Re-Mapping Controller

[redeye]

I was talking about the EZ edge module with my local Cummins service center rep. the other day. He suggested that reprogramming the engine controller with marine specs. would greatly increase performance without adding expensive hardware. Anyone tried this? What do you think?

 

[TxDieselKid]

The question is....

Was he willing to do it? I have no idea if it would be better of not, but if you have a Cummins Service rep willing to do something like this, then damn are you in the know. I have never heard of it being done.



AJB

 

[Ray Torresdal]

re-program

I would want to have the option to take it back to original! I would guess marine engines are set up to run constant rpm, and some of the niceties that we take for granted in a street vehicle might be missing. Ray

 

[TxDieselKid]

changeing back...

I wonder if a simple reflash could do this? But I do have to agree with you Ray, and was wondering the same thing lurking around the Cummins page.



Here is the Cummins page on the 6BTA that puts out 315 horses and 683 ft-lbs of torque.



I have heard of swaping out the cam from one of these, but am yet to actually see it. I think the guys from AutoWurks claim to have a marine cam in that "11 second" truck.



AJB

 

[TxDieselKid]

TTT

So does anybody have any more ideas on this???



AJB

 

[fj40charles]

I had inquired about the Torques Maximus (sp?) some time ago and I talked to a Cummins service guy. We got off on a tangent talking about how many of the big rigs have the ECM re-programmed and I asked if you could do the same for my Dodge. He said he could do only if the ECM was a Cummins and NOT a Dodge ECM.



Charles

 

[TxDieselKid]

But a marine?

Well I think I know what you mean but the ECM is a Cummins. It is on a Dogde though. Is that what you ment fj40?



But how would a Marine ECM do?



Still no takers? Were is DieselFreak when you need him?



AJB

 

[_Hyde]

From what I've read in the past the ECM on our trucks is a DC part and that Cummins can't do anything with it like they can on theirs. So why not pull the DC ECM and install the Cummins unit? The DC ECM is supposed to have drivers in it that provides the processing for the instruments, etc. I think DC got us by the short hairs on this route otherwise the wouldn't be such a market for PE, EZ, VA, Blue Chip Box etc. You could just go to your local Cummins shop or possibly any shop that services Cummins with a case of beer and bam power. Not sure if there's more or less to the story here but that's how I remember reading it some time ago.



Darren

 

[pwr2tow]

I do not know anything about the marine program but there are other programs cummins can install on DC ECM's to increase power, I know this because I was standing right there when cummins hooked up there scan/program monitor and seen the other codes for myself. He said all he had to do was push a button and the new program would be installed. I asked the cummins rep if he would leave the programmer hooked up and then take a little coffee break , he said if he done that and DC found out cummins would get sued, can't blame me for trying.



Next time I will try the beer method .



Just kidding, I wouldn't want anyone to get into trouble because of me.



Ron

 

[redneckdr]

dc or cummins

i'm about to ask one of those dumb relative "newbie" questions... . who is the final guarantor on the 100,000 mile guarantee on the cummins in our dodges--cummins or daimler-chrysler? if it is cummins, howcum can't we use cummins programming for the ecm, etc? i guess the answer is dc, otherwise the only reason they would care about the programming would be the effects on the rest of the drivetrain?????

 

[RustyJC]

Redneckdr,



Good question - I would imagine that DC carries the warranty liability for the Cummins except under extenuating circumstances (i. e. , DC could prove Cummins built a batch of engines with bad block castings, etc. ). It's a risk management issue, and it's probably cheaper for DC to assume it than have Cummins "price it into" DC's cost for each engine they purchase. I guess it depends on the new German management's philosophy.



This does raise the issue, though - if someone has had their warranty voided by DC or has a truck that's out of warranty, I don't see where Cummins should be concerned about being sued by DC for any reprogramming they might do that would increase DC's warranty liability risk.



Rusty

 

[pwr2tow]

redneckdr,

Your right about the warranty.

Your right about DC.



Cummins would love to help out but DC tied them up pretty good a few years ago, as far as cummins engines in dodge.



Ron

 

[Dave Fritz]

redneckdr,



Dodge warranties the engine.



DC buys the engines from Cummins without a warranty because the engines cost less without a manufacturer warranty. If something major breaks, Cummins will usually exchange a head, short block or even the entire engine so Cummins engineers can do a failure analysis. DC eats the cost of parts for smaller failures and labor costs for all engine repairs.



