What Happened to Dodge???

[HBarlow]

Dodge could increase the GCWR very inexpensively and quickly if they would use the same method that Furd and Govt. Motors use . . . fake it!

It would be quick and easy if they would hire someone from the marketing department of Furd, GM, or the current administration in DC.

Just have a talking head go on television and announce that Ram trucks now have a GCWR of 30,000 lbs. For another $1000 on each truck they could offer the super dooper GCWR of 40k for former Furd lovers.

 

[Grizzly]

Dodge could increase the GCWR very inexpensively and quickly if they would use the same method that Furd and Govt. Motors use . . . fake it!

It would be quick and easy if they would hire someone from the marketing department of Furd, GM, or the current administration in DC.



Just have a talking head go on television and announce that Ram trucks now have a GCWR of 30,000 lbs. For another $1000 on each truck they could offer the super dooper GCWR of 40k for former Furd lovers.

That's exactly the way Furd owners calculate their fuel mileage, they fake it or simply lie about it.



That's what my brother-in-law does about his SuperDuty Powerjoke.

 

[Wiredawg]

Hi Diane,



Maybe you should consider what I did... I bought a 4500. Largest brakes, awsome Aisin auto, very solid. Tows my 17K lb Travel Supreme great. Exhaust brake extremely effective.



My '02 3500 pulled it just fine but was about 5K lbs over rating. I chose 3500 Dodge/Cummins over Ford F450 at the time, understanding the GCVWR issue. Never regretted it.



The '11 4500s are perty too. Factory aluminum wheels.



Good luck deciding.



wiredawg

 

[HBarlow]

Ooops. You inadvertently spoke of the family secret. Last time I checked the 4500/5500 trucks don't really have any greater GCWR than the 3500s. The GCWR of 4500/5500s used to be 26,000 lbs. I assume it still is. Your 4500 is exceeding GCWR also but certainly not exceeding safe towing capacity.

The 4500/5500s have significantly higher GVWRs and can be ordered with lower final drive ratios for better towing capability but they still don't satisfy the internet weight police who worry about GCWRs and tow ratings.

 

[Wiredawg]

Havey,



You are right, dang it. My 4500 is rated at 26K lbs GCVWR and my weight ticket was 28,340 lbs. Only way to best it IMHO is to get a Freightliner FL 60 w/ a Cummins of course.



Maybe we just need to get smaller trailers?



Wiredawg

 

[Grizzly]

Wiredawg, those are my thoughts exactly, get a smaller trailer. However, if you're fulltiming, like Diana and her husband, you need a large trailer. If you're not fulltiming, why have such a large trailer.



Most of my trailer towing is in the Northern mountains of New Mexico and Southern Colorado at Forest Service Campgrounds where most have a 24' in length restriction. Even my 27' is too big for that, but I have gotten away with it. Also I would never want to haul a 38' 5th wheel to Alaska and back.



Just my 2 or 3 cents, george

 

[Wiredawg]

George,



That's my story... I lived in it while active duty in DC and Del Rio. When I retired, I considered down sizing, but could not find anything we liked. So, we upsized the truck. My TS is 37 feet long, a donsize is 30 to 32 feet. Not enough to justify the downsize. Carriage Domani cam close, bu no cigar.



Diana,

I have 4. 44s with double overdrive in the Aisin, puts my RPM at 70mph about 2,100 rpm. Getting about 13mpg empty and about 8 running serious grades. The Cab and Chassis has much heavier frame, brakes and components. I have an 11'4" bed. C&Cs turn tighter than the HD because of the wider track front wheels.



The ride is more solid than the HDs. My wife and I like the ride. I drive it to and from work (6miles each way). Don't have DPF clogging problems. The C&Cs are designed for prolonged idling, I believe is why I don't have DPF problems.



Let us know what you decide, no matter what it is. I have many friends who own Chevys and Fords, and we never mess w/ each other about it. To each their own.



Happy Trails,



Wiredawg



h

 

[HBarlow]

Ron,

Your truck is plenty capable of hauling the trailer you have. I wouldn't downsize. You have no worries whatsoever as long as the internet police don't go after you.

I used to get excited about buying a good used FL or IH MDT for towing from time to time. Fortunately, each time I got the bug I discussed it with Bill Stockard. Bill quickly threw a bucket of cold water on my MDT flame. He has told me more than once I'd be nuts to trade even my 3500 C&C for an MDT.

