Bad fuel, dealer said entire sys needs replaced!

[JohnHaggerty]

" What diesel truck would run with rust, water, and dirty fuel in the tank?" My 89 IDI thrives on that stuff!:-laf



This post adds one more concern to my perfectly running 2008 CTD engine.

 

[gsbrockman]

Out of curiosity.............

Did anyone else besides me notice Wygate's membership join date and initial 9 posts here on TDR ?



Just curious... ... ..... :-laf



Wondering if he was on his way to meet Whiteranch04 for a family reunion or something... ... .



Greg :-laf

 

[HBarlow]

Austin Diesel,

It is considered VERY bad form on websites to use the quote function to copy and drag down another member's posts then write your own comments inside the quote box. Your comments are indistinguishable from my comments which makes it appear to an innocent reader that I wrote your comments. Such sloppy methods distort the original poster's message and makes it appear that you are intentionally falsely attributing your own comments to the other poster for possibly malicious reasons. I object to your use of my quotes in this manner and recommend you learn how to communicate on an internet forum.

It is also impossible to follow your thought path. You appear to be speaking in some sort of codes commenting on subjects others cannot see.

 

[odinjunior]

Having read all this I am now afraid to take my truck to the fuel pump..... LOL...

Is there a less expensive than $750 plus installation way to protect my truck?

 

[Austin Diesel]

Are we elligible to get this tsb update installed under warranty ? All other text formatting will be corrected. Will keep it all short and sweet.



need a new Ecm flash anyway for the 08.



Austin Diesel

 

[GCroyle]

Austin,



Thanks for the information about the TSB.



I really thought that if we got water contaminated bad fuel it would trip the WIF light and possibly other than the transfer pump and filters, we wouldn't be facing the MAJOR repair that the truck in PA is looking at.



Still learning this Diesel game and enjoying it.





Also interesting on Wygates original 911 post, someone chimed in about the technology at the major distributors about monitoring for bad/water fuel.

 

[jelag]

We had read about issue here on the TDR about the time the 05's started to come out and the change to ULSD and the dealer giving customers fits... .

When the switch was made to ULSD we designed and installed on all our trucks a aluminum block with a 10 micron primary filter and water trap and a secondary filter that is a 2 micron filter. . To date we usually go a full year on this before we change the filters.

Since the 2 micron is smaller than the OE filter we once a year drain some fuel from the OE filter and check for dirt and water...

Once every quarter or so drain a few once's from the 10 micron / water trap... to date we've not got more than a couple of table spoons of water out of this filter...

We not only do this on our Dodges(Cummins) but on our CAT engines as well...

We fuel 95% of the time at card locks and most of these guys cater to Class 8 trucks, and often we see the filters on the side of the pump with a date on it... and to be honest I don't think I've seen a filter more than a few months old...

When we first started this program we tested the fuel pressure behind our filter system and have always read a good number... .

I have really 2 issues with this thread... 1 - Chrysler should keep these engines safe, and the TSB shows that maybe they've made a mistake in their first design, thus it should be considered for warranty... . I also believe that what should happen is the filter should plug and stop the truck before damage... 2 - I have trouble believing that a station today could have a problem where you can actually pump dirt into someone's tank... When I was a kid, we had a problem where I worked with a cracked tank... and if you pumped a gallon of fuel first thing in the morning into a glass gallon jug you'd get a qt. of water. . this was before the use of paste on the dip stick to check for water in the tank... Chevron at the time, had a crew there in 2 or 3 days to pull the tank and replace it...

 

[Wygate]

Yes, absolutely. That would have been my first phone call but I got the impression the original poster was not going to do that or had already determined that nothing was going to result from contacting the fuel seller.

I am arfaid to contact Shell as I may screw myself by saying the wrong thing to the wron people, I will let a lawyer do that for me, if it comes down to that! As of now the ins co USAA is covering me.

 

[jelag]

Wygate.....

If I were you... I'd go back to the same station, same pump and pump yourself a couple of gallons in a clean container, and look and see whats in the container... later this would be the evidence to convince anyone that there might be a problem...

