They're at it again....

[Briar Hopper]

Anybody notice page 5 of the latest TDR issue? Dr. Performance has a full page ad with some outlandish claims...

"We will out pull, out drag, out run any other diesel performance packages without sacrificing your factory warranty".

This would normally be quite hilarious to those of us in the know, but what about how misleading it is to new members?

Is it false advertising? I believe we've been told that DaimlerChrysler will void ANY warranty at the drop of a hat, if they discover evidence of fuel/air intake/exhaust modifications... never mind about the Magnuson-Moss Act. It's been said that Dr. P gets around this by offering their own warranty. If so, they should say so.

This one's for you, Barry Sadler. Have one of your customers, any one of them, but NOT a franchise owner, with a 24 valve & manual transmission, meet me next summer for a face-off on a Mustang dyno, either at Thunder in Muncie, or the Scheid Diesel Extravaganza.

Open hoods, casual visual public verification that both trucks are not radically altered, and still equipped with Robert Bosch VP44 injection pumps. No trailer queens. Truck must be driven to the event, and be licensed for street use. My diesel performance package? Why, that's a trade secret, don't ya know? Show me yours, I'll show you mine.

While you're at it, don't send that clown Smith, the franchise owner from Carlisle, KY. He has an attitude and a mouth bad enough that could start a major brawl in the middle of a baptism at the First Church of God.

Winner gets bragging rights. All other wagers separate & private.

 

[bigkavr]

Briar,

I like your style!!! I want to be around for this thrashing... . : )

 

[Dennis Garrett]

I might even drive over from Kansas to see this.

 

[gitchesum]

C'mon Tom, tell us what's on your mind



I've read the Dr. P warranty. It's kinda tricky. It says it will cover you if a defective Dr. P product causes driveline problems. It says nothing about a properly working Dr. P package causing the damage.

In other words, if the extra power you get from the Dr p kit causes your transmission to go south, they will not cover it because the Dr. P kit was not defective.



Here's the link, it's a pdf file so you'll need Acrobat reader to see it.

http://www.drperformance.com/pdf_downloads/dodge_warranty.pdf



Moss/Magneson ain't gonna help you a bit. Dodge sets limitation on their driveline products, if you exceed those limitation, you pay. Plain and simple.

Besides, $2500 for 80hp? Seems kinds steep to me.

 

[John_P]

I can personally testify to Tom's AWESOME black Dodge

dually!! I was at the "Scheid" rally this year and saw

what kind of H. P/Torque that monster is putting down!

Not only it is fast and powerful but the truck is ABSOLUTELY

IMMACULATE!



Tom, "Dr. P" doesn't have anything for you!



BTW, I am hoping to get out to see you towards the

end of the year buddy!



---------

John_P

 

[Lil' Dog]

If any groups magazine should be sensitive to this issue it should be the TDR. I haven't got the latest, but the last round of BS from the Dr. P. group has got me concerned as well.



Briar, thats callin a spade a spade, wow, if you don't get a responce, or even this thread deleted..... That would be suprising to say the least.



J-eh

 

[Briar Hopper]

Thanks for the support, guys, I call 'em like I see 'em. Gitch, you asked what's on my mind? The same things you just got through explaining. Put it this way, what if your little brother or friend bought a Cummins Ram, and being new to it all, fell victim to the false advertising these people put out? Yeah, yeah, caveat emptor and all that, if he's dumb enough, too bad. Well, that still doesn't make it right. It's misleading advertising, plain and simple. And they don't tell you what they do to your truck, for all that $$$$.

Out pull, out drag, out run?

It's not Dr. P's race operations out of Washington state that I'm challenging. Without sponsorship, I don't have the financial means to go head to head with them. But if I did have the sponsorship, I know my truck would win

What I'm challenging is their statement that they can make any customer's truck out pull, out drag and out run any other diesel performance package out there.

I'm not a performance dealer, which makes me just a customer. Therefore, the challenge is customer against customer.

Lil Dog, you'll see what I mean when you get your issue. BTW, I'm a Mack fan, too

John P, thanks for the kind words, good buddy, but you got a monster of a 12 valve yourself, and you know it !

