Ram Cummins vs. New Ford 7.3 gasser

[Fender1325]

Just remember, this is government mandated BS.

It is. However, Ford got around that requirement by using a variable oil pump. It somehow helps mpg. And before anyone claims that's a big fail, it's apparently a design used in heavy equipment already with high reliability.

At any rate, this is what has brought me to the cummins doorstep. Hoping to reach something ultra reliable.

 

[BigPapa]

Not sure why but I can't see the last 2 posts they're just quotes

Don’t know what wyosteve did, but endoscott posted this, it’s just buried in the quote:

I absolutely love driving my 2014 CTD/AISIN. But I have had more CELS, recalls, mechanical, and electronic failures than all of my Japanese cars combined (2 Toyotas, 3 Hondas, 2 Acuras). At only 75,000 miles I have had failed GPS, failed radio unit, failed front wheel bearing and rear bearing seals, failed NOX sensors, and now the turbo actuator for which I am still waiting for some BS "approval". Inspector goes to dealer but apparently has to "have a meeting" now before dealer can fix. Meanwhile the old 2003 that my son drives now never has anything more than brakes, clutch, water pump type repairs. Afraid the newer they get the worse they seem to be! Was thinking about a 2022 RAM but really having 2nd thoughts. OTOH how much is this 2014 going to cost moving forward? is it going to strand me somewhere? I tow a heavy 5th wheel so diesel is important. Maybe I should steal my old truck back.

 

[Ozymandias]

My 2015 with the 6.4 had terrible rattle during the MDS transition. They finally had a software update to reduce it but eventually had to change the motor mounts also.

That is just WEIRD, why does the 5.7 MDS work so seamless and unnoticed from the Driver and the 6.4 is just horrible? I mean its actually the same engine with different displacement.

 

[AKDoug]

I was basically in the same situation as you a year ago. If I was only towing 10K I would opt for the 7.3 gasser all day long and twice on Sunday. I love my Cummins when I have 20K hooked behind it. It simply tows like magic and it does everything you could possibly ask in a diesel pickup. Disconnect the trailer and it's stumbling, clumsy, behemoth that's not really all that fun to drive in any type of city or stop and go traffic. Get it out on the open highway and it's tolerable and makes a good long distance driving vehicle. I'm getting to the point that I jump into my old '06 Duramax to do any short run arounds.. it's a smoother and faster truck by far.

 

[HVAC2]

MDS in our 2012 300c hemi is seamless. Can't feel it.
I had the same struggle. The new Ford is intriguing, simple and for me one you could keep a long time after warranty.
My CTD is a blast to tow, and no gasser has exhaust braking like this beast. It makes our annual westward migration much more enjoyable.
But, the day the 8yr 125k max care is used up she's gone. My vote for you is the Ford.

 

[Wayne M.]

Has the USEPA has finally achieved their goal? Did they succeed in ruining the diesel pickup? If we’re feeling like this about our CTD’s, then the other diesel pickups aren’t worth the salt in your sweat.

 

[JR]

Has the USEPA has finally achieved their goal? .

They won't consider it a success until diesel is gone. Wayne, have you seen the new low NOX omnibus rule CARB is implementing in basically 3 years? It has engine manufacturers sweating like it's 2007 again. You can bet your house this will eventually affect LD diesel as well.

https://www.truckinginfo.com/10124652/californias-new-low-nox-rules-concern-truck-engine-makers#:~:text=The Omnibus Low-NOX,heavy-duty truck and engines.

 

[Wayne M.]

I know stuff is coming but I haven’t seen.

 

[TFucili]

Has the USEPA has finally achieved their goal? Did they succeed in ruining the diesel pickup? If we’re feeling like this about our CTD’s, then the other diesel pickups aren’t worth the salt in your sweat.

I wouldn't want one, and they all have problems, BUT I have to give credit to Ford on their latest version. More HP, more TQ and at low RPM, AND they even jumped us on the MPG front. The only demonstrably better performance we can hang our hat on is the exhaust brake. Ram and Cummins had better wake up.

 

[Fender1325]

I think the new ram HD's are really attractive trucks, and well priced. Best looking ones in the current offerings from the big three. But yeah, for 50k+ I want something I can have 200k miles of great confidence in. Too big a gamble for my money.

I'll likely go with the 7.3, especially considering I'm not towing much over 10k, and this will double duty as a family/work truck.

 

[SnoKing]

And Hemi tick, and cam/lifter trouble is more common than it should be.

Well when the block is design in a way to prevent oil for splashing on the cam at idle, you are going to have issues if one idles it to much.

 

[Ozymandias]

I think the new ram HD's are really attractive trucks, and well priced. Best looking ones in the current offerings from the big three. But yeah, for 50k+ I want something I can have 200k miles of great confidence in. Too big a gamble for my money.

I'll likely go with the 7.3, especially considering I'm not towing much over 10k, and this will double duty as a family/work truck.

Will you still like it if the gas is 5$ or more a gallon?

Think of this as this will happen with the new government next year.

 

[dieselshadow]

Well when the block is design in a way to prevent oil for splashing on the cam at idle, you are going to have issues if one idles it to much.