 

[Wiredawg]

Harvey,



Absolutely the 4500 is capable. I had looked at downsizing to get closer to legal limits of my '02 3500. Yep, the 4500 should be my last hauler purchase. By the way, I'm hot rodding the '02 3500 and putting Aussie stacks on it. Big boys like their toys!



Take good care,



Ron

 

[Barry]

Uncle Harvey,



You think the reason for the 26,000 rating is to stay out of the CDL bracket?



Nephew,

 

[HBarlow]

Uncle Harvey,

You think the reason for the 26,000 rating is to stay out of the CDL bracket?

Nephew,

Nephew Barry,

I don't think so because DOT has no idea what the factory GCWR of any truck is and they don't care. If you ask a DOT cop about factory GCWR you'll get a blank stare. The 26,000 lbs. number that matters to them is based on adding the GVWR tags or actual scale weight of tow and towed vehicles, depending on whether the driver has or does not have a CDL.

The GVWR is what would matter if a 4500 or 5500 was being used as a box truck platform or to haul the utility body of a mobile heavy equipment mechanic with tools, air compressor, hoist, etc. without a trailer. In that case, any GVWR under 26,000 and not pulling a trailer would not require a CDL.

But the GVWR of a 4500 is either 14,500 or 16,500, I've forgotten which, and the GVWR of a 5500 is 19,500. Any trailer being towed that has a GVWR or actual weight in excess of 10k puts either the 4500 or 5500 into CDL territory.

Someone here in TDR once posted that was the reason and when I first read it I didn't see anything wrong with his reasoning but after I thought about it a bit I don't think that is the reason.

Bill Stockard once did some research and found a website with specs for the rear axle assembly used in Ram 4500/5500s. He sent it to me. The GCWR for that axle was 26,000 lbs. at that time which was in 2007 or 2008. I meant to save that link but lost it some way. I think the limiting factor or one of the limiting factors was the rear axle. However, the 68RE and Aisin might also be limited to 26,000 lbs.

I don't know. We all know that hotshotters, some RV transporters, and some private RVers with Dodge Rams routinely pull more than 26k for years without breaking anything.

 

[Wiredawg]

Diane/All:



The GVWR on my 4500 is 16. 5K. It weighs 11. 1K fully loaded and fully fueled. I carry 12 Ton jack stand, 40Ton hydrolic jack, 61 gallons additional fuel, boards to carry jaclk stands and about 300lbs of tools. This has an 11''4" bed that I added extra 5K Lb cargo rings. I decked it w/ back up camera syst for truck and RV on the same 7" LCD color screen. It has night vision too. w/ 160' wide view and sizing. I added speakers in the dash and sould syst is grat. I love this truck! You oghta go drive one.



Suggestion for test drive: w/ Aisen, accelertate at an increasing pressure on the acclerator... the transmission actually optimize the power/torque of the engine like getting on intersptes w/ truck fully warmed up. I'm talking about 1/3 speed of flooring it, It will suprise you! Maybe the dealer too, if he/her is with you. :-laf



I towed our 37 foot, 17K lb up 7% grades. transmission would shift down to 5th 3/4ths way up, but never droped below 65 mph w/ cruise set on 70 mph. a couple times coming down the step grade, I toggled down to Tow/Haul, locks out 2nd overdrive (6th) to 1st overdrive (5th), where shifting is delayed, trannt/torqu converter and exhaust brake become aggressive. I use tow haul when going through towns/cities for the extended shifting and agressive exhaust brake. Ive used in heavy rain, no skidding or loss of control. I would be caustious on snow/ice and would not drive over 15 mPH on ice until I could stop somwhere.



please share whatever you do w/ the rest. If you buy a Ford, I'd still be happy for you and wish yount best.



Take care and have fun test driving... don't be scared, drive it like you stoles it, .



Wiredawg



Anywy

 

[AHarris]

400 hp at 2800 rpm and 800 ft lbs at 1600 rpm that's impressive for a stock diesel truck , I'm hoping Cummins will make a few engines for Ram that powerful , as of now Cummins only offers a 750 ft lb engine in a 6. 7

Actually it's 650 ft pounds of torque and 350 horsepower.

 

[Bug Out]

I towed my 40' toy hauler through the Eisenhower pass/tunnel this last summer with my stock CTD in my 2005 Dodge q/cab 1ton 6 spd w/4:10 rears.



