Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) VP 44 Or LP Problems? Speak Out!

[Crazy Horse]

Well the 02 is in the shop with a dead Injection Pump and Lift Pump. The truck has 35,000 miles on it and in like new condition inside and out.



The Dodge service dept wanted to replace the block mounted LP with the in tank coversion. I said no way!!! We all know of the short comings of this "repair".



The Dealer called the "Zone Rep" today and they are going to replace the VP under warranty. Current in effect warranies are the original 7/70,000-100,000 and the "Factory Extended Warranty".



How ever since I refused to get the in tank conversion they are going to charge me labor to install an OEM Cummins Relacement LP that I am suppling. After reading all the horror stories over the years here and at DTR I thought it would't happen to me.



Well now that it has happened to me all I want is a fuel system reaired as the truck was purchased so I can take the preventative measures to prevent future problems with a Walbro Pump from Glacier Diesel Power. Any thing that happens to the VP once this repair is done will be on me.



I'm sure it's been done before but as soon as I get the truck out of the shop I'm going to file a complaint with the NHTSA. Here is where you can too:



NHTSA Link.



It's pretty bad when you have to take it upon yourself to ensure the lack of problems down the road. It's the same thing I did when the truck only had approx 9,000 miles on it; ATS Triple Lock, Valve Body, and Controller. It was neccasary to do because of Slide in Camper that was going to be used. Even within the vehicles GVW rating the factory TC would not last. A lesson learned by my 1st CTD with slide in Camper.



Sorry for the long post had to vent.

 

[buddman]

LP & INJECTION PUMP

I also have an 02, I'm taking it in on Friday to replace the injection pump. .

I'm not to hip on the fuel path and how the LP and injection pump works. .

Are they connected to eash other. . should I also have the LP replaced. .

They told me that the will replace it with a updated version. . Is this the in tank conversion that were talking about?

I only have 59k on my truck and like you I detail the hell out of it...



I appreciate any input on this before I take my truck in on Friday...

regds,

Buddman



02' 2500 4X4 stock.

 

[Graphic man]

I would stay away form the in-tank pump... ... real pain to replace it and to remove it if you up garde later, and from all the posts it's not any better, if you can keep the factory L/P in it's org location and if you have to replace it, do it your self, and after the Warranty is up, look at up-grading to something better, RASP, FASS etc. etc.



Scott

 

[Crazygoat]

Add me to the lust of failer LP and IP... :-{} with 72K miles. Truck is going on the block.



TDR should run a tally of how many folks out here suffere from the same problem.

 

[Crazy Horse]

buddman Wrote:

"Are they connected to each other. . should I also have the LP replaced. .

They told me that the will replace it with a updated version. . Is this the in tank conversion that were talking about?"



<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



They are connected to each other, the lift pump is on the side of the engine block and draws the fuel up into the filter housing then on to the injection pump.



More than likely from everything I have read and learned the LP got weak not suppling enough pressure to the IP. The fuel is what lubricates and cools the IP. That's explains why more IPs fail during the summer months.



The "updated version" is what my dealer called the in tank conversion. The only problem with the in tank unit from what I see is the lack of pressure to the pump causing future IP failures on our 99-2002 24 valves. Here is some good info : Glacier Diesel Power. I printed this off for the dealer to read along with more supporting evidence of Dodge's lack of research and development for quality control.



It's allot easier to minimumly replace a relocated LP down on the frame than it is to pull the tank down to replace the sending/LP unit in the tank. That doesn't include the additional cost of the in tank unit costs more.

 

[sootgrinder]

Took my 2002 in today for occasional dead pedal and codes P1693 and P0216. They took a look at the codes, and bench flowed the LP. They have ordered the in-tank version, but said there are 387 of those on backorder. I asked if there was anyway to avoid putting it in the tank... you all know the answer. I want to put a Glacier Diesel system in, but I can't risk voiding the warranty as I am sure the VP44 is damaged. I guess I will have to play their game for a while. Funny thing is, I still LOVE this truck (Not so happy with Dodge :{ )

 

[Jeff Knight]

I got my truck back from the dealer last Fri with my 2nd IP installed. I already had the in tank in my truck. Drove it home and took the in tank pump out and install the GDP system on my truck. It holds 16psi at idle and no less than 15psi. The truck has 84000 miles on it. I figured I would be out of warranty before it went bad. Jeff

 

[rweis]

Why the failures on the 02's? Is it just they are reaching higher mileage or???



