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RV values
- Thread starter JR
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Well, there's always NADA and KBB, but I'll point you to PPL Motorhomes - they're the largest consignment dealer of used RVs (not just motorhomes), and their pricing is pretty much on target with the market. I'd check to see if they have something similar to what you're considering.
Rusty
Rusty
Definitely do some searching, online there is quite a bit you can find, go to any dealer armed with knowledge. I've browsed the PPL site before too, a good place to start.
Perhaps the biggest thing you need is to narrow down what you need, and want as far as type, size, features, etc. There are so many options the information could be overwhelming.
If you are looking Travel Trailer, or any towable.. I'd look really close at the running gear and suspension, and frame.. I've found generally that these are built rapidly and with the lowest cost parts that meet the minimum legal standard, and these parts need replacement and upgrade for even low miles and use.. that and some of the associated systems as well.. mine is about 10 years old, and I feel like I've just about rebuilt the entire thing at this point.. More details on my latest suspension and tire/wheel efforts over on another thread: https://www.turbodieselregister.com...l-size-for-better-tires?p=2442189#post2442189
I do have to say though, when not working on the RV, it is nice to take family trips and have all your items handy, make quick stops for meals on the road, and have one's own space away from home.. overall it is a decent way to go out and explore, and if you use parks, state, national, regional, and use it for most meals, you can make it economical compared to hotels and restaurants, even with the higher fuel used. In my case it worked out that I have one on the small side, which is helpful when looking for RV campsites, often there are size limits at the parks, and maneuvering a large rig can be difficult in places.. so even though I now have a truck that can haul just about any rig, I'm still good with the smaller model that could be towed with a 1/2 ton, I just have to check from time to time that it has not been left behind (cause the truck tows it with ease!).
Perhaps the biggest thing you need is to narrow down what you need, and want as far as type, size, features, etc. There are so many options the information could be overwhelming.
If you are looking Travel Trailer, or any towable.. I'd look really close at the running gear and suspension, and frame.. I've found generally that these are built rapidly and with the lowest cost parts that meet the minimum legal standard, and these parts need replacement and upgrade for even low miles and use.. that and some of the associated systems as well.. mine is about 10 years old, and I feel like I've just about rebuilt the entire thing at this point.. More details on my latest suspension and tire/wheel efforts over on another thread: https://www.turbodieselregister.com...l-size-for-better-tires?p=2442189#post2442189
I do have to say though, when not working on the RV, it is nice to take family trips and have all your items handy, make quick stops for meals on the road, and have one's own space away from home.. overall it is a decent way to go out and explore, and if you use parks, state, national, regional, and use it for most meals, you can make it economical compared to hotels and restaurants, even with the higher fuel used. In my case it worked out that I have one on the small side, which is helpful when looking for RV campsites, often there are size limits at the parks, and maneuvering a large rig can be difficult in places.. so even though I now have a truck that can haul just about any rig, I'm still good with the smaller model that could be towed with a 1/2 ton, I just have to check from time to time that it has not been left behind (cause the truck tows it with ease!).
X2.
JR, be sure and look at the roof. Water damage is the Achilles' heal of any camper. It runs down the wall and takes out the flooring before you can get a handle on it. That refrigerator that runs on AC, DC, and propane has a life expectancy of about ten years and it will cost over a thousand to replace (some would argue that is the life expectancy of the whole camper if it hasn't been well maintained and kept covered when not in use). And yes, those tires need to be replaced every five years whether they show wear or not.
Don't ask me how I know all of this. If I told you it would bring tears to your eyes. After three of them, I can say that I've learned a lot but I'm still learning. However, I wouldn't take anything for all the fun we've had.
- Ed
JR, be sure and look at the roof. Water damage is the Achilles' heal of any camper. It runs down the wall and takes out the flooring before you can get a handle on it. That refrigerator that runs on AC, DC, and propane has a life expectancy of about ten years and it will cost over a thousand to replace (some would argue that is the life expectancy of the whole camper if it hasn't been well maintained and kept covered when not in use). And yes, those tires need to be replaced every five years whether they show wear or not.
