ZF Powerline for 2025 RAM HD Diesel

[NIsaacs]

Did you?
That TC weighs almost 350lbs and has the output shafts inline and vertical.
How do you want to fit that into a pickup chassis?
That thing isn't meant for a car.

European Semi with 4/6/8 wheel drive run AWD TCs for decades and ZF built them for the same time.

The article specifically states, for light to medium duty applications with the Powerline, 8HP and other automatic or manual transmissions. No mention of class 8 use. In fact, I don't think the Powerline is rated for class 8 @ 1000-1050 lbs tq.

It is also of modular design, so maybe multiple adapters to clock it to fit the application. Maybe even multiple front and rear output locations?

I don't know anything about it, just what I posted. My post was asking a question, "I wonder if this is on the way too?"

 

[Diesel85]

Very interesting on the video. I like the idea of external injectors and fuel lines for serviceability.

Not to happy about the CP4. I know this was going to happen.

Here's what the podcast states:
https://truckshowpodcast.com/blogs/episode-recaps/cummins

 

[Ozymandias]

The article specifically states, for light to medium duty applications with the Powerline, 8HP and other automatic or manual transmissions. No mention of class 8 use. In fact, I don't think the Powerline is rated for class 8 @ 1000-1050 lbs tq.

It is also of modular design, so maybe multiple adapters to clock it to fit the application. Maybe even multiple front and rear output locations?

I don't know anything about it, just what I posted. My post was asking a question, "I wonder if this is on the way too?"

For Europe it ist, the Main usage is in 10-17 Ton GVW class where our engines peak out at 280hp.

Check the link for some examples that come with that TC.

https://www.truck1.ch/lkw/mercedes-benz/atego/4x4

Also it has 40cm shaft distance, no matter what it is way to big and to heavy to fit a light duty Truck. Sorry for that.
Sure it would be nice, but I don't see the smallest chance to fit that piece into our trucks.

 

[NIsaacs]

For Europe it ist, the Main usage is in 10-17 Ton GVW class where our engines peak out at 280hp.

Check the link for some examples that come with that TC.

https://www.truck1.ch/lkw/mercedes-benz/atego/4x4

Also it has 40cm shaft distance, no matter what it is way to big and to heavy to fit a light duty Truck. Sorry for that.
Sure it would be nice, but I don't see the smallest chance to fit that piece into our trucks.

Okay, I guess in ZF talk, light duty is bigger than my light duty (pickup trucks). 10-17 ton is not exactly a semi/class 8, but for sure, a big medium.

Back to the drawing board I guess...

 

[Ozymandias]

Sadly yes, as much as i myself would like to have a gear driven AWD TC in den RAM.

 

[Diesel85]

Attached are the pre-reveal towing specs for the 2025 3500 as posted today (12/6/24) by Stellantis.

*Regular Cab
*Crew Cab

 

[AH64ID]

Attached are the pre-reveal towing specs for the 2025 3500 as posted today (12/6/24) by Stellantis.

*Regular Cab
*Crew Cab

Same GCWR as my 2022 with a 60lb bump in max trailer.

 

[Diesel85]

Same GCWR as my 2022 with a 60lb bump in max trailer.

So what do you think? Good, bad, or eh?

I'm wondering if the limitation is the frame?

I thought it was going to be a bit higher.

 

[Grumpy8811]

So what do you think? Good, bad, or eh?

I'm wondering if the limitation is the frame?

I thought it was going to be a bit higher.

limitations might be the J 2807 tow test performance stuff because of the stopping, steering and braking performance or the capacities of the axles, brakes etc.. trucks might be at their limits even though they have more power and gears than before but just a guess on my part.

 

[User113]

Sometimes these GVWR and GCWR "limitations" seem to be merely about marketing them as being of a particular class. Possibly for CAFE or emissions standards.

 

[AH64ID]

So what do you think? Good, bad, or eh?

I'm wondering if the limitation is the frame?

I thought it was going to be a bit higher.

Even with 3.42’s the ZF’s in 1st gear is much lower (20%) than an Aisin with 3.73’s, which tells me that Ram didn’t actually re-test the trucks with the new powertrain as specs would be easy to improve the recent with J2807.

