That's IT I have HAD IT with PC (Not Personal Computing either) CHRISTmas

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With all the "don't want to offend anyone" pathettic ramblings going on. I want to vent a bit. I just learned tonight that one of our churches parishoners has spoken out (Who goes maybee once a year mind you) about NOT having SANTA give out candy canes this year before service on CHRISTmas eve.



It came about when My wife had a meeting called becauseshe is the sunday school director and is putting the final touches on the pagent as she does every year. This woman calls and is offended and instead she wants St nicholas dressed in century correct garb instead and all the childrens passages to EXCLUDE Santa. I FREAKED OUT sooooo Hmmm well let's see:



How did Santa Claus become part of Christmas? We all know the tradition of the wise men that brought gifts to the baby Jesus, but who is Santa Claus, and where did this story come from? Is he real? Santa Claus came from the patron Saint Nicholas. Saint Nicholas has a rich history as part of western culture and the his fame ties into the story of giving which goes with the spirit of Christmas.



Saint Nicolas was born in Patara, a village in Lycia (modern day Turkey) in the third century. He was born to a wealthy family that it is said owned a fleet of fishing vessels. After his parents died he was left with the inheritance from their business.



Nicholas was a devout Christian like his parents and was made the bishop of Myra. He was a priest during the years of Christian persecution from 284 to 311 when Galerius the Eastern Roman emperor created a general edit of toleration for Christians.



During his time as a priest and later a bishop, Nicholas was know for his great generosity to the poor, children, and one who came to the defense of those that have been falsely accused of crimes. He often intervened in their executions. He is know as the patron saint of sailors and travelers, probably due to his experience as a fisherman.



One of his greatest deeds was how he would give a dowdry (in the ancient world; money or property a woman brings to a marriage) to young women so that they could be married. Without a dowdry it was unlikely a woman would be married and was usually sold into slavery. As the story goes the daughter of a poor man found a bag of gold in shoes left by the fire left to dry. The gold was tossed through the window and landed in a stocking. This is where the tradition of hanging stockings came from. Saint Nicholas is named in many stories of his great generosity to the poor.



So we know of Saint Nicholas the saint, how did the story of Santa Claus come about? When the Puritans came to America, they had a dim view of saints and therefore the legend of Saint Nicholas was forgotten. In the early 19th century The legacy of Saint Nicholas was starting to gain more popularity. On December 6, 1810, The New York Historical Society held its first St. Nicholas anniversary dinner. John Pintard commissioned artist Alexander Anderson to create the first American image of Nicholas for the occasion. Nicholas was shown in a gift-giving role with children's treats in stockings hanging at a fireplace. In 1823 The Santa Claus legend was born.



A poem by Clement Clark Moore titled " A visit from St. Nicholas" today the poem is known as "Twas the night before Christmas". The poem was written as a gift to his children and as we know today has become a part of western culture today. The poem is a story of a jolly elf from comes on the rooftop to deliver presents to children. Santa Claus rides a sleigh driven by reindeer. Other writers and artists through the years have changed the story.





This wonderful story of Santa Claus came from the great saint loved by both rich and poor for his kindness and generosity. Though not celebrated in the US and Canada, Saint Nicholas day is celebrated on December 6th in countries throughout Europe. Though St. Nicholas was originally buried in Myra, seamen brought his remains to Bari, Italy in 1087. A church was built on his new burial site. This is were his remains still are today. Many flock there to honor his great generosity and love of children, the poor, and the falsely accused.









O. K fair enough however tell that to many a christian child that has come to know Santa as the modern world knows him as today. I say she should go to europe next yer on the 6th and have a blast. We are Christ Church . . The nation's OLDEST episopal church that jus celebrated our 300th year in the very same building that was built 300 years ago. LONG LIVE SANTA!! *pant pant breathe pant -- DONE! #@$%!
 
Tim, I agree with you 100%



I dont get it, why the church has cast Santa down, irritates me very much so! I grew up believeing in santa, but my parents were wise enough to teach me the real meaning of Christmas anyway, so I never thought of Santa or presents as the reason for the season.



I have gotten so sick of the PC deal around Christmas, it has actually damaged my veiw of this time of year. This year I say Merry Christmas to all that I can, and dont look back, if it offends them, good, they need thicker skin.



Back to the Santa Claus deal, my brother has a 2yr old, and they are teaching him that Santa doesnt exist. Actually makes me mad, it is his kid, he can do what he wants, but seriously, give me a break. He will get a talking to when it comes time for my wife and I to have kids. If his kids spoils Santa for my kids, there will be some hell to pay.



I swear, this world is headed for the toilet.
 