The GCVWR between the two is around 25K. A little over the factory GCVW ratings. By the time i got to the top on the grade, I was in 3rd gear, 2500 RPM and the MPG light was at 3MPG. My heater was on also to keep motor temps down.



That was the hardest my Dodge has ever had to work to pull that combo up a hill.





Now, am I going to run out and buy a cheby or furd, no..... I'm happy with my 2005 stock CTD.



Would i take I-70 again with the truck 5th combo? No...

 

[Dutch & Di]

I think I'd like to get back on Topic. I KNOW that my 1996 Dodge can haul our Carriage all over the country as we've been doing it for 14 years years of fulltiming including Alaska & the entire Coast Highway #1.
My original post was about the fact that Chevy's book sitting on my table says I can do 29K. I don't care about who's doing what to the numbers, I was talking about 3 things.
1. I see no reason to shell out big bucks for a Dodge that still won't make me "legal". I might as well stay with what we have BUT it would be nice to have a new truck.
2. I was talking about worse case scenario that if you did have something really unfortunate happen and somehow it could be proven you were overloaded, that could take a big bite or worse out of any nest egg one may have. I know that I'd stand a lot better chance of coming out on the upper end if I could show that I bought a truck based on the brochures stating I was pulling with a truck with ratings that work for my RV.
3. My main issue is that if Ford & Chevy can produce trucks with those numbers, I just don't understand why Dodge cant.
And a 4500, which I don't want, doesn't have a high enough rating either.
I'm not bashing Dodge, I would LOVE to have a shiny new Dodge but ratings will have to improve for their to be a Dodge in my immediate future.
Maybe the reps will be at May Madness again this year and I can corner them!!!!!!!! Diana

I towed my 40' toy hauler through the Eisenhower pass/tunnel this last summer with my stock CTD in my 2005 Dodge q/cab 1ton 6 spd w/4:10 rears.

The GCVWR between the two is around 25K. A little over the factory GCVW ratings. By the time i got to the top on the grade, I was in 3rd gear, 2500 RPM and the MPG light was at 3MPG. My heater was on also to keep motor temps down.

That was the hardest my Dodge has ever had to work to pull that combo up a hill.


Now, am I going to run out and buy a cheby or furd, no..... I'm happy with my 2005 stock CTD.

Would i take I-70 again with the truck 5th combo? No...

 

[AH64ID]

I would like to see Dodge bump their hp/tq numbers becuase I think it effects sales for people new to Dodge/Cummins or first time diesel owners. There are people that only care about the published specs.



I do everything I need to on my truck with stock power, the improvements I have made are for engine longevity, economy, and durability, the power increase associated is a bonus. Here in a few months when I am done with this next round of mods I will be at about 400/800 to the ground, and doubt I ever really use it when on hills. I currently set the speed I feel is safe and engage the cruise and roll up any hill with ease. But some people think it take 400hp to tow a 5er at 75 up a pass, and thats probably true but why are you towing a 5er at 75 up a pass?



But if Dodge wants to keep a competitive edge they need to look as good on paper, its the simple truth to how our world works today.

 

[Grizzly]

Diana, This thread is getting old. We keep saying the same things over and over.



The way I see it is you have two choices; Go buy a Chevy or Furd with the numbers you want or get a smaller/lighter 5th wheel.



george

 

[Barry]

Amazing... ... ... ... ..... these discussions are absolutely amazing.



I have been in the RV biz for over 20 years. In that course of time, I have looked at an innumerable amount of motor homes. With the exception of a handful of class C's, I have never seen a full grown motorhome with a PowerStroke or a DuraMax engine.



Cummins motors have over 90% of the market share of diesel motor homes. The rest is Cat with a few MBZs thrown in the mix.



The choice is clear to most of us. 6 in a row and built to tow.



mi dos centavos... ... .....

 

[AClayton]

The new Workhorse Chassis had an available Navistar 6. 4l V8 diesel which was a Powerstroke..... although detuned to 230hp and 600tq. I haven't been researching MH's too much lately and admit to being a little rusty with my memory, but I don't know if they are still using them now. I think the fuel mileage they claimed was a little off and sales weren't as good as originally predicted. I will look it up though!



Alan

 

[Barry]

Well, since Navistar aquired Workhorse and Monaco, it was a natural to try and do something with the V8 diesels... ... ... ... ..... Shame, the DTE 466 was a great engine... ... ..... been around a long time.



At low altitudes the 8. 1 gasser will run circles around the 6. 4... ... ... ... . the 8. 1 is a force to be respected.