Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Who's got the new tank mounted lift pump??

[mhenon]

"I was wondering how others have had their wiring etc. installed for this retrofit. On my truck they just zip-tied a relay harness to some loose wire under the hood and ran an in-line fuse to the left side battery + post terminal. The harness ties into the old lift pump connector and looks like it runs down to the body harness connector behind the left front wheel well. This just seems really poorly done and prone to corrosion etc. It sure doesn't look "Factory. ""



Mine looks just like yours. Just had it done a few weeks ago. . and so far it runs good. I'm going to re-install the lift pump soon and let the in-tank pump work as a pusher. I checked the flow on the new pump and it's putting out a nice steady stream of fuel. . but no where near the pressure of the old LP. The two pumps working in series should feed the VP just fine. Waiting on a fuel pressure guage first. I want to see what the pressure is with the in-tank pump vs in-tank + LP.

Mike

 

[cyborg]

My fuel pressure light came on yesterday morning. Worked like I had hoped.

First the dealer made an appointment, I was describing the problem, he pipes in with " Oh I'm sorry, we're not doing anymore warranty work on diesels".

Round and round we go.

I dropped it off yesterday, they called today saying the in tank pump should be done tomorrow.

I'm at 90k. I'm going to check for codes (0216?), if all clear I'm going to install a regular lift pump in the original location.

That should keep the pressure up.

 

[BKeibler]

I just had the new intank lp installed last week. At idle speed fuel pressure is 6. 5 psi. Driving 60mph it goes to 5. 5 and when I get on it to pass it will bottom out to 1 psi. I went back to dealer questioning such low fuel psi. I was told that they now go by volume of fuel flow not psi. They then gave copies of charts and graphs for me to look at. Did not do anything for me to look at. My question is where are we with this pump if fuel psi is no longer a concern with DC? My pump was installed under warrenty, 7 year or 100,00 miles. I have only 42,000 on my stock 02. I think we need to know what is acceptable fuel psi with the new pump. Nobody seems to now

 

[.44 mag]

After having the new in-tank pump now for a little while, pressure has stabilized at about 12psi @ idle and between 8 to 10 psi cruising light load. When I hit WOT the pressure drops to about 3 to 4psi. The truck was really sluggish at first, but it has come back around to about what it was before the old pump failed ( I'm assuming that the computer had to learn itself again or something ).



Anyhow, what about reinstalling the block mounted pump along with this new one? They are using the old wiring to power up the new pump. Is it possible to just splice in a tap to a block mounted pump and then do away with the bulkhead that was installed in its' place? What's the down side to doing this? I know that Dodge has not always designed things in our best interest, but don't you think they would have left the block mounted pump functional and just added this new one as a "pusher" if that would work?



Thanks!

 

[rweis]

RASP works well, and NOT DC designed.



Bob Weis

 

[Fishin Guide]

RASP works well, and NOT DC designed.



Bob Weis

Imagine that! :-laf



Dave

 

[McDowra]

Deductible is $100 on the 5/100 Cummins extended warranty.

nope there is no deductable on the 5/100 warranty. Dodge is required to offer the warranty at no charge by the feds.

 

[CO Lineman]

I wish I only had a few miles on my truck but I am pushing about 120 now so it is on me to replace it. I called the cummins dealer in Denver and can get one from them for $165... . I asked the dealer if dodge was going to pay for any of it and they didn't even mention replacing it under warranty if I had any left... . So now the another question... How hard is it to change the lift pump I have seen a couple guys say it takes about an hour the first time and less the next time after that but I would like to hear how I do it and some tricks... Don't have the money for RASP right now or I would do that and the boss (my wife) can't justify putting more money into a truck i plan on getting rid of in the next couple of years. .

 

[mhenon]

"Anyhow, what about reinstalling the block mounted pump along with this new one? They are using the old wiring to power up the new pump. Is it possible to just splice in a tap to a block mounted pump and then do away with the bulkhead that was installed in its' place? What's the down side to doing this? I know that Dodge has not always designed things in our best interest, but don't you think they would have left the block mounted pump functional and just added this new one as a "pusher" if that would work?"



You can just put the old LP back where it was and re-install the original wiring. That will leave your new in-tank pump with no power to the relay they installed. I'm just going to add a toggle switch in the cab to activate the relay. I'll leave the toggle switch "on" and wire it so it comes on when the key is turn to the "accessory" or "on" position. The cigar lighter is a 20 amp circuit that gets 12 volts when the key is "on" so I'll probably tap that.

*************************************



"... . So now the another question... How hard is it to change the lift pump I have seen a couple guys say it takes about an hour the first time and less the next time after that but I would like to hear how I do it and some tricks. . "



CO Lineman... the lift pump has two 17mm banjo bolts (inlet & outlet of pump) and three mounting bolts. It's a little bit of a squeeze to get your hands down to the pump. . but really a simple job.

Mike

 

[Fishin Guide]

I wish I only had a few miles on my truck but I am pushing about 120 now so it is on me to replace it. I called the cummins dealer in Denver and can get one from them for $165... . I asked the dealer if dodge was going to pay for any of it and they didn't even mention replacing it under warranty if I had any left... . So now the another question... How hard is it to change the lift pump I have seen a couple guys say it takes about an hour the first time and less the next time after that but I would like to hear how I do it and some tricks... Don't have the money for RASP right now or I would do that and the boss (my wife) can't justify putting more money into a truck i plan on getting rid of in the next couple of years. .

15- 20 minutes if I slow down to BS.



