Fram Oil Filters

[JoeFreeman]

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I read in the Product/Accessory Forum that someone blew their engine because of a Fram Filter disintegrating and clogging the oil passages.
I took my truck to the jiffy lube where I supplied the oil and the filter. I had instucted them to use my filter but before I could stop the kid he had already filled one of their Fram filters with my oil( and I didn't have enough to replace what he had already used). I was in a hurry(hence changing the oil at Jiffy Lube) so I let it go. Now I'm worried. What are the chances of something like this happening to me? I'm going to change it asap. Geez.

 

[NDRamrod]

An engine blew in Bismarck too because of one of those filters. They said when engine failure occurs they pull the whole engine intact and send it to cummins. Inicated there could be warranty issues in the future. but for now if it frams fault after the engine gets sent to cummins, and it is the filters fault they sue fram. .

 

[illflem]

The reason you hear about Fram filters failing is because they are probably the most widely used filter in the US,hence more opportunities for failure,but they aren't junk or they'd be out of business. The Fram filter will more than likely be just fine,but I'd replace it just so you don't have to worry. Take your rig back to Jiffy-Lube,for the last time,with a qt of oil and make them do it. After that do it yourself,it's easy and you'll know it's done right. Bet it was the first time the Jiffy kid heard of filling the filter with oil before installing it,if you weren't there I guarantee he wouldn't of done it.

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95' 25004X4,AT,Driftwood,Banks Stinger,Warn fender flairs and running boards(work truck)
95 3500,5 speed 3:54,BD E-brake,Driftwood,Banks&Psycotty,34,000 GCVW apple and tractor hauler(works harder truck)

 

[JoeFreeman]

Thanks Illflem
I'll take your advice.

 

[NDRamrod]

If you get a chance to see one of those displays that has filters cut up you should look at it. The local John Deere dealer did this with filters around here. Fram, Hastings, Napa, Fleetguard, John Deere, and Others. Long story short if you see the inside of one of these things you would not pu one on. They sell millions off the yes, they are cheap for lack of material and construction. Therefore every Jiffy lube country uses them. Why? They can make more money giving you a cheap filter than a quality one that costs more..... Think about it? Oh yeah, On the Display John Deere filter had most area but fleet guard and Hastings and napa where all pretty close.

 

[Cooker]

I wonder if Jonh Deere offers a filter for the 5. 9 Cummins? I know their fuel filters are made by Stanadyne, or at least that have Stanadyne stamped right on them.

 

[NDRamrod]

I don't think so. I was there and they gave me a fleet guard.

 

[illflem]

Don't forget to mention Wix,they are also very high quality and make the NAPA Gold. I've been using them for 25+years with no problems. My JD dealer had to bite his tongue when I gave him one to cut open,it was almost exactly a match of the JD filter.

 

[WMann]

You guys might want to check out this site regarding oil filters. It is very informative.
http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/oil_filter_study/

My friends and I that have cummins powered dodge trucks around here were using Fleetguard filters until I read about one of the fleetguard filters splitting and comming apart. They upgraded the filters to hopefully stop this from happening. We called Fleetguard and they said that the burst pressure on the filters was around 235 psi and that it has a filtering capability of 20 to 30 microns. The lady said that the new filter showed the same burst pressure as the old one. They probably haven't updated the information on the new filter at that time, because I would assume that it would have a higher burst pressure rating than the one that split.

We called Mobil and they said that Champion Labs manufactures the filters for them and that we would have to call them to get the technical information. The guy at Champion said that the Mobil 1 filters that they make for Mobil is the best filter that they make for anyone. It has a 600 psi burst pressure and it is 98 percent efficent on one pass at 10 microns. This is why at Auto Zone or any of the other parts stores the Mobil 1 filters are 10 dollars or so and the Frams and some of the other filters are 3 bucks or less. You get what you pay for.

I tend to drive my vehicles until the wheels fall off so I change the oil in my truck every 5000 miles and it only gets Delvac 1 and Mobil 1 filters. Compared to the price of new trucks these days it seems like cheap insurance to me.