The ECM used on Dodge trucks is a special Dodge version without some of the usual B engine features, and without the second ECM connector that many Cummins accessories use. Dodge prefers to use the PCM for gauge functions, cruise control, battery charge control, and transmission shifting. The PCM reads the throttle, engine speed, temperature, etc, then relays what it feels is important to the ECM (modifying the throttle signal to control powertrain loads). Marco can probably tell you a whole lot more about how this works than I can.



Dave

 

[TxDieselKid]

you would think that is the case but....

Originally posted by RustyJC



This does raise the issue, though - if someone has had their warranty voided by DC or has a truck that's out of warranty, I don't see where Cummins should be concerned about being sued by DC for any reprogramming they might do that would increase DC's warranty liability risk.



Rusty

Ask Mark from TST about reflashing the ECM, better yet just do a search. He got in to major trouble for doing this. The reason that Marco can do somthing so close is he's in Italy (so I guess he's like a godfather??? doing something illeagel and not getting busted???).



Anyways, if it came from a Cummins shop you would think it wouldn't matter. How many members here work at a Cummins shop??? Any in east Texas????

 

[Todd T]

Dave was right, the ECM that is on our trucks is a 100 pin version that is dumbed down for the chrysler application only. it is reffered to as a "Chrysler ECM" by Cummins.



they can flash the Chrysler ECM, you are right. but they absolutely, will not do it.



if you bought a 200 pin cummins ECM and swapped it out for you're chrysler one, along with rewiring the entire cluster and weeding out the PCM, (good luck doing this in a automatic equiped truck. ) then, Cummins would reflash you all day long. plus you could have them build custom maps for it.



the reason Marco can do what he does, is because he is not modifying DC's propietary software. he is blowing out the ECM's (actually changing the chips out I believe) and then using another software that he has bought the right to use, and loading his own maps that he has to build from scratch. this is also the reason it has taken him so long to perfect these boxes. he is having to reverse engineer the entire system.



the Root of the Problem is DC, and their use of this off-breed ECM.



the marine cams wont give you much more power over the cam we have. they do however, have a far superior piston that is used by a few of the high powered pulling guys. IE Dave Mitchell.

 

[redneckdr]

ecm's

wowzers!!!!i may never ask a dumb question ever again... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ..... NOT!!!!thanx, all. i learned a lot from this discussion, and i suspect there is more to come. it's sad that dc is so afraid to make a drive train that would handle the power, then put the "most powerful" diesel pickup in the world on the road. i gladly would have paid another 2-3 thousand american dollars for a truck that had 100 more hp, and another 200 or so foot pounds of torque in a dependable package. heck, i seriously considered paying about $4k more for a maxipad. in spite of that, lest there be a question, i luv th' goat more each day. i hate it when i pull in the parking lot at work, and have to let her cool down a bit, then shut her down. (oh well, something to look forward to at the end of the day!!!!)

 

[Ray Torresdal]

Cummins ECM

Has anyone thought about making some type of plug in adapter that would allow us to use a Cummins ECM, and still feed whatever information DC needs for the auto transmission, etc. through some type of oulet that could be plugged in where needed? I personally don't need information for the auto transmission, but don't know what other information they bleed off the ECM. Please don't flame - I'm a machinest, not a computer or electronics person. Ray

 

[rashwor]

Torque Maximus

So if I bought the Torque Maximus, it would still be a DC product with 100 pins and Cummins could not reflash it? Bummer dude!



Will the Cummins Marine ECM plug and play on our ISB's out of the box with no wiring mods or anything else? Just plug-n-rock the house?



Seems if you could get the marine ECM and it would plug and play, that would be the way to go. I have 90,000 miles now and I am about ready to rock and roll!

 

[TxDieselKid]

Re: Torque Maximus

Originally posted by rashwor

So if I bought the Torque Maximus, it would still be a DC product with 100 pins and Cummins could not reflash it? Bummer dude!



Will the Cummins Marine ECM plug and play on our ISB's out of the box with no wiring mods or anything else? Just plug-n-rock the house?



Seems if you could get the marine ECM and it would plug and play, that would be the way to go. I have 90,000 miles now and I am about ready to rock and roll!

Fraid not rash. The Marine ECM is a Cummins part, so it's the same way. The only plug and play ECM that will be ok, is the Torqus Maxis, and the M. A. D. ECM.



Cummins could do it, but even if the warrenty is gone, the WILL NOT DO IT!!! I don't reeally know way, that's just the way it is.



AJB

 

[rashwor]

MAD ECM

So the MAD ECM is the one done by the guy in Italy?



Maybe more truck in 2003. I would think Dodge would try to keep up with Ford and Chevy power.