Should I upgrade to an 05 or 06 CTD from a 98 12 valve CTD truck?

[AH64ID]

I am a little biased, but the dynamic and fully controllable timing of a CR is pretty nice. You can set, or have set, the timing for any mods and main use and have it thru the entire powerband with a flat torque curve which is not possible on then p-pumps. Realistically the timing differences from a tow tune to a street tune are minimal, mostly related to fuel changes. So it can realistically have 1 tune that does it all within reason.

Now it's not setup optimally from the factory, but the factory still has a flat torque curve.

 

[K5IP]

My 95 took me to Alaska many times.
Always dependable, never any problems. Unfortunately, I sold it and bought an 03 305 Hp nv5600.
Even though the newer trucks are nicer, I miss the economy, ease of repair, and just plain simplicity of the older rigs.
In retrospect, the brakes on my 95 were terrible, noise was higher, paint was coming off (after 15 years).
Maybe I should just buy a 2014, but at age 75, don't think it will pan out.
Happy trails.
Rog

 

[rscurtis]

I also had a '95, and the paint was starting to go after 7 years. The truck looks like it spent its life on the beach now. My signature truck is superior to the '95 in every way, and the only thing I gave up was a little FE in local driving. With the mods I've made to it, highway FE is better than the '95 ever was.

 

[BIGNASTY]

I am a little biased, but the dynamic and fully controllable timing of a CR is pretty nice. You can set, or have set, the timing for any mods and main use and have it thru the entire powerband with a flat torque curve which is not possible on then p-pumps. Realistically the timing differences from a tow tune to a street tune are minimal, mostly related to fuel changes. So it can realistically have 1 tune that does it all within reason.

Now it's not setup optimally from the factory, but the factory still has a flat torque curve.

I know its all in the way that each of us looks at things but really I don't think that my 04 does to bad a job, its pulls strong with weight, is plenty fast enough, (ask a kid in town with a Honda that he thought was quick) and gets pretty good mileage. I left it stock for the reasons that I see coming our way with the Higher authorities going to check and make sure that you leave it STOCK

 

[AH64ID]

I know its all in the way that each of us looks at things but really I don't think that my 04 does to bad a job, its pulls strong with weight, is plenty fast enough, (ask a kid in town with a Honda that he thought was quick) and gets pretty good mileage. I left it stock for the reasons that I see coming our way with the Higher authorities going to check and make sure that you leave it STOCK

They do great in stock form, but leave a lot of efficiency on the table. One can gain 40-60 hp and ~100 ft/lbs on timing alone, that's stock rail pressure and duration. That same gain is where one can gain in the fuel efficiency department. So while the trucks don't use a DPF to meet emissions they do use extra fuel.

 

[frank1]

I second the 03's! Only negatives ... ball joints (I guess carrying 1000 lbs. of plow hardware can't help!), fuel pumps and HVAC doors not functioning properly.All have been repaired years ago. Maybe one day I'LL add number four to the fleet! The 06' I purchased this past March runs great, however, 2-3 MPG's less than the 03"s .... but still a great work horse!

 

[HerbW]

Blend doors? I'm not sure what that is. Thanks, Herb

Herb, also keep in mind that the early 2007's (up to the end of 2006 production date) were also equipped with the 5.9L. They also had some of the known electrical issues, such as the trouble with the instrument cluster, fixed by that point.

We have 2 of them right now, an 04.5 and 07 both purchased new. With the exception of front axle u-joints on both trucks, ball joints on the '04.5, and the blend doors on the '07, they have been excellent.

