Bush places tarriffs on foreign steel

[me4osu]

WASHINGTON (AP)

President Bush slapped punishing tariffs of 8 to 30 percent on several types of imported steel today under a three-year plan to aid the ailing U. S. steel industry. White House officials said the tariff-and-quota plan is a three-year project that can be amended by Bush if the steel industry's financial crises worsens or improves. The move, while short of the 40 percent tariffs sought by the industry, was generally applauded by industry and drew opposition from America's allies.



If other countries don't like it, they can JAM IT!! I hope he does this to more imports! I would much rather put my consumer dollar in an American company for goods made by Americans. If I have to spend a little more, so be it.

 

[Un-Hemi]

Good! I think they should go back to metal oil cans, too, since the plastic ones can't be recycled because they are contaminated with..... OIL!!! I had a gate made up for my place a while ago, and all the galvanized iron tubing is stenciled with 'CHINA'. Disgusting.

 

[KMC]

I agree! Isn't it interesting how the media portrays it: "President Bush slapped punishing tariffs" Like what he is doing is some mean nasty negative thing... . Give me a break - if these people love Europe so much they can move there. Just like that bozo Alec Baldwin "said" he would.

 

[Sled Puller]

"President Bush slapped punishing tariffs"



Typical media bias!



It should say,

" BUSH HELPS AILING U. S. STEEL INDUSTRY!!!!!"





A little low Bush, but a good start.



I wonder why the working mans best friend Bill Clinton did not do this?

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Bill was too busy scrubbing the crusties off the oval office :-laf:-laf too bad he wasn't busier leading the country instead of aquiring a piece or covering his rear.



I always disliked him anyway.



I'm just glad we finally got a redneck in the white house.

 

[KMC]

Your right Mark, Old Billary never cared about what was best for the Country only about what made them feel good, and kept them in power,..... and of course what was "best for the children" They only pretend to be for the "working class" and minorities in order to build a voter base. Bush has done more for American Workers and has hired more minorities in his administration then Clinton ever did. Why the NAACP and Union Bosses keep gulping down the same old Democratic swill is beyond me! Look around, the proof is in the pudding - it is what you do and not what you promise to do that matters!



Flame suit on

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

I can see it now... John Anderson and George Strait playing at the Presidential events over beer and barbeque.



JUST THE WAY IT SHOULD BE!!!!!

 

[Sled Puller]

Our Union as we speak is lobbying FOR Bushes energy plan. THEY WANT IT PASSED.



Now it looks like the steel workers will maybe switch to Bushes side.

If he gets the Unions backing him, the Dems can kiss 2004 goodbye!

Maybe somebody finally smelled the coffee, and realized those billions of campaign promises never happened from the donkey side.

Gene

 

[radixr]

Steel Tariffs

Well, boys, at the risk of being flamed, I must disagree with the notion that tariffs against imported steel are a good thing. If up to 30% tariffs are good, why not 100%? Why not ban imported steel and create more domestic steel jobs? Where does it end?



Don't hold me to the following numbers but they are in the ballpark. There are estimates that each steel job saved by these tariffs will cost consumers (in the form of higher prices for products made from steel) $400,000+. Also, there will only be about 5000 steel jobs saved. If foreign countries want to subsidize the cost of steel imported into the U. S. at the expense of their taxpayers, then I think that's good for our economy as a whole. They will eventually go broke if they do this long enough on enough products.



This decision is based on politics and the 2002 and 2004 election prospects for Republicans. Bush's econmic advisors were against the tariffs and the political operatives were for it. This is bad policy done for the wrong reasons.



Oh, yeah, one more point: this gives foreign countries an excuse to retaliate and restrict U. S. exports which will cost us domestic jobs. Is anyone willing to sacrifice their job for a steelworker making an average of $38/hour (including benefits)? Would he do the same for you?



I'm done now.

 

[Sled Puller]

Well radixr, we already have more restrictions against us on the trade than the other way around.



FREE trade means we let the junk come in, but they tariff the crap out of ours.



This may be coming from that Chinese steel that failed and killed an Ironworker in Pittsburgh.



You can not deal with them dang fereighners!!! We have to show some spine here and there. let them know we an't kissin butt anymore, and they will have to make a few sacrifices also.

 

[Power Wagon]

Hmmm... what about 50% tarriff for our ailing "domestic high performance Dodge transmission industry"?



Would only raise the price of DTT equipment 50%... I'm sure the government will appreciate the extra revenue to waste.



Maybe we should have a 1000% tarriff on consumer electronics to "encourage domestic electronic products production".



You won't mind paying $3500 for that Pioneer stereo you wanna put in your truck, right?