Don't ask me how I know all of this. If I told you it would bring tears to your eyes. After three of them, I can say that I've learned a lot but I'm still learning. However, I wouldn't take anything for all the fun we've had.
- Ed
When we bought our first trailer we bought it from a reputable dealer who had gone thru it and made sure everything worked. We kept it for 11 years. We bought in the fall ( off season up here ) and therefore the price was lower than in the summer. We had looked around for quite a while and had an idea what we wanted and what similar models were going for.
When we bought out current model I went to many dealers to see what they had and when I told them my budget for a "used trailer" they all tried to sell me a "new one for the same or less money". My reply was "I don't want a new Kia I want a used Mercedes" ( with all due respect to Kia - I think you get the idea ) I wanted a decent quality model not just a flashy new POS with "all the bells and whistles" that would fall apart in a few years.
We ended up buying it form the original owners who had hardly used it. It was in great shape inside and out. WARNING: If a trailer, or truck for that matter, sits for a long time with out being used it WILL have issues. The sliding window were stuck shut from lack of use and moss growing in the tracks, for example. Fortunately I have a friend who works in the RV industry and with hid help and a few $ we fixed most thing economically. The tires looked great but after over 10 years they were not great. I blew one in the middle of BC and didn't even know it until someone flagged me down. Dodge has too much power
Bottom line : check it out by someone who knows their stuff and it's worth whatever someone will pay for it. Happy shopping
David
When we bought out current model I went to many dealers to see what they had and when I told them my budget for a "used trailer" they all tried to sell me a "new one for the same or less money". My reply was "I don't want a new Kia I want a used Mercedes" ( with all due respect to Kia - I think you get the idea ) I wanted a decent quality model not just a flashy new POS with "all the bells and whistles" that would fall apart in a few years.
We ended up buying it form the original owners who had hardly used it. It was in great shape inside and out. WARNING: If a trailer, or truck for that matter, sits for a long time with out being used it WILL have issues. The sliding window were stuck shut from lack of use and moss growing in the tracks, for example. Fortunately I have a friend who works in the RV industry and with hid help and a few $ we fixed most thing economically. The tires looked great but after over 10 years they were not great. I blew one in the middle of BC and didn't even know it until someone flagged me down. Dodge has too much power
Bottom line : check it out by someone who knows their stuff and it's worth whatever someone will pay for it. Happy shopping
David
Thank you for all the advice guys!
I checked for similar models on PPL as Rusty suggested and the asking price is anywhere between $3k-4k higher than what this guy is asking. The one thing that does make me a bit nervous is it is at a local campground here and the guy lives about an hour and a half away so I believe it probably sits at the campground all the time. If that's the case the tires will likely need replaced and running gear gone through.
The 10 year life expectancy kinda scares me, as this unit is already 8 years old. My thinking on this is to buy a slightly older model for our first camper to try out and see if it is something we will enjoy. My boys love to primitive camp, we go to Chatauqua in New York and the Allegheneys several times a year. It is the only way they've ever camped and if it was just the 3 of us I'd probably not be looking to do it any other way. The wife has been a good sport about it but doesn't enjoy it like we do and has been hinting for one for a while now so it looks like we are going to give it s try. We are looking at spending under $12k, this is what we can comfortably afford without financing which is the way I prefer to go for the time being. I figure we can try it out for a year or two and if we use it enough to justify spending the coin on a new one well go for it. Hopefully this approach doesn't come back and bite me.
BTW, we are looking at a Keystone Springdale 269RLLS. From what I gather it is Keystones middle of the line brand. Is this a decent first camper if I can get it for a good price or should I look elsewhere?
So major things to look for:
condition of roof
HVAC operation
All appliances including hot water tank
I should have a good handle on running gear and tires, I've built a couple of deck overs and a tilt trailer so am pretty familiar on that end. Anything else? I appreciate any and all thoughts/concerns! Going to look at it tomorrow afternoon!
