Dually-Jiggle???

[Axekicker]

I've had a heck-of-a-time trying to get my truck vibration free at freeway speeds. I had my local tire shop spend some time fine-tuning the "balance" of all tires which helped a lot... but anything over 60 still get's my bed-rail-mounted rear-window shader moving side-2-side like an unbalanced washing-machine on "spin" cycle. #@$%! I'm running Fisk "Phantom A/P" tires w/ 85% tread remaining and factory steel wheels. I've driven next to the truck and the rims all look like they run true... just like they looked on the balancer. I'm thinkin' of going to aftermarket rims if I can't get these rims dialed-in... but I'd rather keep it factory if possible. Has anybody switched from factory wheels to aftermarket and find the vibration level diminished? AND... I've got 4. 11's in the rear. Has anyone with a 1-ton/auto gone to 3. 08's? 3. 54's? (I need to drop the R's on the freeway. )

 

[Dfeland]

My truck vibrates also, it has to do with the conical shape of the flanges on the wheel stud holes. If you take two lug nuts that are conical in shape and tighten the wheels down first to get them lined up it helps alot. Check your owners manual for the exact size I can't recall it right now. Basically if the two duals don't line up they are ecentric and will vibrate. Each individual wheel is balanced but the two together if they are not lined up will vibrate. Let me know if you don't have an owners manual and I will find out the size for you. Dan

 

[Rick Comenzo]

Dually Jiggles

Axekicker, The rear wheel studs on our trucks is 5/8-18 size studs, with a conical lugnut the wrench size was 1 1/16 inch. I purchased the lugnuts from NAPA, using these to center the rear tires has helped to lessen the wheel vibrations. Still vibrates ay 60 mph, seems to vibrate less with 500 lbs or more in the bed. Hope this helps..... Rick.

 

[ScottB]

I have the same problem as ya'll. A friend of mine put aluminum wheels on it really helped. he had to put 94 and up wheels on the inside dual and the aluminum on the outside and of course in front. I have found that many of the replacement wheels for our trucks[steel] are a little out of round right from the factory. Not much but it does not take much. I know some of mine now are not perfectly round thats part of my trouble. I like ya'll, am ready to stop shaking. Oo.

 

[f.boyle]

jiggleno more

might try centramatics wheel balancers

FrankOo.

 

[Axekicker]

Thanks Frank. I checked out their website and the product looks promising. I'll give them a call and get more info.

 

[f.boyle]

OK

Glad to know I helped Frank the centramatics for my truck were $199 set of 4

 

[Mel Fuelling]

Mounting these dually wheels with 2 cone shaped

lugnuts on any two opposing coned rim depressions and tightened to about 100 ft/lbs will center the wheel on the hub; then tighten 6 of the flat flanged lugnuts down on the remaining bolts. Next, remove the 2 coned nuts and replace with flat flanged lugnuts. Finally, tighten all 8 to 325 ft/lbs. (or apply

200# to the end of a 33 " pipe extension slid onto the end

of a 3/4" ratchet with correctly sized socket. )



If you choose to leave the two coned nuts on each wheel all the

time, they should not be tightened to 325 ft/lbs.



Once I followed these old TSB guidelines, my pickup rides as

smooth as a new limousine. (As long as I'm on a perfectly smooth

road. ) No more tire shake. I was 600 miles from home

wondering if I could stand to drive it back home, when a former

1st Gen owner at a motel explained it to me.

 

[Axekicker]

Ok then... I know what I'm doing this weekend. I've got to get rid of this jiggle... . although my wife doesn't complain about it. I can't figure out why????

 

[f.boyle]

Axekicker,

Mel's Idea sounds a lot cheaper!

Frank

 

[turbomatt1]

any wheel that uses a flat washer lug nut, instead of a typical automotive bevel lug nut, is "hubcentric" (wheel centers on the hub, instead of the studs) you most likely have a set of improperly machined wheels. (common factory defect, I understand)

I chased a similar problem on my 95 3500. spent $hundreds on balancing / tire "matching" , shocks, alignments,etc.

the final cure was a set of stock 2000 3500 wheels.

night & day difference!

 

[JLEONARD]

I had one steel wheel on my rig that looked straight on the balancer, but did not run true on the truck.

After a close look I saw that the chamfers on the holes were worn and the nut was not seating properly.

Of course I drove the truck for about 8 months like this and didn't know it until my wife followed me one day and saw the wheel running out.

Replaced the rim and the slight vibration I had that was driveing me crazy disappeared!!

 

[Mel Fuelling]

turbomatt1,

Our 1st gen dually wheels are not hub centered. Every other wheel that uses a flat washered lugnut may be, but 1st Gen

dually wheels are not. They were intended to center in the conical depressions around each lug bolt and "coined" for duals.

Whoever dreamed this up obviously never tried to remount duals with this system.



It was not a good idea. The only practical solution for this is to carefully use two coned nuts to center the wheels when you mount each pair as was pointed out in Dodge's tsb.