Anybody else with big HP/Torque want to jump in and add to the showdown? No objections from me.

Once more, it's the misleading claims in their advertising that I object to.

 

[Boost]

I have never purchased any DrP products but I worked with a guy with a 99 5sp who purchased a $2500 Phase whatever kit from them. He said they told him he should have between 400 and 425 hp. I took this truck for a drive, and I am not exagerating at all when I say this, it felt like it had less power than my truck with only the EZ. 425 hp... . not even close. This is my only experience with his products and I don't mean to slam anyone who has his stuff but what my coworker got for $2500 was not worth it.

 

[MY6EATSV8'S]

LoL get em Tom

everyone from the last years telare event remembers the guy who was convinced by Barry that he could come down and spank everyone there. We had Piers out there bating him in until the old DR P truck broke. LOL

sometimes people have more money than brains.

He knows about my truck so I'm sure he wouldn't be interested in a pull/drag race, esspecially if it didn't include slicks.

 

[DHRA]

Dr. P butt whoopin

At the Bristol drag race that will be aired on November 27th at 1800 Eastern, there was an intense blue 2wd automatic that had the phase 2 system. He also was a self proclaimed "drag racer" and felt that he was going to show us how to race. Well, you all can see for yourself what this package will get you. And, he definately thinks his manufacturer's warranty is still intact, since this is what he was told... .

 

[Briar Hopper]

HeeHee, Adam, Eric, your trucks would definitely make the good doctor P in his pants. That is, if he was even aware we existed. He's probably off in some Caribbean retreat enjoying the $$$$ he has, and continues to, bilk out of unsuspecting Cummins Ram owners.

How about it, Barry Sadler? You out there? Can you put down your mai tai or pina colada long enough to call your flunkies in the States, and get this set up?

 

[Sled Puller]

Ya know, that ad is DISGUSTING.



Time to put up or shut-up Dr. P.



Any number of trucks from this site will SPANK YOU.



Give it a rest on your tricky warranty statement bs, we know the truth.



Gene

 

[drawson]

I had a older student last year with a 96 1 ton auto that had DR p's stage 2 in it pump and injectors. I took him for a ride in mine and he was sick so we got him a TST #6 plate kit and installed it. The plate that came out of his pump was a bosch plate and Joe Donnelly check the number and it was a 215 HP stock plate which was slightly forward.



The guy was extreemly happy with the 230 HP/605 plate and 1/8th the cost.



COme on out Doctor!!!

 

[C Schomer]

I know a father/son pair of diesel mechanics in Denver who closed up their Dr P shop because he was so hard to get along with, even with his own dealers. Sounds more like Dr Pr!ck to me!

 

[willyslover]

so Tom . . what do ya reallllly think

like Curtis said don't beat around the bush. . LOL



ps... I agree 100% that the ad is way out of line !

 

[Bill Kondolay]

I get the opportunity to drive a large variety of trucks, with different power combinations, different years, that is one of the fun parts of my job.



A lot of the behind the scenes going ons that i see in the diesel industry is pretty sad. I have had my share of disagreements with many vendor and mfgs. to say the least.



I have come to realize that the diesel industry is still in its infancy stage as there is new technology emerging on a weekly basis.



This tdr membership is an invaluable tool to its members and readers and has become a thorn in the side of some manufactures and vendors.



Where once a consumer was led to believe his problem was unique and or isolated, this site in many cases proves otherwise.

Vendors are no longer able make outlandish claims without being challenged on some front.



Most of the Dodge ram owners i have known and met that have Banks or Dr. performance products to name a few, are some of the smartest people you will ever meet in their chosen fields.



We are talking about electrical engineers, mechanical engineers, computer programmers , lawyers, doctors, and yes even gasoline & diesel mechanics.



If they have a flaw it is the fact that they applied the same respect to these vendors that they are afforded in their own fields.



They trusted the supposed professionals not to mislead them.

They also made an educated decision based on the advertising , brochures, and the technical information they were provided.



Contrary to some of the tdr memberships views, these professionals were relatively happy with the products they got. Remember they were comparing it to a stock truck .





