exhaust brake

[THoltz]

Thanks for the info Mr. Barlow. I had some confusion with exhaust brake function.

 

[JTruelove]

I too am wondering about an exhaust brake for my truck. Currently do not have a controller with my DTT and was looking into the Banks one. A friend of mine with a current mods and a 6 speed worked great. He has tows 35' toy box and it works great. I believe the Banks uses engine vacuum, not a seperate pump. I have hot street car with a high lift cam... anyway I have a SSBC vacuum pump and it runs evertime I use the brakes. Somewhat noisy outside the car. What are your thoughts



Thanks

 

[THoltz]

I read you need to change the vacuum supply hoses every couple of years for a vacuum controlled brake when I was looking at the BD Power website and reading about their exhaust brake. At least I think it was the BD site, I looked at a few last night. I would probably want the air actuated design.



Also, the BD site talks about the need to upgrade the engine exhaust valve springs for certain 24 valve engines. Any thoughts on the need for stronger springs?

 

[HBarlow]

I too am wondering about an exhaust brake for my truck. Currently do not have a controller with my DTT and was looking into the Banks one. A friend of mine with a current mods and a 6 speed worked great. He has tows 35' toy box and it works great. I believe the Banks uses engine vacuum, not a seperate pump. I have hot street car with a high lift cam... anyway I have a SSBC vacuum pump and it runs evertime I use the brakes. Somewhat noisy outside the car. What are your thoughts

Thanks

I think a DTT rebuilt transmission keeps the tc locked when decelerating. If so, you don't need a controller to lock it. Talk to whoever built your DTT transmission to be sure.

 

[HBarlow]

I read you need to change the vacuum supply hoses every couple of years for a vacuum controlled brake when I was looking at the BD Power website and reading about their exhaust brake. At least I think it was the BD site, I looked at a few last night. I would probably want the air actuated design.

Also, the BD site talks about the need to upgrade the engine exhaust valve springs for certain 24 valve engines. Any thoughts on the need for stronger springs?

It sounds to me like BD is using carefully worded falsehoods to sell their product.

If memory serves me correctly, all 24 valve engines have had 60 psi valve springs. Some earlier 12 valve engines required installation of stronger valve springs to tolerate 60 psi back pressure created by an exhaust brake.

 

[AH64ID]

It sounds to me like BD is using carefully worded falsehoods to sell their product.



If memory serves me correctly, all 24 valve engines have had 60 psi valve springs. Some earlier 12 valve engines required installation of stronger valve springs to tolerate 60 psi back pressure created by an exhaust brake.

Yep, 12V engines need springs, not 24V engines.

 

[THoltz]

Exhaust brake sounds good, but I do not want to spend the money, at least right now.

I am considering installing the maxbrake controller and NOT installing an exhaust brake AND towing a 5th wheel with a gross weight in range of 12K. Is this sound logic or should I rethink my plan? Any and all opinions and input appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Deleted member 995608]

The variable orifice of the BD and PXRB does allow for more bottom end braking, but from about 2400-2500 (depending on EGT's at time of application) they are all the same.

.

The BD brake does not have a variable orfice that open or closes with the butterfly. It uses a solid round disc (butterfly).



This is why I chose the BD over the others. Less moving parts and less to wear over time.



160K and counting on original BD brake and air compressor without any problems.

 

[AH64ID]

The BD brake does not have a variable orfice that open or closes with the butterfly. It uses a solid round disc (butterfly).

This is why I chose the BD over the others. Less moving parts and less to wear over time.

160K and counting on original BD brake and air compressor without any problems.

Per their website they do. I think they made a change in the last few years becuase their original brake wasn't as strong as the others (backpressure wise).

BD Power - Product: Exhaust Brakes

I don't like how BD or Banks don't use the ECM for EB operation. It increases the cost to be stand alone, and Cummins/Dodge already have logic in the ECM for an EB.

 

[Grizzly]

I wonder if, "MBurtch", the original poster, died or went out and bought a Furd or something. He never has responded or said thank you to anyone.

 

[HBarlow]

Exhaust brake sounds good, but I do not want to spend the money, at least right now.
I am considering installing the maxbrake controller and NOT installing an exhaust brake AND towing a 5th wheel with a gross weight in range of 12K. Is this sound logic or should I rethink my plan? Any and all opinions and input appreciated. Thanks!

Wow, that's a tough one but I understand your reluctance to spend for both right now.

I am a very strong advocate of exhaust brakes AND hydraulic pressure sensing brake controllers. I had a Jacobs exhaust brake on my two previous Rams for every mile they were driven. Also purchased a BrakeSmart controller many years ago as soon as I heard about them on TDR.

However, given your self-imposed budget, if I HAD to make a choice, I think I would buy the exhaust brake now and the brake controller later . . . assuming you already have some type of brake controller.

I don't know what PacBrake and BD brakes cost but my guess is a Jacobs brake is cheaper and could be purchased from a MOPAR parts dealer. I could be wrong as I have never priced the other brands.

