ugly oil analysis using CK-4

[GrantP]

I'm curious if anyone else has had an oil analysis after using CK-4 oil. I bought Valvoline PB 5w-40 synthetic CK-4 (I didn't realize it was CK-4 when I bought it) for the last oil change and had it sampled as I normally do when I changed it out. Iron DOUBLED from the prior sample of CJ-4 Valvoline PB 15w-40 conventional. Mileage and driving conditions were nearly the same. Needless to say I'll be switching back to 15w-40 but wondering if others have seen the same wear increase.

 

[AH64ID]

I'm still running CI-4+ oil and don't want to make the switch to CJ oil, let alone CK oil from the sounds of it.

 

[GrantP]

Do you mind sharing which CI-4+ you are running? My sample results were good with CJ-4 but the engine apparently does not like CK. Maybe it was just a fluke, I don't know.

 

[AH64ID]

I run Amsoil AME.

PM me if you need a source or pricing.

 

[jgillott]

I currently have the first batch of CK running in my '07. I'll grab a sample next month when I change it to compare. I'm guessing I'm not going to be happy with the results.

 

[Killer223]

can you post the report? redact any personal info. i generally run a 50/50 mix 5/40-15/40 VPB. in my 08, and my 04 gets what ever was on sale (travellers from tractor supply) and my reports come back good.

 

[Killer223]

AH64ID, how many miles do you normally go on an oil change? you have a bypass filter correct.?

 

[amsoilman]

I'm curious if anyone else has had an oil analysis after using CK-4 oil. I bought Valvoline PB 5w-40 synthetic CK-4 (I didn't realize it was CK-4 when I bought it) for the last oil change and had it sampled as I normally do when I changed it out. Iron DOUBLED from the prior sample of CJ-4 Valvoline PB 15w-40 conventional. Mileage and driving conditions were nearly the same. Needless to say I'll be switching back to 15w-40 but wondering if others have seen the same wear increase.

Did you inform the lab that you used what brand as well as the viscosity, and any other information on the oil you used? I just had a customer that didn't put the correct product information on his lab request, and the report came back with several things out of whack. When I contacted the lab, and gave them the needed information, it changed the entire report. This is due in part by the fact that all brands of oils use different additives/base stocks, but the oil's are still 15W-40.

 

[Killer223]

i can't see how telling them what brand of oil will affect the amount of wear metals found in the oil... maybe the add pack, but the iron, copper, etc etc, should be the same regardless what brand or oil it was....

 

[amsoilman]

i can't see how telling them what brand of oil will affect the amount of wear metals found in the oil... maybe the add pack, but the iron, copper, etc etc, should be the same regardless what brand or oil it was....

Believe me, it can make a difference!

 

[Tuesdak]

Last time I went to synthetic was just after I got my 2003. Tried Royal Purple 15w-40 synthetic. Granted my engine turned out to have major problems, but, it didn't show in further oil samples as the copper went back down. What does show up is changing oils will change trends in your samples till it settles down to the new oil additives etc. Iron went up, copper was extreme making us figure oil cooler washing. The 3rd sample below was not Royal Purple...

 

[Killer223]

I get that different oils will have different wear numbers, what i don't understand is if I'm reading Amsoilman's post correctly, that telling the sampling company what brand of oil will change the output of the test results...

Say i take two samples from one oil change, label one as VPB 15/40 and the other Delo 15/40, the wear metals should be identical.
Now had i ran the to different oils, then yes i expect the wear metals to be different.
all of this, hinges on my understand of how oils are tested. and i could very well be wrong, or under educated.

 

[Killer223]

double post sorry.

 

[GrantP]

Did you inform the lab that you used what brand as well as the viscosity, and any other information on the oil you used? I just had a customer that didn't put the correct product information on his lab request, and the report came back with several things out of whack. When I contacted the lab, and gave them the needed information, it changed the entire report. This is due in part by the fact that all brands of oils use different additives/base stocks, but the oil's are still 15W-40.

Yes, I was very clear that it was Valvoline PB 5w-40 synthetic CK-4. I've had some correspondence with Blackstone after I received the report and they don't think it's because of the CJ-4/CK-4 change. Who knows.

 

[GrantP]

oops, duplicate post

 

[GrantP]

can you post the report? redact any personal info. i generally run a 50/50 mix 5/40-15/40 VPB. in my 08, and my 04 gets what ever was on sale (travellers from tractor supply) and my reports come back good.

Here's the report. There were several different oils used so the additive numbers change but you can see the iron numbers progressively going in the right direction...until this one.

 

[jgillott]

I get that different oils will have different wear numbers, what i don't understand is if I'm reading Amsoilman's post correctly, that telling the sampling company what brand of oil will change the output of the test results...

Say i take two samples from one oil change, label one as VPB 15/40 and the other Delo 15/40, the wear metals should be identical.
Now had i ran the to different oils, then yes i expect the wear metals to be different.
all of this, hinges on my understand of how oils are tested. and i could very well be wrong, or under educated.

When I worked in a lab, we used to test samples using a gas chromatograph. You would first take a known sample as your control and then you would be able to make your report based upon the changes from control.

Now I have no idea what these labs use for their test equipment or their testing process, but the would need to have a baseline control sample for comparison. Since each brand in theory has its own unique formula, they will have a slightly different control baseline to begin your comparison from.

 

[AH64ID]

It would be good to see the TBN too, but Blackstone charges extra for that (I won't go off on my ANTI Blackstone rant, but you should check out oil analyzers).

Iron did double but it's not horrible yet. Sometimes changing oils can do that, which is also a good reason to try and stick with one oil. Not all oil changes will change wear metals but I have seen it more than once.


The output of the test results should only vary for additives and NOT for wear metals. It's not the ppm that will change but the severity of the amount (i.e. not enough zinc for oil A, but perfect for oil B).

 

[Killer223]

Phoenix!! you live down south? no need to run 5/40.. IMHO. it is depressing to see the iron go up, but in my trucks i run 15/40. well. 50/50 in one, and straight 15/40 in the other.

 

[AH64ID]

Phoenix!! you live down south? no need to run 5/40.. IMHO. it is depressing to see the iron go up, but in my trucks i run 15/40. well. 50/50 in one, and straight 15/40 in the other.

I run 15/40 year round but it's a good synthetic that can handle sub-zero.