Dave

 

[Huff N Puff]

This would be drastic improvement

Apologies in advance if this is a silly question, but I haven't been following the in-tank retrofit scene very closely: Can the in-tank retrofit be installed while leaving the existing engine-mounted LP in place, kind of like a modified pusher pump set up?



Anyone have any luck getting partial or full credit from DCX on an out-of-warranty vehicle? I'm on LP #4 at 129k miles.



Thx



Tim

No apology nessesary,because that is an exellent question,The system you propose would be a really good fuel system. I would use a new pump on the outside though. As I see it the whole weekness of the old design was that the lift pump was mounted to high drawing a heavy fuel through a very leaky restrictive fuel lines. Pressurizing the lines from the tank up, can move a more solid volume of fuel than trying to suck it out of the tank,with a group of pumps out side the tank. Whether its turbo chargers moving air or fuel pumps moving fuel, the volume is controlled by the effective area of the intake.

 

[CO Lineman]

Well that sounds good I will have to run to Denver and get one... I should see about getting it tested because it is pretty constant at 7 psi but if I put my foot in the throttle and bring up the boost it goes up to around 14 psi and only for a few seconds and then goes back down to 7 psi.

 

[HChojnacki]

Hi guy just thought you might like to know that I just put on a new vp44 and Lp at 43,000 miles {still under warranty}then went and had a inline pump put in and now I got a pressure gauge installed to {machanical gauge} I now get 26lbs. at idle, 24lbs. at cruse and some times even 29 lbs. at idle. Their is a little trick to putting in the gauge make shoure you bleed all air out of line before attatching to gauge. HJC.

 

[isb360]

Double the 15-20 min estimate if you are wrestling with stainless braided lines from the MaxFlow kit...

 

[mhenon]

Just got a fuel guage installed to check pressures on the new in-tank pump.

BAD NEWS! Idle pressure is about 7psi. It runs down the road at about 4psi and WOT will suck it down close to zero. I can't believe the VP44 will survive for long with the pressures this low.

I'm back to debating whether to just sell the truck or try putting the old LP back on and hope the tank pump can keep it going. I would think the two pumps working in series can keep the fuel pressure up there. As nobody's done it yet this is just speculation.

I will call the dealer that did the install and see if they're having any complaints so far. They told me they've done quite a few new installs to date and they thought it was the solution to the LP problems. I wonder if they really no what kind of pressure this thing puts out or if they just like the idea of an in-tank pusher pump.

Anyway, I don't like the looks of this fuel pressure. If the pump gets weak with age (like the oem LP) you could cook the VP in no time.

Mike

 

[mhenon]

Just talk to the service deptment on this low pressure thing. They haven't had any complaints yet but were in agreement with me that the VP wouldn't last running like this. They want me to give them the truck for a few hours so they can document the pressures and contact DC.

We'll see what happens!

Mike

 

[no-xqsz]

I got the in-tank replacement and saw 8psi at idle and could pull it down to 0psi under WOT and this is a stock truck.



Part of the issue is that the replacement includes an aluminum block with a 1/4" passage, I believe, that goes in place of the engine mounted LP. Between that small passage in the aluminum block, the 2 banjo bolts on either side of the aluminum block, 2 banjo bolts on the fuel filter, and the banjo bolt on the VP44, there is a great deal of restriction.



I did away with the banjo bolts and replaced the fuel lines such that I have a 1/2" line between the fuel filter and VP44 and a 3/8" line between the fuel filter and the hard fuel line on the frame.



It improved my idle psi by 1-2psi and I can't pull it down below 5psi under WOT.

 

[cyborg]

I haven't seen the block. Could it be drilled out?

 

[Huff N Puff]

Don't use the the original connector to power up the second pump

After having the new in-tank pump now for a little while, pressure has stabilized at about 12psi @ idle and between 8 to 10 psi cruising light load. When I hit WOT the pressure drops to about 3 to 4psi. The truck was really sluggish at first, but it has come back around to about what it was before the old pump failed ( I'm assuming that the computer had to learn itself again or something ).



Anyhow, what about reinstalling the block mounted pump along with this new one? They are using the old wiring to power up the new pump. Is it possible to just splice in a tap to a block mounted pump and then do away with the bulkhead that was installed in its' place? What's the down side to doing this? I know that Dodge has not always designed things in our best interest, but don't you think they would have left the block mounted pump functional and just added this new one as a "pusher" if that would work?



Thanks!

Dodge uses the original connecter to control a relay to power up the lift pump in the tank use that same relay to power up the second pump. By the way, putting a second pump on with the intank pump will net you 20psi and alot better fuel delivery than lining up pumps out side the tank.

 

[cyborg]

I just had the in-tank pump installed. Friday.

A fry-tech from McDonalds could have done a better job. The wires were just laid on top of everything including the rag joint and zip-tied to the brake lines. I almost took photos. Instead I tidied things up and ran the wires in the looms. At this point the warranty just gets the stuff on the truck.



The only sign of a bad lift pump was the indicator light I installed. The truck has never missed or stumbled. I check codes before dropping off at the dealer, 1693, 0500, 0216. When I picked up the truck, codes clear.

After running on the freeway 80 mph, 0216. Fuel pressure is 10 psi at idle.

Cleared code. The truck still has never missed or stumbled.



Will drive it easy today and see if 0216 pops it's ugly head.



Now, "riddle me this"

a If there is no 0216 after a day of easy driving, could that mean Low fuel pressure alone is causing the death code?

b Does low fuel pressure by itself trigger 0216?

c Considering the above would rule out the VP, will replacing the original lift pump as a helper void the 100k warranty?

d If R&Red under warranty can VP be ReManufactured, or should it be new?

e Will dealer R&R VP on death code alone? 10 k left on warranty!!