This. It’s not the greatest setup. It doesn’t mean it’s fatal for all Hemis.

And a lot of folks cheap out on maintenance intervals and quality oil. There’s a spec for Hemi engine oil. You can’t just put whatever is on sale in it and expect great things.

 

[Fender1325]

Will you still like it if the gas is 5$ or more a gallon?

Think of this as this will happen with the new government next year.

Are you asking for gas or diesel? Or just an HD truck in general?

15/16 mpg isn't terribly worse than 20. I need a truck one way or another.

 

[TFucili]

This. It’s not the greatest setup. It doesn’t mean it’s fatal for all Hemis.

And a lot of folks cheap out on maintenance intervals and quality oil. There’s a spec for Hemi engine oil. You can’t just put whatever is on sale in it and expect great things.

My 6.4 had intermittent startup clatter, cold tick, and hot tick on the factory recommended Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0W40 synthetic. I then tried Amsoil Signature Series 0W40, and it was worse, WAY worse, as in sounding like a thrashing machine. I then ran Red Line 0W40, and that quieted it down, but it got noisy again within 5K miles. Then I ran Red Line 5W40, and it stayed quiet for my normal OCI of 6-8K miles, still changing well before the EVIC. It cost me more to do an oil change on my 6.4 Hemi than my Cummins.

 

[SnoKing]

Cam shaft video.

 

[dieselshadow]

My 6.4 had intermittent startup clatter, cold tick, and hot tick on the factory recommended Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0W40 synthetic. I then tried Amsoil Signature Series 0W40, and it was worse, WAY worse, as in sounding like a thrashing machine. I then ran Red Line 0W40, and that quieted it down, but it got noisy again within 5K miles. Then I ran Red Line 5W40, and it stayed quiet for my normal OCI of 6-8K miles, still changing well before the EVIC. It cost me more to do an oil change on my 6.4 Hemi than my Cummins.

Yeah, mine had a quick start-up clatter for a moment, that was it. It was smooth and quiet after that. Maybe you got a Friday afternoon truck?

 

[TFucili]

Yeah, mine had a quick start-up clatter for a moment, that was it. It was smooth and quiet after that. Maybe you got a Friday afternoon truck?

Unfortunately, it is a very common complaint on the gasser oriented forums. And 'Hemi Tick' is something of a misnomer anyway, as it can range from a faint tick that is hard to distinguish from injector tick, to a loud pronounced tap/knock. Mine was on the loud end of the tick scale. It is not the reason I sold the truck, BTW, it was because of the hitch weight of our toy hauler. For a small block gasser, the 6.4 pulled like a hoss.

 

[dieselshadow]

Yeah, I’m well aware of the complaint(s). My point earlier was that camshaft design in the block isn’t necessarily the kiss of death some label it so. I would agree that it’s not good to idle any engine for any extended periods of time, but the Hemis even more so. There’s definitely a trend for some failures in the lifters in all these Hemi’s. Although it is common, how common is it? We tend to see more failures as they get more “screen time” than the thousands that run problem free. All I’m really saying is the Hemi isn’t probably as bad as it’s getting blamed for here. Mine was absolutely trouble free.

The 7.3 hasn’t been around long enough to find its Achilles heel yet....

 

[JackFate]

Guys,

I'm weighing this out and would like some good input. A new ram 2500 cummins or f250 7.3 gasser.

I bought a '19 2500 6.4 hemi and sold it after 7 months. Had some small issues but the biggest annoyance was it kicking into MDS mode all the time. (Yes you can shut it off but you have to scroll through the gears every time you put it in drive, not doing that and not waiting on a tuner). Sold it.

So I ordered a ford. Crew cab long bed 4x4 7.3 gasser. No money down no commitment. It's taking it's sweet time with covid to come in. Might be november. I've grown up driving Ford's and I think they're solid reliable trucks.

But I think the new rams are the better looking trucks, and I enjoyed my ram outside the small issues.

I'm considering the famous Cummins because I'll get the better looking truck and it'll last forever right? (Sarcasm)

The more research I do, the more concerned I am with committing to the diesel. All your standard failure items (EGR, DPF, etc) but that CP4 failure looks like a real b****, costing 10k in repairs +/-.

I want to buy whatever truck I do, and use it for 15 years. Let it become old trusty one day.

My needs to not REQUIRE a diesel. I tow a landscape trailer weekly, and a car trailer occasionally. So I don't plan to tow much over 10k. I'm going 3/4 ton regardless as I like having additional capacity for stability and to not risk overload.

Should I go for the cummins or no?

I have a 15 minute commute on back roads. Enough to get up to temp for sure.

Thanks in advance

If Ford still made a v10 in a e350 I would not be writing this now. Although you can’t beat the pull of a diesel I find the maintenance requirements to keep them in warranty excessive. I’d suggest looking at detailed maintenance schedule of either ford or ram. There’s a lot of really pricey things to go wrong on the ram. I nearly bought a Ram 2500 6.4 before my Cummins .The coil springs on a 2500 was something I didn’t care for. Wish now I’d have bought that but I’m sure that’s just another story to be told. Nothing is perfect