 

[Wygate]

Did anyone else besides me notice Wygate's membership join date and initial 9 posts here on TDR ?



Just curious... ... ..... :-laf



Wondering if he was on his way to meet Whiteranch04 for a family reunion or something... ... .



Greg :-laf

No I just got a new Dodge, came over from a Duramax. All my buddies have a dodge:{) I have been a fan of this sight when I started looking at Dodge.

 

[Wygate]

Wygate.....

If I were you... I'd go back to the same station, same pump and pump yourself a couple of gallons in a clean container, and look and see whats in the container... later this would be the evidence to convince anyone that there might be a problem...

That would be great but it is now 1000 mile away from me, and 500 from truck, Uncle sam was calling me back to work!

 

[DMattice]

I just experienced the same thing with my 08. Have to replace all fuel injectors, fuel filter, maybe even the fuel pump, drop, drain and clean the tank and fuel lines. THIS IS ONE $EXPENSIVE$ repair. My insurance company is paying for it, and the gas station where I pumped the fuel is REALLY going to pay for it. My attorney advise me to let the insurance company handle it and make sure you have a receipt/credit card charge record, sample of the fuel and filter. My question is: What other damage has taken place that will lead to trouble down the road and/or shorten my engine life?

 

[Austin Diesel]

In leiu of this issue what type of preventitive prefilter set up are you going to use to prevent this from happening again?



Did you buy fuel from a major brand station? was filter relaced or serviced lately at the pump?service sticker or tag visable.



Is the dealer gonna install the severe filter kit ? service manager says it is owner option to pay for it .



And now we need a lawyer and involve ins comp to handle this insurance claim issue that is totally preventable ,Fuel samples etc.



My dealer just told me that any inline prefilter will not void my warranty and will not burn up in tank pump with additional backpressure issues



What will it take to make this tsb a production recall and get dodge to pony up and install kits to protect engines on their nickel for this production omission under warranty?



Service Manager said the dealer installed Mopar fuel systems R&R is about 17 grand. one mopar injector is 1500. 00 aftermarket 750. 00 x 6.



Am i gonna have to look at pump filter service stickers at the pump from now on? no more Quicky mart fuel, name brand major supplier only ,when im in BFE this could be a problem. I buy the good stuff anyway but it will only take 1 bad batch to destroy injectors.



Racor setup looks nice for 250. 00 and has same features as mopar setup want a pic of the new dodge filter setup to compare .



My service manager is looking at this issue more in depth now to look at my options and compatable preventitive filter setups.



Are we looking at inconsistant fuel clarity or lack of purity monitoring regs on diesel fuel and filters from the pump on a national basis.



Also are we looking at fuel sample bottles with each fillup now?



You cannot tell if it is bad fuel because the pump aereates the fuel as it is dispenced through the nozzle.



How long will insurance companys foot the bill on these repairs?



Dealer says Ford and Chevy are having the exact same problems also .



I am glad i have another issue to deal with or worry about to protect the truck and my investment which will cost me money out of my pocket.





Austin Diesel

 

[Regcabguy]

In leiu of this issue what type of preventitive prefilter set up are you going to use to prevent this from happening again?



Is the dealer gonna install the severe filter kit ?



Austin Diesel

Excellent point.

 

[tempforce]

i bought my truck at dave smith motors in idaho. while i was waiting for my truck to be de-snowed. as it had two feet of snow on it from the evening before. i waited in the customer area. i was looking at all of the available toys for my truck. the counter person asked me if he could help me. i told him i was waiting for my new truck. he came over and showed me a pre-filter/water separater unit. using a fleetguard 2 micron filter and a water separator. told me that the factory filter was only a 7 micron unit. and installing the frame mounted filter unit would be good insurance.

i walked out with a couple boxes, a new filter system and extra filters. i had the frame mounted filters install the following week. i change the frame mounted filters every 15,000 miles. i'm thinking i should upgrade the engine mounted factory filter/separator to the new design, in the next few months. as the oem filter has never been changed. i have checked fuel from the oem filter drain. it's always nice and clean.

i do use some bio-diesel when ever it's handy. i've used about five tanks of it. the engine usually runs quieter, if you can imagine that.

over all i'm very pleased with the frame mounted filter system.

cc

 

[Wygate]

TSB 14-003-09 Just talked to Factory

Well it is the start of my second week with out a truck and 500 miles from home. My ins is paying to fix the truck, it needs the entire fuel sys short of new lines and tank!