 

[HerbW]

Funny. My 1998 CAT is upstairs in my barn. Maybe that's why the mice are gone. LOL I probably should want the CAT from the new one also. I have looked at 2007.5s and the turbo was trashed. they told me the newer ones have a factory clean out. Sounds like big bucks. Thanks

05's had plastic endcaps for the intercooler some got replaced as they failed . I have 04.5 been very good truck . don't buy 07.5 up as you will be dealing with DPF problems. Also be sure the CAT is in place when you purchase

 

[HerbW]

The search of rigs goes on for months. I found an "excellent" 06 for an excellent price. He wants cash only. The bank tells me cash can take a week or more to get but a cashiers check is instant as I have the funds. Then I find out the title is "Branded" as rebuilt. Darn..... I don't want somebody's wreck. So off to Craigslist for hours some days. There are local dealers that buy up any good deals from private sellers and jack the price by 8K or more. They then relist on Craigs again for a living.

I can see upgrading to the fuller quad cab of a third gen truck, however you're leaving behind one heckuva great truck in your 12 valve. I have no real complaints with my 04.5. Have you started the search for a replacement?

 

[HerbW]

Are the back seats much bigger in the 03-09 quad cab than my 98 without being megacab? I do love my 8' box.

"... the pinnacle years were 97-8 12 valve, 03-04 HO, and 2013-14 385HP with Aisin trans. " I agree with this statement. The only drawback I see to you current truck, other than it getting older, is the back seat size. I like my 03, although the back seat is a little small for teenagers. I don't ride back there and I have too much money into it to get rid of it right now. Decide what you need for cab size and what you do with the truck, haul or towing. I do like the "crew cab" body of the 2010 and up but I also like the engine you have. I chose the 03 because I like that version of engine compared to 04.5-07 and didn't need a mega cab. I also wanted a long box. The HPCR are quieter and the 4 doors are more family friendly. Each generation has it own glitches. In the long run it usually boils down to how much you want/have to spend and what comes along at that time. Good luck choosing. David

 

[HerbW]

Well my 98 does have now a billeted torque convertor(twice by me), heavy duty transmission, excellent interior, RED Sport Version and not a spot of rust! I put a crease in the side of the right rear box that bugs me that needs fixed. No paint damage just a crease from bumping into my boat rubber rail in my pole barn. It has never left me stranded in almost eleven years! The brakes suck big time. They always have. I wonder if a rear disk kit would help.

Don't do it. I regret every moment selling my 97 12v, 5spd 4x4. That truck was as stone cold reliable, efficient and powerful as they come, the problem was it simply rusted away. The dodge part couldn't keep up with the Cummins part. My "new" 2004.5 is a sexier, more refined, more user friendly truck, but the automatic transmission (in stock form) leaves a lot to be desired. The injectors are expensive when it comes time (and it will come time), the fuel filtration is marginal at best in stock form, the fuel efficiency is easily 2-3 mpg less than the truck you are walking away from (my experience mid 18's down to high 15's/low 16's) and with all that being said, I think the advantage to owning a newer diesel truck has come and gone. The outstanding mileage compared is no longer there, the low maintenance costs after the initial purchase have eroded as well. I think a real long look needs to be taken as to how you use the truck, what your tolerance for fuel economy is, especially considering the cost of diesel, and how long your really see yourself owning the truck. After doing all that, you may find that the diesel option just doesn't make $en$e any more.

If I could undo my purchase and get my 12v back, I'd do it in a heartbeat and pay the guy double to do it. That was the last truly great diesel powered truck, hands down. My "new" truck is nice, the rear cab area is much more usable, the ride is better, the interior is laid out better, but I'd trade all the "nice" to get the simplicity, economy and durability and unwavering reliability of my 12v back. I drive my "new" truck like its on eggshells, just waiting for the injectors to fail, transmission to give out and fuel pump to sputter and die. And my new truck hasn't given me an ounce of trouble, so I'm not scorned due to some large repair bill I just swallowed, its just I know that it IS coming.

If the 98 12v is structurally sound, the drivetrain is in good shape, then I'd run it until there's nothing left, then rebuild it and start over.

 

[HerbW]

Spyntec hub conversion? Did milage go up? Did you gain much for the hub addition? I see these conversions but they are almost $2K. I can't believe dodge had never offered hubs like the first generation trucks.