Bob Weis

 

[sootgrinder]

I think the mileage is just getting high enough, and the warranty is about to expire. Mine just turned over 71,000 miles.

 

[Nate]

I have 165,000 miles on the stock VP44 and lift pump

 

[sootgrinder]

Sometimes it is better to be lucky than good!

 

[The Adjuster]

I have 165,000 miles on the stock VP44 and lift pump

Nate, you know saying things like that is only going to lead to your own dead VP ... LOL

Kevin

 

[keioga]

Whats wrong with the in tank pump. How many failures have their been? I had one installed and ya the pressures are a bit lower, but steady. Truck is stock seems to be running just fine. I to tried to do everything installed a pusher had pressures 18 to 21 and vp still crapped out. High pressure, low pressure who the hell knows. Get the free pump and see what happens, the pump should be in the tank. Why put the pump back in the same place?

 

[Crazy Horse]

sootgrinder WROTE:

"I want to put a Glacier Diesel system in, but I can't risk voiding the warranty as I am sure the VP44 is damaged. I guess I will have to play their game for a while. "





Well I'll be getting my truck back tomorrow from the dealer with a new VP and a replacement LP (OEM location) I supplied them to install. Neccesary to get the VP warrantied. My Walbro 392 coincidently should arrive tomorrow as well... We know what I'll be doing this weekend to protect the new VP. As far as I'm concerned Dodge can stick their warranty on the fuel system just like they can with their lamo stock 47REs.



rweis WROTE"

"Why the failures on the 02's? Is it just they are reaching higher mileage or???"



It's not just the 02's, it's 24 Valves. As far as mileage my 216 came up with approx 35,000 miles.



I know now Summer Heat combined with Low LP Pressure will kill the VP quickly.

 

[BILLVO]

Had both of mine done a couple years ago at around 40k miles and at 75k put on a 150gph Fass pump only and put on the vulcan 1/2" line between filter housing and IP. I don't have a FP gauge but have the low pressure LED kit from BD care of Geno's garage. Just crossing my fingers and looking to see how long it lasts.

 

[Crazy Horse]

I'm also going with the Vulcan from the filter housing to the VP. It's now being installed with VP replacement @ the dealer.



YEA! My Glacier Diesel system just landed via UPS a day early!

 

[Camelracer]

I recently experienced the dead pedal and 0216 code on my '02 with 50k miles. Happened twice during a short period then ran fine. My fuel pressure has always been good. What I don't understand is the failure mode. If it was mechanical wear in the pump caused by low fuel delivery I would think you would see a gradual degradation. Instead it goes from running fine to no power and back in an instant. Why would downshifting to 5th cure a wear problem? It seems like an electrical problem to me.

I'm sure Dodge or Cummins has done a failure mode analysis but i haven't seen any references to it on the forums. If anybody can shed some light on this please respond.

 

[Crazy Horse]

I should have never taken the truck in to the dealer. I picked it up at the and drove home tonight looks like fuel maybe leaking-filter houseing lp area???



I'm taking the wheel well liner out and the ESPAR off tomorrow so I can see whats going on.

 

[Warpig]

If anybody can shed some light on this please respond.

Try this link http://www.bluechipdiesel.com/VP44INFO.html



Tim W.

 

[mhenon]

Whats wrong with the in tank pump. How many failures have their been? I had one installed and ya the pressures are a bit lower, but steady. Truck is stock seems to be running just fine. I to tried to do everything installed a pusher had pressures 18 to 21 and vp still crapped out. High pressure, low pressure who the hell knows. Get the free pump and see what happens, the pump should be in the tank. Why put the pump back in the same place?

I don't think there's anything wrong with an in-tank pump. And, from what I've read, this in-tank pump seems fairly beefy.

The problem is that 8psi max pressure and 0psi at WOT. Bosch wants some 14psi at the inlet to the VP44 yet DC went ahead with half that pressure.

I still have an in-tank pump but it now runs as a boost pump to a Carter mounted on the frame (the "Dynamic Duo"). So far so good and pressure with the two in series is very good. The jury is still out on this set-up. We'll see if it lasts.

Mike