I just got off the phone with the "factory" and asked them why they would not install the new TSB kit. They had been very helpfull until this phone con.

I asked them why they would authorize a repair that will most likely happen again when they have a fix! No response. They (and by they I mean us the consumer) have a big problem here and seem to know it, so far this new TSB is the 3rd re-do of the 7. 5 and up filtration sys that I am aware of! I did not pay $50k plus for a truck I can't trust with my family in it!



I am personally aware of 3 trucks that have had this same issue in the last 3 or so weeks. I just read a post that will make 4. The only thing I know to do is for us to call the factory and lodge official complaints about this problem.

 

[Austin Diesel]

Lawyer ? It wasnt offered as a option on my truck either,





Chrysler will listen to the ins industry/filing litigation to cover losses or claims caused by this $$$$$ omission.



Have consumer protection agencys or federal trade commision, etc. been notified or filed complaints about this issue?



Mentioning "Class Action" litigation ?, Are we seeing a pattern of failure to document this nationally throughout the 5. 9/ 6. 7 fleet in the fuel system manufacturing design ? fuel prefilter production omission



Ford and chevy have the same issue going on also .



The new filter setup on the motor is a bandaid or quick fix but does not address the complete problem with out additional inline prefilters . Certified for B20 Biodiesel?



In Tank pusher pump mixes the fuel and water and or is or has caused preexisting fuel system damage prior to rerelease of newer filter design which is a partial stopgap



but as noted above we need a lower cost approved dual inline filter package from chrysler installed,



A recall which will cost them many millions which has not been authorized.



severe filter kit /750. 00 plus labor retail wow ,



Can we get some of the consumer protection agencys onto this subject? and involved?



To get a recall notice issue submitted?



Production omission has resulted in multiple injector fuel systems R&R repairs.



This truck was supposed to be a simple solution but things seem to keep popping up to complicate everything and cost me more time and cash out of pocket . if i dont drive it as much it wont break,



need the 2 micron filter setup guess gonna have to save up. and hope it doesnt fail or incur damage before then.



All is well for now with 08 "AS" flash,



Austin Diesel

 

[sag2]

I understand the situation clearly as my 06 had to have the complete system replaced after a bad load of fuel, and the cost was well over $5,000. But that being said I still don't expect a vehicle to be designed to take into account every possible occurrence I might run into. If it were it would be $70k instead of $50k.
These trucks are designed to take into account the situations we might experience under "normal" day to day conditions. They are not designed (and I don't want to pay for) to clean up the mess made by the fuel station operator that does not properly maintain the filter and water separator on his pump, or the contractor who does the same. The people who have reported complete failures didn't just get a little water in their tank, they god a load of it, and it might not have been water either. That is what I have insurance for, and they can go after the guilty party.
And as a note, a dirty fuel filter can't strip water like it was designed to do, so diligent filter maintenance is my responsibility also.
A lawyer and a class action is only going to line the pockets of the law office, and do little to change the way the car or truck is built. Read the settlement agreement on almost any class action, and the consumer rarely gets anything, and the lawyer gets rich.

 

[EricBu12]

So where do you get the new frame mounted filter kit?. . Mopar 4 less?

 

[tempforce]

i bought mine from dave smith motors, in idaho. i got it right off the display shelf. their parts department keeps them in stock. if i remember right it was around $250-300 for the unit. plus install.
I've had no fuel issues, except needing to change the frame filters, every 15,000 miles.
i have yet to change the factory fuel filter.