The official engine failure thread.

[Roc Doc]

This forum doesn't get a lot of action, but I'm hoping some qualified people will start to frequent and add to the validity of the data.

Anyway, I'm at 6300 miles on my 2015 with no issues, but a colleague has a 2014 in the shop with a total engine failure. He had just under 30,000 miles on it when a low oil pressure light came on at a stoplight. He's not a mechanical idiot and has build a few engines (350 chevy and the like) in years past, so he opened the hood to listen for rod knock or ticking or any of the sounds you'd associate with low oil pressure, and heard nothing out of the ordinary. Got back in and as soon as he brought the revs up the light went out, so he drove it a little more and then it did it again at idle, so he took it to the dealer where they found lots of shiny stuff in the oil. At first they told him it was likely a faulty sender, but after looking at the oil they realized it had chewed some bearings. They are going to replace the engine under warranty, and some other internet research shows that "possibly" some early engines were not torqued properly, or "possibly" some yield-to-torque bolts were faulty.

So if you have an engine failure please post up your experiences.

 

[TboneMan]

Scarey. I ordered mine two weeks ago. Not likely to see it until late Sept. though.

 

[sag2]

There have been a few engine failures but the fix has been a complete engine as shipped to the assembly plant. Not exactly anyone's wish, but the fix is far better than having your $15k engine scattered all over a workbench. Have not had any feedback on cause of failures as the engines are shipped back complete for tear down at the Quality Engineering Center.
Most of the failures early on were contamination of the fuel system that sent metal through the fuel system. The base engine was not hurt but the repair was still over $12k for all the fuel system. As far as I know the majority if not all were covered under warranty unless there was direct evidence of contamination or gas in the tank.

 

[Ozymandias]

We don't have problems with our Grannys, they use this engine since a long time and 8 of 10 sold Grannys are Diesels.

So, what to say about it, **** happens but don't over think about single events, this engine is a good engine and it lasts fine.
But like everything it is man made and it can fail. Even Space Shuttles weren't fail proof.

 

[mwilson]

Everything gives trouble at some point. It happens to all OEM's...

The trick is to identify and isolate the issue, then catch up with all of them that got out of the plant. That can take a little time.

DD15 engines have a QR Code right on the block that can assist Detroit Diesel if there are issues. They can tell who did what on what shift at what time......Soon all of the trucks will have another QR Code on the exterior of the truck. That will give real time info about previous repairs. Sometimes a truck goes into a dealer, truck gets diagnosed, repaired under warranty and sent on it's way. Problem reappears 300 miles down the road with a different driver in it. The first dealer hasn't even submitted the paperwork for a warranty claim that soon so nobody knows it was just worked on for the same complaint. The QR Code will eliminate that problem by giving the info from the first dealer to the next dealer that scans it. Pretty cool...

 

[retirednak]

Most of the failures early on were contamination of the fuel system that sent metal through the fuel system. The base engine was not hurt but the repair was still over $12k for all the fuel system. As far as I know the majority if not all were covered under warranty unless there was direct evidence of contamination or gas in the tank.[/QUOTE]

I've really been eye balling these 1/2 trucks, but haven't crawled around/under them just yet. If the fuel system contamination is responsible on some trucks, do these trucks have the open fuel necks like the HD trucks came with? I was filling up the other day when one of the 1/2 tons pulled up for his first tank of fuel & I was blown away how quiet it was. I didn't look to see if he had a fuel cap or not.
I always wait until the second year of production before buying a vehicle so that all the bugs are worked out. I'd sure like to know what went bad in the fuel system to munch a motor.

 

[Roc Doc]

There have been a few engine failures but the fix has been a complete engine as shipped to the assembly plant. Not exactly anyone's wish, but the fix is far better than having your $15k engine scattered all over a workbench. Have not had any feedback on cause of failures as the engines are shipped back complete for tear down at the Quality Engineering Center.
Most of the failures early on were contamination of the fuel system that sent metal through the fuel system. The base engine was not hurt but the repair was still over $12k for all the fuel system. As far as I know the majority if not all were covered under warranty unless there was direct evidence of contamination or gas in the tank.

This is the type of info that is helpful, thanks. I agree that swapping out the engine as a unit is the preferred method these days, leave the workbench builds for custom engines. The mfgs will better be able to analyze any systemic issues if they are sent to specialists, and there is way more QC in an engine swap from the mfgs POV.

When you say fuel system contamination what do you mean? A pump that frags?

 

[Roc Doc]

We don't have problems with our Grannys, they use this engine since a long time and 8 of 10 sold Grannys are Diesels.

So, what to say about it, **** happens but don't over think about single events, this engine is a good engine and it lasts fine.
But like everything it is man made and it can fail. Even Space Shuttles weren't fail proof.

That is the point of this thread. More data points makes for more accuracy. If we can gather any instances of failure, and especially some "inside" information a clearer picture will be formed. The Ford 6.0 failures were so widespread that there was no question, but a relatively small number of these engines are out there now, so I'm looking to see if there is a pattern of engine numbers xxx - xxx, or just a "normal" amount of failures due to tolerances, abuse, or whatever.