The two people I talked to at the truck wheel and rim specialty warehouse in Omaha, NE where I first went when I bought my truck questioning the torque specs in my Dodge service manual knew nothing about coined wheels, or lugnut torque specs for this truck. The people I talked to at one excellent dodge dealer, and two dealers that aren't, knew nothing about the solution to 1st Gen tire shake.



I've been shown documentation since that when my truck was new, the tool kit included two coned nuts. They were mislaid and forgotten long before I purchased it.



Obviosly, out of spec new wheels are sometimes sold and wheels with 200,000 miles of service are damaged, but centering

the wheels on coned nuts has solved my problem with dually wheel shake completely for the last 85,000 miles that I have used it.





I just wish I had a spare set of rims to mount up winter traction tires on although I carry enough weight that I don't usually need them.

 

[turbomatt1]

Mel... . I guess you can tell I'm new to the first gens. I just went out & removed what I thought to be flat washered lug nuts from my 92 W350 &... . yuck! reverse coin bevels (lugcentric). bummer.

I had planned on useing a set of hubcentric 2nd gen 3500 wheels on this truck... . will they work ?



now that I know we are talking about LUGCENTRIC wheels

... some of the larger tire shops actually have an 8 lug balanceing adapter, that uses the stud holes to center the rim on the balancer as opposed to a cone in the center hub hole.

... might get a better ballance that way.

 

[Mel Fuelling]

turbomatt1,

I went through the learning curve on this before I discovered tdr.

I was very lucky to stumble accross an ex-1st Genner who delivered trailers for a living, knew all about the dually rim problem, and told me how to fix it in 10 minutes. Until then, I thought I had really been stuck with a lemon. I think it has been difficult information to find for many of us to find.

I don't know if 2nd Gen hubcentric wheels will fit or not. 1) I believe that they use a smaller diameter lugbolt. The right lugnut might make them work just fine. 2) I believe they use a rim with more offset, but I don't know if that is a problem or not. I have seen 1st Gens with aftermarket dually wheels on them, but maybe they were genius machinists. I'll watch to see what you find out.

I've gotten an excellent high speed spin balance at two different shops, but I don't know whether it was because they were using the adapters or I just got lucky.



Good luck on your search.

Mel

 

[turbomatt1]

yes, the 2nd gen 3500's have a smaller diameter stud, but the wheels "look" like the holes are big enough to go over the 1st gen fat studs. I will try the swap this weekend & post the results

here.

happy new year!

 

[y-knot]

Your problem has nothing to do with the gear ratio, it is a balance problem. These problems can arrise from poor tire quality, bent rims, bent rear end housing, or missing /borken rotating parts.



Tire quality has nothing to do with tire price. Sometimes you just get a bad tire, one that slipped thru the quality control department. And yes there are a bunch of tires that do not make the cut, so when somebody tells you of a deal just too good to be true, well remember all those blem tires?

I have had several tires myself that were out of spec. The latest ones were from TRXUS. I ordered 6 and out of the 6, 4 were in the 2-3 oz range, which is great for large mud tires. One was 5oz's out and I had one that was 24oz'a out. Ok, first let me clairify some things. When I refer to a tire being 2-3oz's out, that means that when that tire was mounted and put on the balance machine, It needed 2-3 oz's on lead weight to bring it in balance, just so we are all on the same page. Now the 5 oz'er was pushing the envelope some, but exceptable. The 24 oz, think about it? it needed a 1lb and a half to balance out! this one was clearly a blem that got thru the system. I just called up 4 Wheel Parts, were I bought the set from, and they arranged for ups to pick it up, and then sent a new one. This was ok for me, I do not use my truck, but it would have been a pain for someone who needed there truck on a daily bases. The whole thing took about 2 1/2 weeks. Any how this was just an example of how tires are some times out.

The rims can also be a source of im-balance, wheather it be through and accident (hit a curb, or somebody), or just bad from the factory (yes I have had one of those to). Also alot of people get wheels from the junk yard, for that extra set of tires, only problem is most of those wheels are there because of a wreck.

Then it could be a balance problem form something as simple as a missing lugnut, hey I know what your thinking.

Anyhow point being there are many sources for a balance problem. I reckon if everything checks out, then you might want to look into the Centrimatics. They do seem to work and nice thing is you can take them with you if another truck is in your future. I didn't have a balance problem when I got my, I was just noisy and thought I give them a wirl. The on highway ride is were they shine, they seem to give a very smooth ride. Much less shaking at the wheel, and it is quieter also (till I put on the 4") Good luck.

 

[turbomatt1]

Bummer... . 2nd gen 3500 wheels will NOT fit 1st gen w350's.

stud holes look close, but no cigar.



..... anybody got a fancy set of 1st gen bud wheels for sale ?

... . perhaps with a set of 255-85-16's... or maybe even bigger

with a set of spacers ?????