Stuff like this grinds me!#@$%! If a Jew were to wish me Happy Hanukah, why would I be offended? I would take it as what it is--someone taking the time to wish me well. It is the spirit of the holiday (any holiday, any religion) that is important. I may not believe the same things they do, but it's nice to be thought of.



As for Santa, my 10 year old started the hard questions. I told him that Santa is an idea, if not an actual person. Santa is the spirit of giving and as long as he believes, there WILL be a Santa. I feel bad for your nephew. Santa is one of the wonderous things that children have to look forward to that us older folks should look forward to also! Leaving the cookies out, cracking the fireplace screen, making sooty marks on the carpet (not with your CTD!) all so your kids are EXCITED and loving life. PC will drag this country down the toilet until we are no better than some 3rd world cesspool.



Merry Christmas!! If you don't like it, lump it.
 
Since when does 1 person being "offended" mean jack to the rest of us? Folks should grow a set and tell them to p*** off!! I'm offended every time I turn on the TV, so what? Tell them to get over it and move on with their life.
 
Timmy, you got all the way through that rant and never even said "ho, ho ho... "



... and you say you aren't PC... :p :-laf



I agree with ya, pardner.
 
Just tell that woman to present her own st. nick.

Or better yet, have her sit on a committee to discus it for next year.

Then make sure the best members are on the committee too. Bring it up for a vote.

What has happened in this counrty is the squeeky wheel ( loudest complainer) get thier way. Lets change it in 2008!!
 
Tim, I agree with you 100%

I dont get it, why the church has cast Santa down, irritates me very much so! I grew up believeing in santa, but my parents were wise enough to teach me the real meaning of Christmas anyway, so I never thought of Santa or presents as the reason for the season.

I have gotten so sick of the PC deal around Christmas, it has actually damaged my veiw of this time of year. This year I say Merry Christmas to all that I can, and dont look back, if it offends them, good, they need thicker skin.

Back to the Santa Claus deal, my brother has a 2yr old, and they are teaching him that Santa doesnt exist. Actually makes me mad, it is his kid, he can do what he wants, but seriously, give me a break. He will get a talking to when it comes time for my wife and I to have kids. If his kids spoils Santa for my kids, there will be some hell to pay.

I swear, this world is headed for the toilet.

I couldn't have said it better myself! You almost read my mind except for one thing. Saint Nick was real. The name may have changed a bit to Santa Claus but his actions were basically the same. I'm going to teach my daughter the history of it when she gets a little older. For now, we'll keep the magic alive. Merry Christmas all!
 
I'm far from being a religious guy (agnostic), but I agree 100%.



The other day - I was on the phone with someone I've never met and just before the call ended - they said: "Merry Christmas!".



For about 800ms, I didn't know what to say... nobody ever says that anymore... especially when they don't know you! I did the right thing, though and wished them a Merry Christmas in exchange. I always used to say Merry Christmas to strangers... why did this have to change?



Seems like it has become really bad over the last 8-10 years. I'd blame Bush for this, but I think even he would rather be able to say Merry Christmas instead of the PC, unmentionable alternative.



There are folks complaining about Santa saying "Ho, ho, ho... " because it could be construed as being derogatory to women. Link...



Merry Christmas.



Beers,



Matt
 
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I agree 100%



Besides I have people complain when my truck puffs a little smoke at them, and I respond by cranking up the TST and REALLY puff some smoke.

I think this PC crap is getting out of hand.
 
I'll bet she has a Lexus with a BIG red bow in the driveway on Tuesday also... and many other gifts...

I hate those freakin Lexus commercials...


I heard that a mall somewhere here in the states forbid the mall Santa from saying "ho ho ho" to the kids. They think it's offensive to little kids...

Then a week later, here in CT, a 33 year old woman grabs the mall santa while sitting on his lap, and he REPORTS it... he must have been gay...
 
Tim - - Just keep it up, and dround out PC. Everybody I've talked to this week, I've closed my conversation with "Merry Christmas" - - only one gave a slow response but did end with "Merry Christmas"



So with that said "MERRY CHRISTMAS" to all TDR members and staff





Denny and Gale
 
If someone were to say anything other than Merry Christmas to me I'd take it as a compliment. It would show me they are proud of who they are and want to keep strong of what they believe. I'm 17 turning 18 in Feb and I've known the Santa secret since I was probably 10 or 11 but when I was little this was the best time of the year. .



I've always loved Christmas time just because it seems like everyone (when there isn't a sale involved) is a lot better spirits, the smells, the lights, just the experience in general. I'm not very religious if at all and being raised in Utah where if you're not Mormon you're not accepted (I was told I couldn't hang out with who used to be my best friend because I wasn't Mormon... this was when I was 12) and I'm still in good spirits about people and their own beliefs. It's our life who are other people to judge how we celebrate.