 

[Roc Doc]

Yes the fuel filler is just a trap door with a flimsy plastic "plug", that my salesman told me I don't really need. My truck is going to see all its miles in a dusty desert environment and I'm going to do what I can to keep the dirt out. A buddy just gave me a billet cap with an O-ring, but I haven't had the time to see if it fits. I'll know on Friday.

 

[sag2]

Metal was going through the system, similar to Cummins 5.9-6.7 failures that chewed up the pump and sent metal through everything. So just like any diesel, it is still important to keep clean fuel and fresh filters in the truck (or Jeep). So it is really not an engine failure, but some of the early ones got engines because it was the same price to replace the line engine that already had all the fuel system (except lift pump) parts installed. Now they have moved to a repair package that is pump, rails, injectors and all metal lines.
It is still a great engine and the number of failures is small.

 

[mwilson]

Metal was going through the system, similar to Cummins 5.9-6.7 failures that chewed up the pump and sent metal through everything. So just like any diesel, it is still important to keep clean fuel and fresh filters in the truck (or Jeep). So it is really not an engine failure, but some of the early ones got engines because it was the same price to replace the line engine that already had all the fuel system (except lift pump) parts installed. Now they have moved to a repair package that is pump, rails, injectors and all metal lines.
It is still a great engine and the number of failures is small.

When that happens on a DD15 we have to replace all of the fuel tanks as well......Ugh....

 

[sag2]

The good thing is the Ram tanks are pretty easy to clean once you have them out and the pump is out. If you could not get your arm in to wipe them clean they would also have to be replaced. The lines between the tank and engine are sometimes missed or discounted, and result in a second failure.

 

[Tinman]

There was a failure thread over at the 1500 Ecodiesel forum that Green Diesel Engineering posted. He noted there was a run of a number of engine that didn't get the mains (IIRC) torqued properly. All of these engine are going to fail. The problem has been fixed but there are engines out there that will have issues. Maybe that's one reason they are quick to replace- known issue.

 

[Roc Doc]

There was a failure thread over at the 1500 Ecodiesel forum that Green Diesel Engineering posted. He noted there was a run of a number of engine that didn't get the mains (IIRC) torqued properly. All of these engine are going to fail. The problem has been fixed but there are engines out there that will have issues. Maybe that's one reason they are quick to replace- known issue.

This was the information my friend was given. Hopefully they have rectified the issue, and that 2015+'s are not affected.

 

[Roc Doc]

http://www.carlisuspension.com/dodge-ram/components/dodgefuelcap.html

The cap is a nice piece with a fat o-ring for sealing, and a magnet to hold it to the inside of the fuel door while filling. $45 but worth it IMO.

 

[Searching4Ram]

Question, Im looking at buying a 13 Ram where the past owner put DEF in the fuel tank so its an insurance job truck. Are there any reasons to avoid this truck with 22kmiles? What are the long term risks with this type of mistake. Truck was refurbed, pumped, cleaned, new injectors etc...

 

[TCDiesel]

I could post 100s of pictures of fuel contamination, it rare but it does happen, the only and I MEAN only way to stop the contaminate fuel form reaching the direct Injection system is Auxiliary or additional filtering, Yes adding more filters to the system will filter fuel but its not designed to stop fuel contamination,The more you filter fuel the cleaner it gets. I see 50-1 water ratio, Water is the biggest killer, Water separating filters DO NOT WORK ON TODAYS fuel, you must have a Aqua-zorb or water en-capslulating filter to get the water out.

If the entire system was replace your good.

1 owner left the cap off his transfer tank in the bed, he drove in the rain the next day the truck ran poorly, thats when he discovered he forgot to put the cap back on $5,000.00 later he won't make that mistake again.

 

[Ozymandias]

Question, Im looking at buying a 13 Ram where the past owner put DEF in the fuel tank so its an insurance job truck. Are there any reasons to avoid this truck with 22kmiles? What are the long term risks with this type of mistake. Truck was refurbed, pumped, cleaned, new injectors etc...

If all the parts have been changed and everything cleaned then you are safe.
We had the same accident on a truck in business and it runs fine since 100000Mls.

Other ways is also very expensive - Diesel in the Def Tank makes a poor man.

 

[mwilson]

I think I would want to see the work order (if available) to see exactly what was replaced. Was this done at a RAM dealer with RAM parts so the remaining warranty is still in place??

 

[skychief]

Check Geno's Carage site for the fuel cap and o-ring combo. Also, if you haven't already done so, think about replacing the OEM fuel door with a locking billet door. I tried to find a locking cap, but there isn't enough room with the DEF cap in the same area, so nobody makes a locked cap. You need a locking fuel door because there are enough idiots out there who will try to steal your diesel fuel, get frustrated and then dump sugar of honey through the Mickey Mouse flap. I was blown away when I first sawthe flap and no cap on my 2014 ED. Another "brilliant" cost saving measure by some design engineer.