Good news Cp4 to Cp3

[troverman]

^^Exactly. The CP4.2 is the same pump on a 2011 Ford or Chevy as on a 2019 RAM. However, some changes have been made over the years...for example, the version in the Ford gained an increase stroke for model year 2015 to accommodate more power; however the Ford cab and chassis trucks did not get this update.

People are acting very strange about the CP4.2...kind of like the Covid. Statistically speaking, you have a 99% chance of surviving the Covid. Same thing with your Bosch CP4 pump. Of course it stinks to be in the 1% that don't make it.

 

[cumminsturbofreak]

When you have had friends die of covid, it gets real all of the sudden.

Likewise with pumps.

 

[troverman]

I agree - but neither has happened to me, and it won't to most people.

 

[R.Taylor]

I agree - but neither has happened to me, and it won't to most people.

Well, I believe it WILL happen to many. Perhaps the CP4.2 on the Cummins 6.7 will be even more prone to failure that GM or Ford. How many 2019+ Cummins RAM's have been sold to date, FCA only reports it as "truck" sales regardless of being gas/diesel and/or 1500 to a 5500. Looking at 2019 "truck" sales for FCA the total number is 633,694. I'd bet close to 70% of those were 1500/2500 gassers and some EcoDiesels.... Or even more. That leaves us with about 190,109 Cummins CP4.2 trucks sold. We'll never get a straight answer from FCA on failure numbers so we rely on confirmed cases on the forums and the few of us that have that extra insight with dealer/service department knowledge or ties.


"but neither has happened to me, and it won't to most people."

Count your lucky stars... Lost my father in-law on Saturday from Covid19.

 

[dieselshadow]

R. Taylor, sorry for your families loss.... Please accept my condolences even though I’m some random guy on the Internet.

The trouble with things like these is most people don’t report anything or review anything unless they’ve had a problem or a failure. So forums are the first place it tends to show up and it typically gets blown out of proportion. We’ve witnessed this for years. Seems as though this is going to be a problem, but wide spread and kill them all? Doubtful. It’s not something to take lightly either. All I’m saying is it isn’t all doom and gloom as of yet.

If I owned one of these, I’d use a good quality additive such as OptiLube or Stanadyne, sit back and watch what happens. Not necessarily what happens to my truck, but what FCA does and how widespread this actually becomes. A good fuel additive to take care of some of the lubricity issues should quell the issue, perhaps make it a complete non-issue. It’s all speculation until we know more.

 

[Wayne M.]

R.T. So sorry for your loss. Whoever made that Covid comment is a shallow asshat.

 

[R.Taylor]

Thank you dieselshadow and Wayne...

And your right... I am not worried about my truck but more so how this is handled. I've got a 5 gallon bucket of OptiLube XPD in my garage and my 2019 has been getting it at every fill up since 134 miles, I'm at 9,534 and purring along... Love the truck.

 

[TDickerson]

Thank you dieselshadow and Wayne...

And your right... "I am not worried about my truck" but more so how this is handled. I've "got a 5 gallon bucket of OptiLube XPD in my garage" /QUOTE]
OOOOOKKKKK.

 

[R.Taylor]

OOOOOKKKKK TDickerson.... Had you ever thought that maybe that's why I am not worried?? Go figure. Been running lube since 2007 on all my CTD's regardless, It's called "Taking care of your stuff".

 

[HPSimpson]

R.T. So sorry about your loss.

 

[SnoKing]

I'm happy to believe it with proof. The fuel system is the heart of a diesel engine, and I'm skeptical Cummins can meet both emissions and sound targets with the CP3...otherwise, there'd be no reason for a change. Cummins is not an ignorant company....they are well aware of the failures in the past with the CP4 on Ford and GM engines. If targets could be met, it sure would make sense to keep the CP3, especially if it would lower warranty payout.