Now with the input from the tdr membership and the rallys and get togethers , the test drives of member trucks with different products, these guys are being exposed to products & services they were not aware of.



Name recognition is one of the key attractions when buying a product, so if the name is familiar, the company is large, the ad is compelling, lets be honest guys , it works.



As for not voiding the manufacturers warranty , this is a legal technicality ,Dr. Performance , banks, and whoever else uses in their ads to make the consumer feel more secure in purchasing their product over their competitors.



If you blow up your engine , transmission , transfer case, torque converter, rear end , lets say anything in the drive train !!!



LET ME TELL YOU THIS, the above vendors are correct, Chrysler damm well CANNOT void your warranty. They are still obligated to warranty your radio, your power seats, i think you guys get the jist of it .



Briar & company , hats off to you guys, you will be able to save a few guys by your actions and words, bottom line is Banks, Dr. P and others that cloak themselves in this reteric know, marketing sells.



On a more personal note, oh boy!! if can I get 30 hp by buying a Banks exhaust brake , sign me up !!!

 

[MUDDY]

dr performance, performance my foot

i tried the dr p phase 2 for les than 24 hours. i had 275s and the tm ecm which shoulda given me 120 lb ft tq increase. i went to the dr p phase 2 which was advertised to give a 200 lb ft tq increase. i lost 7 mph up the test hill with a load. also egt went up, and they advertise it not to. also no change in mpg, and they led me to believe it wouild be better than my previous package.



false advertising. fraud and deceit.



i also talked to a former dr p employee who quit dr p. seems dr p would advertise his 12v pumps as new, but they were just turned up used pumps. not even rebuilt.



dr p appears to be a crook.

 

[Briar Hopper]

Bill, thanks for your insight, as always. If only ALL vendors were like you, Piers, Brett & Taylor at Edge, Dan Scheid, Dave Mitchell, and many others I'm really honored to be able to call my friends, then no one with a Cummins Ram would have to worry about the products/services that he/she was purchasing...

Bottom line is HONESTY. To me, life is about being good to others, surrounding yourself with good people, and having fun. If you can make a buck along the way, so much the better. Unfortunately, there are many individuals and corporations out there who are driven solely by GREED. I do not feel the TDR needs to tolerate such people in our midst, however, common sense and discretion have to prevail when attempting to identify such individuals or companies.

Those individuals who already have Dr. P's products, please understand that I mean no slight towards you. Every single one of us has at one time or another in our life, purchased something where we were misled, or did not get our money's worth.

As for 30HP from an exhaust brake, isn't that comparable to being able to run faster with a cork up your backside? Maybe whoever made that claim would be willing to volunteer to test that? Any volunteers to insert the cork?

 

[SmokinRam]

Very will put Bill...



Briar, I think the issue that you are bringing up has been a long time coming. Marketing does sell... I think it was mentioned best in the movie "Tommy Boy" where someone said, "He is such a good salesman, he can sell a ketchup popsicle to a woman wearing white gloves. "



I don't know how some people can sleep at nights... I guess the guys with the "Large Bank Accounts" don't have a conscience...



Let's keep this thread going. The world need to hear the truth...



Do I sense a "Vendor Shoot-Out" in our future...



Andy/Advanced Diesel Technology

 

[Briar Hopper]

Andy, yes, marketing sells. But a quality product, backed and serviced by honest people, sells even better. Not only can the person doing honest marketing get to sleep at night, he or she is usually overwhelmed by the amount of business generated, and ends up with more friends than they can put names to. A large part of this is repeat business, and new customers gained by word-of-mouth advertising. But I'm not telling you anything you don't already know, you and Doug have earned the respect of all of the TDR.

Dr. P depends on very aggressive marketing, to bring in NEW customers, I doubt very much they get repeat business.

BUT... they ARE getting business. The franchises I'm aware of, have been in business quite awhile, and continue to survive.

A vendor shootout? Have at it! How about the do-it-yourself fuel box vendors as a group, against the masters of inflated advertising?

Just one idea, that's all. I'd be very interested in seeing any other suggestions.