To Buy or Not to Buy?

[JGrefenstette]

Goin down the road today, passed Lowes Food, saw a real clean 1st gen in the parking lot. swung in, he was gettin in to leave. asked him how much he would take for it. said it was his sons an that he actually was plannin on selling it soon, gave him my number, in less than an hour his son called me. middle age guy owns a landscape company, moving and wants to sell. Its probly a 92-93, regular cab 4x4, auto, 250k. said he was gonna ask $3,500 obo. The main drawback for me is its auto, im a manual man. he said it jumps in an out of OD at highway speeds. claims he has a new OD module an hasnt installed it yet. Is that a common issue, an is it easily repaired? can i use that as a point to bargin on? any advice with that transmission would be greatly appreciated, i know nothing about the autos. i would get it with the intention of running it till the transmission went south, then putting a nv4500 or 5600 in it. i just sold my honda yesterday, an am now thinkin i aught to sell the benz an get a sencond first gen.

 

[KCJones]

I've had speed sensors go bad (3 in 15 years) and that will make the trans jump out and back. I just replaced another one this last month at $60. It's on the transfer case, left side. I don't know what an OD module is.

 

[JLEONARD]

I don't know what an OD module is.

He's probably talking about the TPS which is mounted on the pump. They get out of adjustment and it's usually an easy fix, but some mechanics have trouble adjusting them properly.

 

[SFPADGETT]

On the 92 / 93 the TPS is adjustable from below, unlike the 94+



The brake light switch may need to be adjusted, if it bumps going down the road, it will knock it out of OD



I would keep the auto, shift kit it (Tansgo, and install heavy duty friction plates and steels)



Price seems very good to me (Atlanta, GA)

 

[JGrefenstette]

great, thanks for the input. he used it as his work truck for his lanscaping buisness, says it has a 1 ton suspension, so i should asume he has pulled more than just some zero turns an weedeaters, possibly skidsteers and who knows what. could the OD problem be a more serious trannsmision issue? or is it pretty well limited to the few things yall mentioned? how does the brake light switch affect the transmission? (downshifting/neutral?) sorry im totally lost with the autos. give me anything from a 3 on the tree to an 18 spd roadranger an i can go through it, but not the case with the automatics. ive replaced some Allisons, but couldnt tell you what goes on inside that thing. thanks again.

 

[HHhuntitall]

I fixed one a month ago that wouldn't go into OD, and when it did, it would hunt back and forth, and then just go back to direct. The guy had already replace the TPS twice, so I crawled under and plugged the transmission temperature sensor back in. It's fixed now. There's a possibility it could be the electric valve body selenoid in the pan, but I'd bet it's either the TPS or transmission temp sensor, as that's most common.



$3500 sounds a bit high for the mileage. I just bought one, a '91 with 243k on it, pretty clean, but paint is weak. It needs a few wiring fixes, and I gave just under $3k for it. It's your decision, naturally, but I'd try to get it a little cheaper.

 

[JGrefenstette]

thanks for the input, thats good to know. im goin to drive it in in the morning. my plan is, if i drive it and check over it as best i can, and am still satisfied with what i see, then ill hopfully talk him to 3k, is there anything i should look for with the transmission? shifting? downshifting? TC lockup? ive never driven a 1st gen auto, do they shift hard? i doubt he has a tach in it, but that would be great if i could watch the rpms as it shifts.

 

[JGrefenstette]