I checked for similar models on PPL as Rusty suggested and the asking price is anywhere between $3k-4k higher than what this guy is asking. The one thing that does make me a bit nervous is it is at a local campground here and the guy lives about an hour and a half away so I believe it probably sits at the campground all the time. If that's the case the tires will likely need replaced and running gear gone through.
The 10 year life expectancy kinda scares me, as this unit is already 8 years old. My thinking on this is to buy a slightly older model for our first camper to try out and see if it is something we will enjoy. My boys love to primitive camp, we go to Chatauqua in New York and the Allegheneys several times a year. It is the only way they've ever camped and if it was just the 3 of us I'd probably not be looking to do it any other way. The wife has been a good sport about it but doesn't enjoy it like we do and has been hinting for one for a while now so it looks like we are going to give it s try. We are looking at spending under $12k, this is what we can comfortably afford without financing which is the way I prefer to go for the time being. I figure we can try it out for a year or two and if we use it enough to justify spending the coin on a new one well go for it. Hopefully this approach doesn't come back and bite me.
BTW, we are looking at a Keystone Springdale 269RLLS. From what I gather it is Keystones middle of the line brand. Is this a decent first camper if I can get it for a good price or should I look elsewhere?
So major things to look for:
condition of roof
HVAC operation
All appliances including hot water tank
I should have a good handle on running gear and tires, I've built a couple of deck overs and a tilt trailer so am pretty familiar on that end. Anything else? I appreciate any and all thoughts/concerns! Going to look at it tomorrow afternoon!
JR,
We bought our first travel trailer in 2013; it was a 1995 model. It was a great trailer, and the only reason we sold it was because the boys outgrew the bunks. Our experience:
There are innumerable trailers for sale, and you will have to weed out lots of bad ones.
I used some kind of checklist like Jim W. posted; I knew nothing and it allowed me to reject many.
As someone above pointed out and as I learned here on the forum, unless you are looking at the high-end manufacturer, all aspects of the suspension will at capacity or over. I factor the rebuilding of the running gear as part of the cost of a trailer. I have a long thread on here regarding this.
It took us eight months to find our first trailer but we got a good one. I liked it so much we went with the same brand in a new trailer. The old trailer was better.
We bought our first travel trailer in 2013; it was a 1995 model. It was a great trailer, and the only reason we sold it was because the boys outgrew the bunks. Our experience:
There are innumerable trailers for sale, and you will have to weed out lots of bad ones.
I used some kind of checklist like Jim W. posted; I knew nothing and it allowed me to reject many.
As someone above pointed out and as I learned here on the forum, unless you are looking at the high-end manufacturer, all aspects of the suspension will at capacity or over. I factor the rebuilding of the running gear as part of the cost of a trailer. I have a long thread on here regarding this.
It took us eight months to find our first trailer but we got a good one. I liked it so much we went with the same brand in a new trailer. The old trailer was better.
JR,
Just read your reply more carefully. We spent $6K on our first trailer and $3K replacing axles, new wheels and tires, heavy shackles, bronze bushings, wet bolts, Equal-I-Zer hitch and brake controller. We pulled it all over western Pennsylvania and West Virgina - a weekend at Pymatuning Lake right by you. I think you can easily stay within you budget. We replaced a thermocouple on the hot water heater - $40 at the dealer service shop. Everything else worked great.
You might try a dealer. My dealer here in Erie, whom I have had a fair price from and good service, is loaded with used inventory.
Just read your reply more carefully. We spent $6K on our first trailer and $3K replacing axles, new wheels and tires, heavy shackles, bronze bushings, wet bolts, Equal-I-Zer hitch and brake controller. We pulled it all over western Pennsylvania and West Virgina - a weekend at Pymatuning Lake right by you. I think you can easily stay within you budget. We replaced a thermocouple on the hot water heater - $40 at the dealer service shop. Everything else worked great.
You might try a dealer. My dealer here in Erie, whom I have had a fair price from and good service, is loaded with used inventory.