I'm sure Tom Daschle will be most pleased to spend your money on vote-buying schemes.



Protectionism has never accomplished it's goal. It has never created healthy domestic industries and economic conditions. It has only done the reverse.



If we were actually SERIOUS about doing something, we'd scrap our income tax and SS tax, repeal the amandment that allows it, and move over to a retail sales tax.



Mind you, Japanese and other steel companies often get subsidies or special tax treatments to allow them produce steel below what otherwise would be "cost", but the cure for that is effective leadership from DC to get them to stop... Not a "Gaurantee of continued American Industrial inefficiency" protectionism act.



Non-union steel companies in the US have generally done quite well... and thier pay is NOT less than the Union shops. I think it's about time the union thugs figured out they're killing themselves with hostile labor/business relationships... Or, if they are just too dumb to figure it out, then they deserve to all go jobless, and union made steel will just be a footnote in the bibliography of the book of failed ideas.

 

[HillCountrykid]

Unlike Sled Puller, the union I belong to sends me crap in the mail telling me who to vote for. Always a hypocrite, oops, I mean democrat. Most don't care for the working man, just their votes.



Brian

 

[Champane Flight]

Union Bashing

Sorry, but most steel outfits I know at this time are non-union. They do not make $35. 00 an hour(around $15. 00 average). Maybe a few here would like to try to compete with dollar a day wages paid by overseas steel makers. I wouldn't.



I don't know why some always have to pull the Union card when it comes to buisness failure. Most of the time 90%, it is just bad managment, that brings these buisnesses to failure.



I forget that some here are from the home of Oregon steel, the biggest Union busters in the steel industry. Backed by SCAB backing bankers like Wells Fargo, they continue to put out inferior steel and pay low wages to an ignorant workforce. They also came to Pueblo CO and abused the Union workforce to the point of a strike, then hired SCABs and locked out the Union. The Union has won four cases of flagrant NLRB violations, yet Oregon steel continues to appeal and drag it out.



Bush is doing the right thing with the 30% tarrif. It cannot be a long term solution however. I will not back any canidate I feel is a threat to labor. It has not been that many years that people were shot for trying to organize. It may go back to that if we continue to let ourselves believe that big buisness has our best intrest in mind. I believed Kenneth Lay didn't you?

 

[Steve M]

Buy that man a steak.

He's also working along side some union members pushing for oil exploration and drilling amidst the trees and little furry things. Imagine that!

Mark, I have to dissagree. Our beloved President Reagan put tarrifs on import motorcycles when Japan was gouging it's own people in order to sell to the American market dirt cheap. All the while a Harley Davidson was equivelant to $25,000 US dollars in Japan with the tariffs levied against it. Harley Davidson seems to be doing ok these days and their union labor is also doing well.

Each job saved will cost $400,000+? Rush says a union steel worker is making about $38. an hour. Twice what I make with my union job. Maybe that's the salary of someone in management. Where do these numbers come from? "The greedy B******* wants to eat and drive a nice truck? How can I afford my $7. 5million yacht with these lunatics gouging my profits like that? And they want to be able to spend time with their families too? Why that's perposterous. We need slaves so I can have wealth and power above all those below me!!! They were born to serve MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!"

 

[Sled Puller]

PW, I am 100% against ANY sales tax. Nothing but bad comes from that deal. I live in a state that is a PERFECT example of sales tax ripoff.







Cutting deals with the Chinese to undercut our own industrys is not good for America, don't you agree?



Bush is just getting things back to fair, instead of favoring the enemies.

You can't blanket all the Unions and say they are bad for everything.



Back here, Union work is top notch, we have to produce or we are history.

I will bet a weeks pay that I have seen more Union workers fired than anyone on this site has seen non- Union people fired.

Ain't no silver spoons anymore.

 

[QRTRHRS]

Originally posted by TommyTurbosaurus

Good! I think they should go back to metal oil cans, too, since the plastic ones can't be recycled because they are contaminated with..... OIL!!! I had a gate made up for my place a while ago, and all the galvanized iron tubing is stenciled with 'CHINA'. Disgusting.

This just came up at work today. Friend was cleaning up the garage with his son who came across an oil can spout. When my friend explained it to him he thought that was pretty neat. I said yeah, you generally did not need a funnel either to keep from spilling it.



Along with that, I was doing some cleaning last weekend and came across a box with half a dozen spouts in it. I chuckled and put them back. Don't figure the would sell at a yard sale and can't throw stuff out.

 

[rrausch]

I say keep the steel industry alive.



I bought some "Grade 8" Chinese bolts a few years ago and they weren't even Grade 2 in strength.