just got back from driving it not long ago. ok yall i need some help here. first off i think is OD problem is one of two easy fixes. the thermostat is bad, i drove the truck for an hour, moved an 1/8th of the way to temp. easy fix. second, the OD button on the dash didnt latch in either position, an the light didnt come on. it just pushed in mushy and there was no feel or it changing position. odometer is inop, but the speedo works. is this normay with an auto, i know when the odometer went out in my truck it took the speedo out with it. so this may be in the cluster, not the speed sensor?? fan belt and tensioner worn out. front springs shot, and hangers worn, they clunk pretty good if your turning intor a driveway etc. pretty good oil leak, cant determine if its engine or transmission, cause its all blown over both. the truck never went into OD, more than likly cause engine never came to temp. 4x4 works fine. i couldnt feel the transmission shift, truck does have tach, egt and boost. so i could note some minimal rpm variation but it seemed like i could feel/hear it go from first to what seemed like 2nd, but from 2-3 it never gave much warning, just seemed to pull right up to 2k rpm @ 50mph. in 4x4 low, i could count the shifts, and feel them, but when i let of throttle it would drop back to idle, an once i came to a complete stop, i could feel the transmission bump like it was droping out of gear, even though i was sitting still and the TC was unlocked? shift lever is extremely hard to get outa park, on flat ground or not. if you just pull on it, it bout wont come out, you have to quickly jerk it out, moves through other gears fine. when going into Reverse from Drive or Neutral, the rear end and probly T-Case clunk very loud and hard. i put the truck in Neutral and checked the rear end lash, much worse than mine, when the truck was in 4x4 low, i put it in reverse, sounded like the rear end was about to fall on the pavement. the whole truck bucks when you drop in in Reverse. Drive is ok, you can feel it take up the slack in the rear, but it doesnt slam like it does in reverse. throttle pedal was unusually stiff, probly im used to my manual spec VE with out all the junk on the linkage and pump. after driving and checking over the truck, im inclined to offer him $2,000 an see how bad he laughs at me. He has owned if for just over a year, bought it from a friend who was origiona owner. says he has all records. is selling because he moved and is no longer in landscaping.



what do yall think? even if he takes 2k should i go for it. how much would a transmission, t-case, rear end rebuild cost me if i where to take it somewhere instead of doing it myself, that may help in the price bargoning.

 

[therabbittree]

go for it. . the mechanics are the small issues. . how is the rust? dents etc. . power windows?. . manual windows,?. . cruise?. a/c etc etc... a manual trans swp is not bad . . if you want to keep the auto a a 47rh would be a easy swap too and make it feel like a new truck... . the front springs always suck... the rear axle lash seems excessive. . but thats fixable... what gears does it have?... probably needs u joints etc again relatively easy fix. . the odo vs speedo is semi strange might be a issue with the crude computer on the late first gens. . the speed sensor is in the back of the transfercase etc... again. . up north we seem to worry about teh body rot first as you can always repair the mechanics but a perfect mechanical truck with a rotted body is still a rotted old truck etc. .

Thanks,

Deo

 

[JGrefenstette]

this is getting very interesting now. i called him, gave him the run down on what i thought about it, told him out right all that i found with it. asked him if he would consider 2k for it, he asked me when i wanted to pick it up, this gets even better, he called right back, and asked about my benz that i had mentioned selling, i payed 1,550 for that car in december. he said he would be interested in an even trade! ive got to do some serious pondering on this. is there a way i can wire the a switch to the OD so i can just get it in OD when i want it to for the time being, so i can drive it down the highway safly untill i get it all worked out??? thanks for the input!

 

[therabbittree]

I'm 99% positive you can wire it like you mentioned. I beleive my friend

Murphy had his firstgen wired up like that.

 

[dodgenstein]

The electrical connector for the OD is located vertically on the drivers side of the trans case behind the shift linkage. There are 2 wires in this plug. One is hot (usually blue), the other (orange/white) is grounded by the computer to activate OD. By running a wire from a good ground through a switch and splicing into the non-blue (orange/white usually) wire, OD is actived whenever the switch is on. Switch must be shut off when you drop below 35-40 MPH or the trans will stay in OD even in the lower gears. It is possible to get automatic OD control through a governor pressure switch, but the direct wiring through the switch will get it going, and let you test OD function.

 

[JGrefenstette]

awesome. thanks guys that helps a lot. i just got back from driving it again, i told a co-worker about it, he used to work for Cummins and has a '02 HO Cummins. He said he wanted to check it out incase i didnt buy it. so we went over an drove it again. i believe the situation with it being hard to get out of park is in the ignition switch, the key slightly rotats when you pull on the lever, and when you turn the key back the lever lowers. as far as revers goes, my buddy pointed out somthing i hadnt thought of. the slaming noise is only when you go into reverse, it dosent do it in Drive, so even though the rear end is worn it should have the lash take up just as aggresivly when going into Drive as it does Reverse, also when driving if you back off the trottle then punch it dosent snatch as bad as you would expect with the way it sounds going into reverse. this makes me think its actually an issue in the transmission it self, seems like the pressure is too high and its shocking the gear, or somthing along those lines, sorry im auto illiterate. i talked to a buddy back home who worked for dodge and now owns his own shop, he said those trannys had a recall for the check valve in the reverse gear, does this ring a bell? i dont know if thats directly related to this or not. anybody got a guess as to what it would cost to have somebody go into the transmission and fix the reverse issue?