I looked for a year, when I came across a smoking deal on my Arctic Fox. The reason I knew it was a good price was because I spent countless hours looking on the Internet. Then I got the price reduced by two grand on top of the already good deal. I have found over the years that the depreciation on RV's can be as much as 50% at 2-3 years old, but the owners balk at the real world value. Good luck in your search, I'm sure you'll find a good deal, and what you wanted, just have patients.
FWIW, I did have to travel 3K miles round trip to buy mine, but that's the magic of the Internet.
FWIW, I did have to travel 3K miles round trip to buy mine, but that's the magic of the Internet.
Jr, we started out with a Coachmen slide-in camper that was 25 years old when I bought it from a pawn shop for $1000. It was ideal at the time, allowing us to pull our horse trailer, provided reasonable accommodations (without a bathroom), and had been reasonably maintained. I had to replace the refrigerator (purchased a small AC unit), replaced the inverter/converter, bought a small generator to run the A/C unit, and a Little Buddy to heat the camper when it was cold since the heater didn't work, and with enough goo on the roof, it didn't leak. It was ideal for a mounted cop working the Talladega Races. We got rid of it when my wife started cooking three meals a day for the department and needed a bigger kitchen.
We found a 28' Fleetwood Prowler pull-behind about 15 years old that had a bath and reasonably sized kitchen area. I spent some major dollars fixing roof, floor, and doing general maintenance that involved replacing refrigerator (again with an AC unit), front power jack, hardware fixtures, etc, etc. The result was that the wife was happy, the department continued to eat like kings, and we felt that we had really moved up in the world. Of course, we had to make two trips with the truck if our horses were going to be needed. A bigger generator was now required to power-up everything but made us more comfortable and able to boondock when on disaster relief efforts.
When I finally retired, we decided to upgrade to a fifth-wheel and get rid of the heavy Prowler. A super deal on a 6-month old Cougar High Country finally brought us out of the continual maintenance mode, although you never really leave that behind, the magnitude of the problems aren't as major when they are newer.
Looking back, we've had a very enjoyable experience and look forward to becoming full-time RVers.
- Ed
We found a 28' Fleetwood Prowler pull-behind about 15 years old that had a bath and reasonably sized kitchen area. I spent some major dollars fixing roof, floor, and doing general maintenance that involved replacing refrigerator (again with an AC unit), front power jack, hardware fixtures, etc, etc. The result was that the wife was happy, the department continued to eat like kings, and we felt that we had really moved up in the world. Of course, we had to make two trips with the truck if our horses were going to be needed. A bigger generator was now required to power-up everything but made us more comfortable and able to boondock when on disaster relief efforts.
When I finally retired, we decided to upgrade to a fifth-wheel and get rid of the heavy Prowler. A super deal on a 6-month old Cougar High Country finally brought us out of the continual maintenance mode, although you never really leave that behind, the magnitude of the problems aren't as major when they are newer.
Looking back, we've had a very enjoyable experience and look forward to becoming full-time RVers.
- Ed
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I agree..... When we looked for our current trailer, we looked for two years. That amount of time helped us become savvy shoppers by understanding what we really wanted and whats acceptable for "used" condition, and what was priced accordingly for the condition. We eventually found a great deal. But the funny thing I found out about RV/trailers is that most people find they out grow what they have in relatively short time frames and look for something else. We've only had two trailers in the past 15 years, but I've met people who've had multiple units in that amount of time.
We out grew our 27' Wilderness W/O slides in two trips, so the 34' Arctic Fox is huge to us, with massive storage compartments. The keys what to look for, are the quality manufactures, and lots of storage. BTW, make sure your GVWR is a lot higher than the dry weight. I paid 17K out the door, for this unit in 09, so pay attention and you will be rewarded.
JR,
No first hand been there done that kinda comments, but leaks are your BRIGHT RED FLAG. Moisture getting in only makes problems. Look under everything, behind everything, poke prod and look some more. Under body inspection, look for whatever causes concerns, damage, repairs etc. Running gear repairs are just labor and cash not necessarily a deal breaker. Tires, look for date code assume you'll want new ones.