The frame is definitely not the limiting factor for an SRW.

limitations might be the J 2807 tow test performance stuff because of the stopping, steering and braking performance or the capacities of the axles, brakes etc.. trucks might be at their limits even though they have more power and gears than before but just a guess on my part.

Likely not in this case as the 3500 SRW and DRW share a frame and axles, with only minor rear brake differences.

Sometimes these GVWR and GCWR "limitations" seem to be merely about marketing them as being of a particular class. Possibly for CAFE or emissions standards.

GVWR is a vehicle class limitation, but GCWR is not.

 

[Grumpy8811]

Even with 3.42’s the ZF’s in 1st gear is much lower (20%) than an Aisin with 3.73’s, which tells me that Ram didn’t actually re-test the trucks with the new powertrain as specs would be easy to improve the recent with J2807.
The frame is definitely not the limiting factor for an SRW.
Likely not in this case as the 3500 SRW and DRW share a frame and axles, with only minor rear brake differences.
GVWR is a vehicle class limitation, but GCWR is not.

at a certain point, a person has to realize the tow ratings are more for bragging rights than anything else.

after that any inference should be that with the addition of the drivetrain changes and microscopin changes in tow numbers etc,
without changing the rest of the truck something limits any improvement in that area
might be the brakes, it may be the frame, it may be the steering, or the tires or the combination of all of the above.

I don't know but it is apparent Mopar has reached it's own limit on the current truck and there probably isn't much of a reason to up those numbers except for bragging rights..

 

[AH64ID]

at a certain point, a person has to realize the tow ratings are more for bragging rights than anything else.

after that any inference should be that with the addition of the drivetrain changes and microscopin changes in tow numbers etc,
without changing the rest of the truck something limits any improvement in that area
might be the brakes, it may be the frame, it may be the steering, or the tires or the combination of all of the above.

I don't know but it is apparent Mopar has reached it's own limit on the current truck and there probably isn't much of a reason to up those numbers except for bragging rights..

It’s all bragging rights. J2807 max trailer weights are nearly impossible to obtain in real life.

Ram has a new transmission, which means they want to brag on it… so the same tow ratings is surprising, even thou the ratings are more than adequate.

There are versions of the truck with higher GCWR’s already, so we can presume that’s not the issue.

 

[Cummins12V98]

Sometimes these GVWR and GCWR "limitations" seem to be merely about marketing them as being of a particular class. Possibly for CAFE or emissions standards.

Exactly, even the F450 is limited to 14k GVWR, it'a all about insurance and licensing. RAM 25's have the same axle ratings as my 15, 6k front and 9,750# rear.

 

[Cummins12V98]

"It’s all bragging rights. J2807 max trailer weights are nearly impossible to obtain in real life." Agreed! Look at all the advertising pics touting the trailer towing capacities, the trailers are all gooseneck with lighter pin weights. To get a higher trailer capacity the rear axle needs to have a higher rating. That isn't going to happen unless they up the 14k GVWR.

 

[NIsaacs]

No real info but the '25 6.7 is on Cummins web site now.

https://www.cummins.com/engines/cummins-67l-turbo-diesel-2025?v=10041&application=Pickup Truck

 

[Diesel85]

No real info but the '25 6.7 is on Cummins web site now.

https://www.cummins.com/engines/cummins-67l-turbo-diesel-2025?v=10041&application=Pickup Truck

Thanks Nick!

Looks like it will be a ZF:

 

[promisedland]

Sweet! I want that trans in my 04

 

[Diesel85]

Looking closer at Nick's link, that is really the new picture of the engine.

Looks like some massive changes to the engine. Honestly, it looks much easier to service. Which as a potential future owner is a blessing.

New 2025 Cummins 6.7l engine:

Old 2024 and below Cummins 6.7l engine:

 

[Grumpy8811]

Likely not in this case as the 3500 SRW and DRW share a frame and axles, with only minor rear brake different.

funny thing is payload on a duallyis alot higher than a SRW 3500, I think it is closer to 6000 pounds whereas the SRW's are more like 3500, and so are the tow ratings.. one thing worth noting on dual wheeled pickup trucks the speed limit the trucks have to pass to qualify on the J2807 tow rating is 35mph minimum instead of 40 mph minimum for SRW..

but at a certain point you have to realize that when a difference makes no difference, is there really a difference or do people just want something newer because it is different.