Wayne

 

[Mr. B]

I don't know if this is a strange coinsadance (spelling), but 2-days after I drained the amsoil and installed a WIX filter and delco 400 oil my Check Engine light went on and within 2-weeks the oil pressure gauge went to 0-psi and the Check Gauges light went on. I know that I have oil and preasure but the gauge just keeps turning off with out provication.

 

[HC]

We called Fleetguard and they said that the burst pressure on the filters was around 235 psi and that it has a filtering capability of 20 to 30 microns...
... The guy at Champion said that the Mobil 1 filters that they make for Mobil is the best filter that they make for anyone. It has a 600 psi burst pressure and it is 98 percent efficent on one pass at 10 microns...

That's an impressive claim, but can anyone confirm with direct comparisons to the Fleetguard LF 3894? In particular, I'm wondering if the Fleetguard rating that was quoted to HeliPilot was really a "working pressure" instead of a "burst" pressure. Or possibly, if Helipilot gathered this information a couple of years ago, then maybe that was the burst pressure for the pre-LF3894 generation of filters, which I know included a pressure uprate for the latest offerings. In most applications a safe "working pressure" would be about 1/4 of the typical "burst pressure". So if the Fleetguard burst at 235 psi, then safe working pressures would be less than 80 psi, which doesn't leave any real margin for cold starts. If I could be sure the Mobil filter was really rated to higher pressures than the LF3894, I would switch to get the 10 micron rating and then quit thinking about installing a bypass system in the future.
Opinions?

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Illflem, I just replaced my Napa Gold filter with the LF3894 Stratapore. I held them side by side and noticed the Stratapore had a lot more holes surrounding the central opening and appeared it would flow more oil. I saw on some Amsoil literature that Napa Gold was a good filter but was down the scale a little bit compared to the Fleetguard when it came to filtering efficiency, for what Amsoil's literature is worth (and how efficiency is measured, etc. )

Vaughn

 

[jkern]

i too have looked at most of the studies and data. it seems that the mobile 1 filter is about the best on the market. i have used it excusively on my cummins since the first oil change, and started using on my gasser vehicles as well.

i have used fram in the past on a 4 banger toyota for 125k miles, and now when i change the oil, within the first 500 or so miles the oil is very dirty already... this tells me two things; one, fram filters don't trap much dirt cause it lays in the crankcase to be picked up by fresh oil, and two, havoline formula 3 oil might have contaminats in it that lay around in the engine causing the fresh oil to be dirty quick because of the sludge left behind from previous oil. and now the engine uses about 1 qt. of oil every 1k miles!!! these are only mine own very unscientific observations.

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Jeremy Kern
1999 2500HD 4x4 QC,SB, ISB, 5spd, 3. 54LSD, 33x12. 50 cooper STT's Denver off-road bumper with Ramsey RE12k, PIAA series 520 lights, Rancho RS9000's, heavy ft. springs, JVD Torque Enhancer, DiPricol boost and pyro gauges, and a bunch of other little things! www.geocities.com/phrn30 for pics!

 

[TowPro]

I would take the Fram filter off right now! I have heard of several report of the Problem with Fram. What happins is the filter media comes apart, passes through the engine and plugs up these little holes that are used to spray oil onto the bottom of the pistons (for cooling and bore lubrication).

When I saw Jiffy Lube doing this, I would have stopped them right then, drained the fram filter into the one I provided, and used it. (actualy I would have stopped them, and had them push the truck out into the lot where I would have finished the job myself!)

Keep in mind, you would have been all right driving with only 10 quarts till you got some more.

And when Fleetguard filters are so cheep from Genos, why gamble with anything else?
I will be calling this week to order more. I always buy 2 oil, and one fuel at the same time.

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• 98 ISB,QC,5spd,2wd,3:54lsd. Stock with BD brake and Gauges!
• 2000 Terry 305G 5th wheel

 

[WMann]

It was about one month ago when We called Fleetguard. We had the lady there on a three way call. We asked her twice to make sure we were talking about the burst pressure and not the working pressure.