Got a moisture meter? Poke that into wood, get readings.
We miss tent camping but way too hot or just getting old enough to want some comfort but we still do almost all cooking outside on the fire.
Good luck.
Gary
No first hand been there done that kinda comments, but leaks are your BRIGHT RED FLAG. Moisture getting in only makes problems. Look under everything, behind everything, poke prod and look some more. Under body inspection, look for whatever causes concerns, damage, repairs etc. Running gear repairs are just labor and cash not necessarily a deal breaker. Tires, look for date code assume you'll want new ones.
Got a moisture meter? Poke that into wood, get readings.
We miss tent camping but way too hot or just getting old enough to want some comfort but we still do almost all cooking outside on the fire.
Good luck.
Gary
Thank you for the checklist Jim, I just printed it out and will be taking it with me when I go. I appreciate all the first hand experience and advice, I believe I am going to actually show this thread to my wife if this camper doesn't turn out to be as described, she is definitely the impatient one when it comes to buying new vehicles (and now campers). Ultimately she will leave the decision to me on whether to buy or not but she can be quite persistent when she decides she wants something :-laf
RVTRKN, Keystones website lists the model I'm looking at as having 1805 lbs "carrying capacity" and a dry weight of 5750 lbs. This sounds adequate to me but I honestly don't know if it is. The website doesn't list specific tire size but shows 15" tires so I will be looking at them closely. I'm guessing they will need replaced regardless if the trailer has been sitting.
RVTRKN, Keystones website lists the model I'm looking at as having 1805 lbs "carrying capacity" and a dry weight of 5750 lbs. This sounds adequate to me but I honestly don't know if it is. The website doesn't list specific tire size but shows 15" tires so I will be looking at them closely. I'm guessing they will need replaced regardless if the trailer has been sitting.
GAmes
TDR MEMBER
Normally when the dry weight and cc are added together the total is the trailers GVWR. 7555 is an odd number for a GVWR, so it is something I would check. The data tag should list the weight rating. Dry weight is usually on the low side of actual, but might be accurate. The dry weight of mine is 7235 according to the brochure, but I weighed it a mile from the dealer and it's actual dry weight is 8340. Some of that weight is from options I ordered (thermo pane windows, recliners instead of a sofa, tlr hitch receiver, slide topper, etc) but I'm guessing other things like the A/C unit is not included in the dry weight spec.
RVTRKN mentioned storage..... Something easily overlooked too since you see cabinet doors and room to move around but you forget that you'll be packing lots of stuff and if there's no room to put all your gear, food, pots and pans and clothes, etc., that becomes a problem. For example, one trailer we looked at had a very nice layout but after checking kitchen cabinet storage we found that there was only one or two little cabinets in that whole area and a pantry cupboard that was something like 4" deep. Not sure what design engineer would have thought that was a good idea.
The year my AF was built, all of the 5vers had 1/3 of GVWR as carrying capacity per the dry weight of the 5ver, in my case, the dry weight is 10,050 lbs and the net carrying capacity is 4950 lbs. The net carrying capacity is 1/3 of the total, and I looked through the brochure which all of them were at 1/3. Don't forget your liquids and cargo will decrease the percentage, but it is a good comparison to look for. Also 15" wheels were mentioned, look at the distance from each tire to see if you can increase the wheels to 16" and install a good quality LT tire. With 15's your limited to a less desirable tire and Chinese Willpop's. 15" wheel would be a deal breaker, unless it was upgradable to 16".
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Issue 128 – Digital Version
Digital Magazines
FREE!
TDR Test Drive - Digital Edition
Renew
Subscribe
Gift Subscriptions
Back Issues
Subscription Status
Address Change Form
Buyer's Guides
Ram Diagnostic Trouble Codes
The Perfect Collection
The Perfect Collection Vol. II
TSB Updates
Dodge/Cummins Historical Overview
Cameron Collection
What Makes Us Tick?
Product Showcase
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