 

[therabbittree]

going internal on the trans would be soem 4 a valve body / trans shift kit is easy. . but if your gonna take it apart / rebuild it . . just do a47rh then you have alock up torque converter. . just my opinion.

 

[JGrefenstette]

how much do you project that would cost? is there some one out there who sells a 47rh an will give a core for the one thats already in the truck?

 

[Flexiheep]

I would check the Ujoints first on the reverse thing, my truck clunks and the drive line rings when you hit reverse after the Ujoints start to wear. Remember that the ring gear and pinion interact differently in forward and reverse due to the helical cut and the tooth profile.

Even having a nice ATS transmission and converter I would take the time to put a 47RH in if I had it to do again. I am happy with my ATS transmission (lack of lockup isn't their fault), especially since I was on a 4000 mile trip when I replaced the 250K stocker. The lockup would make a hug difference if you pull a sail like my travel trailer. I will be going to a manual transmission if I have to replace my transmission again, I am tired of worrying about transmission temps!

 

[PToombs]

Jimmy, just trade and get the damned thing! For what you have in the Benz it's a good deal. These trucks have OD, not lock up. The rest of the transmission stuff is small beans. A good converter is a must no matter what you do, rebuild or swap to a 47RH. Most of the stuff to check has been covered already for ya, and a Transgo shift kit will make it awesome! If you need help, just ask, we got nothin' better to do!

 

[JGrefenstette]

hahah there you are pete, i was wondering when you would chime in. :-laf ok heres what im thinking. i went for a good long drive today in the cummins an thought the matter over if it amounts to a hill of beans to anybody, this is my situation and my reasoning for walking away from this deal. right now ive got 2 diesel vehicle that both run well and meet my need for transportation. the dodge is in need of a transmission/rear end rebuild despreatly, but i can make it last hopefully as long as i need untill i get a facility to tear it down and work... that is my next reason for walking away from the deal, im in the process of trying to buy my first home, an thats enough finacial hassle as it is. trying to have enough for a solid down payment. ill feel much better when im in a decent place an have made a few months payments and got my finacial prioroties in line. then ill really know how much i have left to play with. i think im going to wait, be content with what the Lord has provided for me, an get my truck in well working condition (rebuild transmission/new clutch, rebuild rear end, fix oil leak). im hoping to find a nice place before this tax credit deadline, then ill start making bio, an shortly there after start on the truck. once i get all that done, then i want to start buying, an flipping dodge cummins, an if i find one that is worth keeping then ill sell the benz then an keep the second dodge.



as for the reverse condition, u-joints are ok, rear end has lots of lash, it just seams the the issue is in the transmission, i thing either the linkage is out of adjustment, which could also have to do with the Park issue, or the pressure is just too high. there is a second transmission cooler under the bed, he said the origional owner put it in cause he hauled a lot. also, when i told him about the thermostat he said the guy he bought it from told him, because he asked about the temp gauge not moving much, that itd hadnt moved more than that since he bought it. :-laf i think they may just both be extremely mechanically ignorant. either way, the fact is he said it hadnt got to temp since be bought the truck a year ago, i would asume at the least it had been the way for a while with the previous owner. running that engine cold Especially towing, is terrible. makes me concerned about a lot of things, to name a few, head gasket, bearings (cold oil = pour flow/high pressure = errosion, accelerated wear on crank, cam, sleaves, rings, rockers, the list goes on. ) if i put a thermostat in it, and it gets to 180 for the first time in years, i can expect the radiator to give out, waterpump seals, etc. if i had a house an a place i could park it if i needed an work on it, i would defnatly grab it. but right now, man i just got to much goin on. i dont need the headache, it killls me to walk from such an attractive deal, but i think with some shoping around, i can find a manual one down the road that will better suit me anyhow. if any of yall are interested, let me know, i can give him your number. its near Greensboro NC if that helps. thanks for all the help guys, i really appreciat it as always

 

[JHumphries]

I can definately understand that. My projects are also limited by funds, kids, the wife, etc.

Good luck getting everything settled.

 

[Mel Fuelling]

You also mentioned an oil leak from somewhere. If it originates from the front cover,

the KDP may be responsible. I wouldn't touch a truck with a fractured front cover with

a ten foot pole.