The Mobil part number is M1-403

My advice would be to call Champion Laboratory and ask them for your self. This keeps you from having to take someones elses advice. Especially when you don't know that person very well. I know if someone told me about this, I would do my own home work before risking my engine.

I would also call Fleetguard and ask them the same questions about burst pressures and filtering efficency and at what micron level for the LF-3894.

We also asked the Champion guy if they sold the same filter under another name at a lower price. Nope. He also said taht Mobil was very picky about the specs on this line of filters and wanted to make sure that they were the best you could buy across the conter.

On a side note the only oil filters that I see advertized on a regular basis on TV are the Fram line of flters. I think that the general public just assumes that they are high quality filters because they spend so much money advertising them. You cannot believe everything you see, read or hear. You must do your own research inorder to have peace of mind. You are being sold on the advertising, not the product.

This is just my humble opinion. Take it for what ever its worth.

With the burst pressure rating of the Mobil filter and the micron rating there is no need for a by-pass filter and all the other head aches that go along with it.

Wayne

 

[Steve M]

I've used Fram filters on both my Cummins powered Rams and my previous Isuzu diesel among many other engines with no problems. Compare Fram's warranty in writing to K&N's warranty word for word. Who has faith in their own product? I use Fram when I can't get to Cummins, Dodge, or Discount for a Purolator. Looking back a few years, WIX is the only filter I'm aware of causing catastrophic engine failure to several Cummins engines.

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98 2500 CC SB 4X2 12v 5spd 4. 10, -silencer, AFC+20, Edelbrock IAS, VDO gauges, Reese 15k Classic
97 Dodge Stratus 150HP
92 Harley Fatboy, Dynojet fuel management, Supertrapp 2-1
00 Jayco 25' 5th wheel, single slide

 

[BK]

I've been through this oil filter question myself. And after spending 6K on this engine... out of the 36K for the truck. . I wanted a filter I could trust. I found that above mentioned filter study a few years ago and was amazed at the information and the "letter" that the author of the page had from a Fram employee. It made me stop using the Frams on all of my engines. For 20 years I've used Fram... but things change.

Fleetguard is owned by Cummins. So who better to buy your filters from.

BTW, Fleetguard makes the Mopar filters that Dodge sells for our beloved I6's.

And Genos' now has the filter packs... their called a 4x2x1 or something. . I did the math and there's a savings to be had with their deal.

There's one thing I've always re-learn...
You get what you pay for.
And some just ask too much for what they're selling... .

I had heard good things about the WIX filters from farmers. I'm able to get them easily in my area. But after buying one, and inspecting it I found burrs hanging onto the two holes in the metal head. And the fact that there were only - two - small - holes as compared all those big holes in the Mopar/fleetguard filter. No way I was going to use the WIX. And thats becuase I had read an article that spoke about all the gallons of oil the oil pump moves in an hour in Cummins. I couldnt see those two tiny holes handling that.

Thats my $. 02

Bob
99 QC, 4x4


[This message has been edited by bobk (edited 02-20-2001). ]

[This message has been edited by bobk (edited 02-20-2001). ]

 

[illflem]

Bob,you sure you got the right Wix filter?The Wix filters I use on my 12 valves have 6 holes about 3/8"in diameter. As far as flow though small holes go,a sprinkler with a 1/8"nozzle flows 2. 2 gpm or
132 gph @ 40 psi. A 1/4" nozzle flows 5. 6 gpm or 336 gph @ 40 psi. Sure oil flows slower,but there's no way our oil pumps put out that much. I don't think small holes on the filter will make much difference. My 2¢ also

 

[Big-D]

Well, you guys purchase what you want, where you want and for how much you want. This farm boy is sticking with his Baldwin for quality in workmanship and past history records. Haven't heard of a Baldwin problem yet. Dave

 

[Big K]

Check my sig. After 20k break-in, all miles on the '90 are with Amsoil fluids and Baldwin filters. Hard to argue with success over time.

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'90 W-350 5-sp 230K
'99 2500 QC 4x4 AUTO 4:10
EDK