Also bought some Chinese towels which were supposed to be 100% cotton and they sure weren't.



From these 2 experiences and MANY OTHERS, I have come to realize China Inc. CANNOT be trusted. And I don't think much of the Mexicans either!



When we need rifle barrels for the Army are we going to trust the Chinese to supply us with good ones? We currently DO NOT have the capability to produce replacement gun barrels for Battleships, instead we are relying on cruise missles which are a lot more expensive. The argument can be made that cruise missles are more accurate but they are also, at One Million plus $$ each, a heck of a lot more expensive than a big shell.

 

[me4osu]

Imported Steel

Being in the business of moving gas, we buy a lot of SA106 Gr. B steel pipe. The worst you can get is from China and Mexico. I have heard stories about guys seeing nails, that didn't quite melt, imbedded in the pipe wall of the Chinese stuff. Also, how do you know the MTRs and impact test reports are true?



Only US pipe for us. Although, I have seen us buy Sumitomo sometimes.

 

[Power Wagon]

Originally posted by Sled Puller

PW, I am 100% against ANY sales tax. Nothing but bad comes from that deal. I live in a state that is a PERFECT example of sales tax ripoff.

Gene, what you don't seem to understand, is that income taxes are never paid by businesses. They are paid by consumers. Every dollar taxed from a business is paid for by it's customers. Every dollar in taxes is passed on as higher prices. No business has ever paid a single dollar in taxes that didn't come directly from the pockets of consumers. Every tax increase on business is directly passed on to consumers.



But the cost of the business community COMPLYING with the tax laws is almost as much as the tax collected. In other words, the price inflation is double the taxes alone. In some businesses, the cost of compliance is a huge part of it's actual profitability... especially when you consider that it's common for "successful" businesses today to have profit margins of 2, 3, 5, or 7 percent of their gross sales. In those instances, taxes often figure to be a considerable percentage of the item's consumer cost.



The income tax increases the cost of everything, wholesale AND retail. It increases the cost of iron ore to the steel mill. It increases the cost of the rail car to get it there, it increases the cost of the electricity used, it increases the cost of the machinery, it increases the cost of everything... And provides US, the consumers with nothing but inflated prices - and our businesses, INCLUDING steel, a large disadvantage in the economic competition between nations.



Now why does this hurt us? Simple. Many of the countries that send us steel DO not have tax structures that increase the cost of thier exports dramatically. But we do. We hamstring our own business community to the tune of 3, 5, 10, or even 20% of the cost of doing business, just so a few Democrats in DC can run around chanting that they got them to "pay their fair share". Of course it's a big lie, but it's been repeated an infinite number of times to the point where there's a lot of people actually believe it. Goebels (Hitler's propaganda man) would have been bursting with pride over something that successful.



In the retail sales only tax scenario, foreign and domestic producers face precisely the SAME tax hit at the sales counter, but ours have no built-in government-mandated price increases when it comes time to export. And, as an added benefit, people actually SEE the dollars the governmen takes, every time they go to the store... Increasing taxes will meet with ardent opposition, and congress can't just target one group at a time, promising to nail only one bunch of people to the wall, while the rest cheer that they "got off" this time.



In reality, the income tax exists to serve only one purpose... For Congress to meddle, interfere, and control business... and individuals, for that matter. It gives the Democrats a wonderful Demagogery tool, and it gives those power-greedy types in DC a chance to control more.



Altogether, the income tax adds up to one thing... . Advancing the notion that your money is NOT your money... that your money is only the part that the government lets you keep, out of the kindness of it's heart, and look how unbelieveably generous they are with you. If you're rich, you can almost keep half of it!



And if you're poor, they'll bribe you to vote for them by promising to give you some of someone else's money.



Now, remind me again why it is you like the income tax so much???

 

[Sled Puller]

Once again Pw, you are stuck with your self righteous blinders on!(no offense)



I did not say anywhere that I enjoy income tax. It is Unconstitutional, to say the least.



I did, however, say that a sales tax is NOT the right way to go. And in that book you just posted, you made no good arguement for it.

You made excellent arguments against income tax, which I agree with.



Sales Tax- Penalizing people who purchase items they need/or don't need, not my place to decide what someone needs.



Income tax- penalizing people for working



Capitol gains tax- Penalizing people for doing well



property tax- penalizing people who own property



The list goes on and on, how can you say one is better? They all suck.



At this point, I think a flat tax for everybody would work a little better than our system right now.



I do not understand why people thik it ok to tax the rich just because they have more money.



And do you think business would pay the sales tax? They would pass it on just the same.

I believe in HELPING businesses, not hindering them with nonsense regulations.