commercial transporting RVs and found out the hard way. I had no problems for a long time and then one day at the UT/AZ scale there at St. George while getting a permit I got fined $75 after the officer saw my registered weight. He even joked around with me that it was just a money issue. Well I got back home from that trip and had the DMV raise my GCWR to 24k, which it still is until next year when I will lower to 16k, which is what my truck is rated for from the manufacturer. I didn't go on up to 26k because I don't have a CDL and 24k was high enough to cover everything but the two largest trailers in the yard that would require a CDL (18k and change). I'm with you HBarlow, it doesn't cost much more to register at its rated weight and then I don't have to worry. Being that I am no longer commercial I would probably not have any problems but I feel better this way. I showed my registration in many other states while getting permits and they never said a thing so its probably more of a home state thing.

Its that scale you were at, they stop all RV when commercial regardless so they can get their tax, period. Over sized is $350 and they will measure it as well, You can count on that. I went through and had to pay $15 for the truck and $15 for the trailer. (they were Weekend Warriors 5vers) Lucky for me the transport Co. I was hauling for paid the oversized fee prior to my leaving. The unlucky guy I left their was still waiting for Quality to pay the fee and he didn't get out of their for another 5 hours. I know because we were delivering to the same dealer in Utah. Didn't you know we are a free nation.



Steve...

 

[CumminsPower98]

I also carried a prepaid oversize permit for AZ so that was never a problem for me but they still did come out and measure now and then. I always paid the $15 and got reimbursed for that. That's crazy that Quality didn't send a permit with the guy. What gets me about all this stuff is how much it depends on the officers on duty as to what they do. Some wanted to see my registration and others never asked at this particular scale. I was always going south while loaded through this one.