Chris, I agree and disagree on some of your points. As I mentioned that Herb is about to walk away from a good truck, I don't think the 3 gen trucks should be put down so much. I know that in my personal situation, completely restoring a vehicle is not possible. If it were, I would have done a custom cab extension and powertrain upgrade on my 'ol '92, which I think is even better than the 2 gen trucks in many ways. I know that there were some bad decisions in the spec of the 3 gen trucks such as the fuel filtration system, but I don't think things are as fragile as you make them. All of your concerns with the fuel system and transmission can be dealt with in a reasonable manner. I know I am still saving up for a secondary fuel filter kit. When considering the new 4 gen trucks, I feel as you do here. That I'm keeping my '04, and that, thanks to the gov. the diesel "party" might be over for most of us.
Nothings perfect.

 

[jgillott]

Blend doors? I'm not sure what that is. Thanks, Herb

HVAC doors under the dash.

 

[HerbW]

Hi Joe, Does your new truck get any mileage worthy of a diesel? I want to keep some mileage. I appreciate your advise with your time and experience in Dodge diesels. I find 08 and 09s with low mileage engines cheaper than 05 and 06. Are they bad years to look at. I do like the exhaust brake and tow/haul transmission options available on them.

I heard that the 03-04 cam was superceded with the later part number. I never cared enough to put a degree wheel and dial indicator on them to make sure. The end result was that most folks got a bit lower mpg with the later engine.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

2003-up quad cab rear seating is bigger than the second gen. I did not buy a new Ram from 2007.5 through 2012 because I was not thrilled with the diesel into the exhaust strategy. There seemed to be a lot of issues. Everything was fixed for 2013 and the 3500s are greatly beefed up. When almost new, I took a trip mostly on I40 through the mountains of northern AZ and got 19-20 mpg at 75 mph.

 

[BIGNASTY]

Is the Blend door problem caused by over use? meaning that you move the air direction control knob alot? I have an Espar heater and leave it on all the time during the winter and leave the control knob in the defrost position, Don't know how that system actually works but, I haven't had any Problems with the HVAC doors. BIL has an 03 and no problems with his either!!

 

[jgillott]

I honestly don't know what causes the failures, but it has been fairly common from the discussion over the years here. Mine actually failed twice within a few weeks. Once for the blend door itself and then once for one of the actuators.

 

[Wayne M.]

Spyntec hub conversion? Did milage go up? Did you gain much for the hub addition? I see these conversions but they are almost $2K. I can't believe dodge had never offered hubs like the first generation trucks.

Also from the other post, Herb, I've not lived with a club cab 2gen truck, but just having "real" doors in the back is good enough reason. When I got mine in '04, my kids were 1 and 4. Those back doors still get a huge amount of use! Ya, they think diesel stink and rowing the 56honey is pretty normal :-laf

I did the spyntec conversion basically to bulletproof the front end and to stop the clock on that part of the driveline. The ability to disassemble components to service and inspect was the big sale to me. The mileage benefit is about 2MPG at any time. Next to the cap, it's the biggest chunk of money I've put into the truck. I feel it's well spent.

 

[HerbW]

Nice!

2003-up quad cab rear seating is bigger than the second gen. I did not buy a new Ram from 2007.5 through 2012 because I was not thrilled with the diesel into the exhaust strategy. There seemed to be a lot of issues. Everything was fixed for 2013 and the 3500s are greatly beefed up. When almost new, I took a trip mostly on I40 through the mountains of northern AZ and got 19-20 mpg at 75 mph.

 

[JimB1]

Dealer buy back offers seemed like a blizzard for my 5.9's. About every other month, 4-5 yrs, highly sought after pitch.

Good to hear jd likes '13's+. Avoiding new 6.7's, not knowing when or if better engineering would evolve, was big push for me to get into last of the 5.9's.