Bryce
 
Whatever happened to "MAJORITY RULE"? This country is so concerned with offending ONE person, that we forget the rest of us. Tell that parishoner to go pound sand. And start her own church, with HER money, and she can believe whatever she wants.
 
The folks who try to remove Santa from the season generally do so from religious motivation, believing that if Santa wasn't in the Biblical Christmas story he shouldn't be in the celebration. These folks are pretty rigid in their beliefs, but they are out-fundamentalised by people who won't celebrate Christmas at all because they don't believe Jesus was born on the 25th. Others object to it because the Catholic church deliberately put the holiday on top of existing pagan celebrations, and they therefore feel that celebrating Christmas is tantamount to celebrating the pagan holidays.



I have had a few issues over the years with fellow church folks who think I am too liberal because I insist on celebrating Halloween, Christmas, etc in the traditional American spirit. I simply don't give a tinker's doodly WHAT they think, or what the pastor says, or what Billy Graham himself might say if he suddenly appeared before me. I am PROUD of my European ancestors and I cherish their traditions.



When I look at the Christmas celebration, I remember that my European ancestors abandoned their pagan faith to embrace Christianity, but kept alive their ancient traditions that had helped keep their people together for so long. I don't see evil in giving someone Yuletide greetings, or in Christmas trees, or hanging stockings, or anything else. It's a celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ, and the fact I choose to celebrate by including my ancestor's ancient traditions is not a rejection of Christ in any way, shape, or form. I will continue to enjoy eggnog, and Christmas trees, and elves, and Santa, and candy canes, and all the rest. And anybody who doesn't like it is welcome to smooch my big festively pink behind.



MERRY CHRISTMAS

YULETIDE GREETINGS

FELIZ NAVIDAD

HO HO HO HO HO HO HO
 
What frosts my *()&*( is the fact that, IMHO, the real meaning of the season has been lost.

When I was growing up, there were seperate "seasons". Halloween, Thanksgiving, and Christmas.

Now, in these live for the moment times,

its all about commercialism.

The stores start displaying the Christmas stuff around the end of October.

In my mind, thats why we're greeting with Happy Holidays.



IMHO, At what point did our society lose site of the real meaning of this season? And why?



MERRY CHRISTCHAUNKUANZA Everyone
 
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Well, this is the worse thread to pop up as "Devil's advocate", but here goes... :-laf



A large percentage of today's "Protestant Christians" will only attend church on "high days" - Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc. They like the warm fuzzy feeling that random. rare attendance provides - and do little in terms of religion or personal Spirituality the vast majority of the year, yet if asked, will proudly state as to the fact they ARE "practicing Christians".



Unfortunately, most of those have little deeper knowledge of church/religious history - theirs, or religion in general. Fact is, the "protestant movement" largely started with Martin Luther, as he abruptly pointed out some of the areas where the Roman Church had strayed from basic Biblical precepts -and had substituted many of their own - some in clear conflict with basic Biblical foundations.



The early Roman church had incorporated many heathen practices into their "worship" in an effort to better attract and hold those outside the Church - which is where the Tree in Christmas, and the bunnies and eggs of Easter came from - as well as the many Idols (statues of Saints) and stately rituals came from, and were passed down from generation to generation. Many of those have been adopted by later followers with NO idea where they came from, or WHY they are observed.



How many here who consider themselves "Protestant Christians", actually know what the word means - or WHAT it is they claim to be "protesting"? ;)



Santa and Easter eggs are only a couple of those - and NEITHER provides the slightest support for the larger meaning of Christ's birth, death and Resurrection. Santa Clause does little to glorify the sacrifice of Christ - and bunnies and Easter eggs (originally a heathen symbol of fertility) only act to dilute and distract the deeper true meaning and Spiritual importance of those Holidays.



And for those unfamiliar with the term "Heathen", that applies to those in ancient days who focused their "worship" not upon God, but upon various statues, devices and images - and included various acts of human sacrifice and physical abuse into their worship rituals.



So yeah, SOME of the more traditional, Protestant Christians who DO recognize and accept what the true meaning of Christ's death, resurrection and sacrifice means, get sorta concerned to see all that deeper meaning diluted with Santa Claus, Christmas trees (another ancient heathen worship device) and candy canes - or bunnies and eggs...



Those are the ones suggesting we put "Christ" back into Christmas - after all, Christ saves - "Santa" does not...



NONE of the above is intended to condemn or criticise the beliefs of others - only as this person's belief and opinion - apologies to any who prefer a differing viewpoint... :)
 
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