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Truck Down-Injector Issues?- Help..

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Turbo Question

Why is it slipping?

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The Friday before last I thought I had either lost a tip or cracked an injector body. While driving on I40 the truck started to miss followed by a cloud of black, then blue, then white smoke. I didn't see any spike in the EGT's at that time and unfortunately I wasn't looking at the rail pressure gauge. From beginning to end the truck only ran for about a minute with no load before it was shut off.

So loaded it up on the trailer and hauled back it back to the house. Ordered the Miller specialty tools and pulled the injectors. Looking at all 6 every one but #3 were similar. It was brownish black. Unburnt fuel?

Below is a bad picture of one of the good injectors. Relatively clean with some carbon deposits.
#ad



Here's a picture of #3. The tip is a solid brown with no metallic coloring.
#ad



With the help of Performance Diesel Warehouse I had the injectors sent down to Formula 1 to test and modify to Flux 1's. However when they were tested all were functioning properly. I thought maybe the needle had stuck and was jarred loose during shipping (not likely at all) or the TST had messed up.

Before reinstalling the injectors I got my hands on a boroscope and peeked into each cylinder. #1,2,4,5, and 6 looked brand new. Crosshatching and everything. #3 had a brownish coloring and some minor scoring. Mainly in the 11 to 12 o'clock position. There wasn't any pitting or defects on the top of the piston or the ring that I could see.


After putting everything back together, following the 05' manual and SAG2's write up carefully, I fired it back up. Initially it sounded okay with a little blue smoke (probably due to having it apart). The blue smoke then turned to black and then onto white. When the key was switched off the motor dieseled for about 5 seconds and during that time the white smoke went back to black.

So, pulled the TST off and installed the bypass plug. Fired the truck for about 20 seconds with the same result. Off comes the entire TST harness. I checked all of the factory connectors and tried it again to no avail.

After all of that I pulled off the injector harness for #3 & 4 and started the truck. Other than the missing on 3 & 4 everything sounded fine and the smoke quit. No dieseling when I shut it off either.

I took an Ohm meter and the electrical diagram and checked each individual injectors positive and negative and then combinations of different positives and negatives for shorts together or to earth ground. All 6 had the same readings.

So now I'm baffled. It doesn't appear like its the wiring/ECM, not the TST, and not the injector. Does anybody have any Ideas? I'd like to get this issue fixed before I start worrying about the scored cylinder.

EDIT****My dad was working on the truck today and fired it up. It ran nice and smooth for 2-3 minutes before it started missing and blew white smoke. There was no blow by or pressure/smoke coming from the oil fill at any time.


Thanks to Performace Diesel Warehouse for the help and Formula 1 for the quick turnaround.
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When you replaced the injectors after they were refurbished, did you put each one back into the same hole it came out of?

Ryan
 
You could test the injector signal with an oscilloscope, so you can see if there is something bad, like a transistor in the ECM, or a short in the injecgtor coil, once it warms up.



The other is, the connectors to the injector bodies have a micro gap "edge filter" and one could be rusty, clogged, cracked, take your pick... .



Open valve cover and disconnect injector wiring one at a time to isolate the bad one, then swap it with another and see if the problem stays in the same cylinder, or not.
 
This Is the same crap that happen to my truck,Mine started running bad And it was bad injectors so I changed injectors and it ran fine for about 5min and started running bad again... Long story short I had algea our some crap in my fuel that was cloging the injectors. .



JHedman I would check your fuel if you can our cut one of your fuel filters open and look at it. . Do you have spin on filters our stock?
 
I'll change the filters and look at everything, but i have a hard time believing that algae would affect only one injector.



I've got both types of filters on the truck.
 
They weren't labeled when I got them back so the chance is slim.



Okay, so that tells us the problem lies with cylinder 3, not with any specific injector (except in the unlikely instance that you replaced injector 3 right in cylinder 3).



That suggests a wiring problem. It could be some kind of short, although who knows why it would take a few minutes to show up. Check the ECM plugs, looking particularly for the cavities where the injector wires are located.



Ryan
 
Okay, so that tells us the problem lies with cylinder 3, not with any specific injector (except in the unlikely instance that you replaced injector 3 right in cylinder 3).



That suggests a wiring problem. It could be some kind of short, although who knows why it would take a few minutes to show up. Check the ECM plugs, looking particularly for the cavities where the injector wires are located.



Ryan



I took an ohm meter to all of the injector harnesses and they were all within +/-10K ohms of each other. I don't think it's a wiring issue, but I could be wrong. I'm leaning towards a bad valve, but i'm still not sure.
 
I'm leaning towards a bad valve, but i'm still not sure.



You mean like a bad rail pressure relief valve? I was thinking that could be the case, but then why would it "fix" itself when you unplug #3 and #4?



I'm sorry, diagnostics has never been my strong suit.



Ryan
 
You mean like a bad rail pressure relief valve? I was thinking that could be the case, but then why would it "fix" itself when you unplug #3 and #4?



I'm sorry, diagnostics has never been my strong suit.



Ryan



No, an intake or exhaust valve. There is definitely something wrong with cylinder #3. Whether it be a valve, compression, or injector.
 
Bad valve or maybe a dropped valve seat. Someone else on here said when theirs went it didn't make any terrible noise but it spewed white smoke. That could account for the scoring you saw in #3. What year is your truck?

-john
 
Take injectors out and send out again get them tested. Not many shops can test a 3rd gen injector . If you need a place give me a yell and i can give you a few numbers
 
Take injectors out and send out again get them tested. Not many shops can test a 3rd gen injector . If you need a place give me a yell and i can give you a few numbers





He sent them to Don M ... ... ... ..... I thought he could test and/or repair :confused:



I'm bettin the head needs yanked as much as you don't want to hear it. How about the valve train ... ... ... . push rods, rockers etc?
 
This sounds like a fuel problem, except for no. 3 cylinder. Be sure you have plenty of fuel, and with your bore scope, check the valves on no. 3. May be you two problems. By it running good for a short time then going to crap, low or no fuel. Keep us posted.

LMcCary
 
Don M said that the injector tested fine even before he made his changes.

It's not low/no fuel because of the white smoke. I'm lost here.
 
J. Hardwick---- Yea, I'm gonna pull the head as soon as time allows. How do you like your flux 1's. I've got a set that I haven't been able to try yet and its killing me.
 
I love 'em. Truck is smoother at idle and under power. Probably more balanced than stock. By themselves, you wont notice them being there unloaded. Pulling the same load up the same grade you'll feel them for sure. Adding timing and/or pressure really sets them off!
 
Not enough fuel at the time of the start of injection or bad timing equals White smoke. I see this every engine building class, when a student miss times an engine or does not have enough fuel at the right time. And I have seen this on my old 93 12V when the fuel filter stopped up partially.

Could be an electrical problem, Again, no elec. to injector, No smoke!
 
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