I suggest you contact my favorite parts person, "K" at MOPAR4LESS and ask her if she can sell you a Jacobs brake and how much. MOPAR4LESS used to have an ad for Jacobs E brakes on their website.

Invoice price on my Jacobs brake for my '06 Ram was $888 on the Dodge factor invoice.

A MaxBrake brake controller is about $400 at Southwest Wheel.

 

[AH64ID]

I agree with HBarlow. .

The Exhaust brake will allow for less use of the trailer brakes, but a good trailer brake controller has no effect on the use of the exhaust brake.

 

[THoltz]

I don't like how BD or Banks use the ECM for EB operation. It increases the cost to be stand alone, and Cummins/Dodge already have logic in the ECM for an EB. [/QUOTE]



Just curious, what do you not like about using the ECM to tell the brake when the truck engine is at idle?



I haven't thought about using the ECM that much. I read a Pac Brake install pdf, I would be a little concerned about wiring in their harness to the ECM, concerned I might be too clumsy or fat finger something and cause damage. It seems pretty simple if you can get to the ECM.

 

[AH64ID]

Just curious, what do you not like about using the ECM to tell the brake when the truck engine is at idle?



I haven't thought about using the ECM that much. I read a Pac Brake install pdf, I would be a little concerned about wiring in their harness to the ECM, concerned I might be too clumsy or fat finger something and cause damage. It seems pretty simple if you can get to the ECM.

There is nothing I don't like about using the ECM for an exhaust brake, its built into the logic for a reason.

 

[richardcoxid]

My ‘98CTD had a BD exhaust brake when I traded it for my ’05. I also installed a “mystery switch” to keep the TCC locked when the EB was in operation. There was 209,000 miles on it when traded and other than normal service the Auto had never been touched.



On the ’05 I installed a Pac Brake PRXB. The Pac computer controls TCC automatically, maybe the newer BDs EBs also control the TCC, I don’t know.

 

[Breed]

I have a Pac Brake and it works just great, I have used it for several years on my 98 with no problems except when I had some body work and they got the brake wet and Pac Brake had to e-mail me with the instructions on how to get the water out of it. Pac Brake staff was excellent.

 

[MBurtch]

I wonder if, "MBurtch", the original poster, died or went out and bought a Furd or something. He never has responded or said thank you to anyone.



I thought I had said thanks for the information, but I guess I did not so thanks to everyone that has responded. I have been reading all the post and the subject has turned into a real good discussion. I still have not decided what to do, but am leaning towards the Jacobs. I will probably wait until next Spring before having one installed.



Thanks again for all the information.

 

[Deleted member 995608]

Per their website they do. I think they made a change in the last few years becuase their original brake wasn't as strong as the others (backpressure wise).



BD Power - Product: Exhaust Brakes



I don't like how BD or Banks use the ECM for EB operation. It increases the cost to be stand alone, and Cummins/Dodge already have logic in the ECM for an EB.

Ummmmm, I think you better read it again



How it works: Using BD’s exclusive Variable butterfly Technology, providing peak retarding power throughout the engine’s rpm range unlike some models that rely on a hole/orifice within the butterfly to calibrate back-pressure only in the higher engine RPM .

 

[AH64ID]

Ummmmm, I think you better read it again



How it works: Using BD’s exclusive Variable butterfly Technology, providing peak retarding power throughout the engine’s rpm range unlike some models that rely on a hole/orifice within the butterfly to calibrate back-pressure only in the higher engine RPM .

Its a variable backpressure brake, whats not to understand?





I realize the variable orifice they refer to is the complete butterfly itself, but it still regulates backpressure, which I understood you to be saying they don't, maybe that's the disconnect?



You originally said it didn't have a variable orifice/butterfly, but even in the post you just place it says it does



If you are splitting hairs about butterfly vs orifice maybe you should read this. #ad
They say orifice in that article.



The graph on that page is a little off, as the Jacobs/Banks design reaches peak backpressure at around 2500 rpms, therefore will have the same braking ability as anything else at 2500-3200.



After looking at how it appears BD regulates backpressure (it appears to use exhaust pressure to open or close the butterfly), I don't like that at all. Soot will eventually block off that line and require cleaning, thou without an exhaust brake backpressure gauge you will never know you are over pressurizing your block.

 

[Sandflea]

I pull a 32' FW, and the first time I dropped from Hesperus, CO (el. 8090') into Durango, CO (el. 6512') with only my truck brakes and a trailer brake controller, I decided to have a Pacbrake installed. The next time down the same grade, the pucker factor dropped to zero, as did the smell of hot brakes. Now I just set the cruise control for 55, and maybe tap the brakes once or twice over the 10 mile descent.



The original installer in my home town did a rather poor job, and as a result I eventually had some problems with the compressor unit, about 2 years after the warranty expired. After a call to the helpful Pacbrake folks, they shipped me a new compressor for free. I was very appreciative of them standing behind something that wasn't even their fault.