It is more than just warranty payout, sales are involved also. With GM being the only NON CP4-2 offering, and the trucks becoming pretty equal in other ways, sales could move that direction. How is GM's new UnAllison(in name only) transmission doing?

 

[Bob4x4]

For the naysayers,the news has been published.Since I’ve been retired for a number of years the last thing I want to do is loose my inside source.
Just thought I would pass on some info that may help those uneasy with the current fuel system and not let some potential shoppers from jumping ship.

 

[TFucili]

Thanks, Bob4x4. Naysayers are a fact of life, especially on the webz.

 

[Cummins12V98]

For the naysayers,the news has been published.Since I’ve been retired for a number of years the last thing I want to do is loose my inside source.
Just thought I would pass on some info that may help those uneasy with the current fuel system and not let some potential shoppers from jumping ship.

I appreciate your info!

Can you tell us why they changed? All I heard was the 3 couldn’t provide high enough psi for added power.

 

[Jim W]

As for the pump, it’s is just a bad design. Talked with Bosch certified techs that work on VW, Audi, etc. and they know that the pump is just poorly designed. Needs to be scrapped.

I would not necessary call the Bosch CP4.2 fuel pump a bad design. This fuel pump has been used on European vehicles in Europe with good results. Now I would like to know the total failure rate of this pump in the US. By the number of fuel pumps produced and sold in vehicles per year vs failure of pump per year in those vehicles produced! Otherwise known as the B(xx) life of a component in design. Most design life targets, but not all are usually around a B10 which means 10% of the components will fail before reaching maturity. Now is the design life 100,000 or 200,000 miles? Nothing is design for infinite life (we could not afford a end product if it was) and end users need to understand that. It is unfortunate that some users may have experience the failure of the fuel pump, but stuff happens. Like all things mechanical and designed by humans they will fail at some point in time. For example Ball Joints, Tires, Sheetmetal rust throw, Shocks failure, transmission and so forth.

 

[SnoKing]

I would not necessary call the Bosch CP4.2 fuel pump a bad design. This fuel pump has been used on European vehicles in Europe with good results. Now I would like to know the total failure rate of this pump in the US. By the number of fuel pumps produced and sold in vehicles per year vs failure of pump per year in those vehicles produced! Otherwise known as the B(xx) life of a component in design. Most design life targets, but not all are usually around a B10 which means 10% of the components will fail before reaching maturity. Now is the design life 100,000 or 200,000 miles? Nothing is design for infinite life (we could not afford a end product if it was) and end users need to understand that. It is unfortunate that some users may have experience the failure of the fuel pump, but stuff happens. Like all things mechanical and designed by humans they will fail at some point in time. For example Ball Joints, Tires, Sheetmetal rust throw, Shocks failure, transmission and so forth.

Why is Bosch selling IPs into a market area that does not have fuel that is up to their standards for the product they are providing?

 

[Jim W]

Bosch if like all other pump suppliers state what the pump requirements are to the OEM! Than the OEM used this component as they see fit. Also I believe it is the OEM who is providing the warranty on the component not BOSCH right? So, it is up to the OEM to make sure it is used correctly in their application.
Now people are assuming it is a lubricity issue, is it? I don't know as I have never seen a failed Bosch Cp4.2 pump to see if the side walls are scored or what the failure mode is? Have you?

 

[TFucili]

Longevity conjecture aside, what REALLY makes the CP4 a bad design is that when it fails it sends metallic particles through the entire fuel system, turning a simple component replacement into a catastrophic system-wide failure. That is my definition of a *&^%-poor design.

 

[SnoKing]

Bosch if like all other pump suppliers state what the pump requirements are to the OEM! Than the OEM used this component as they see fit. Also I believe it is the OEM who is providing the warranty on the component not BOSCH right? So, it is up to the OEM to make sure it is used correctly in their application.
Now people are assuming it is a lubricity issue, is it? I don't know as I have never seen a failed Bosch Cp4.2 pump to see if the side walls are scored or what the failure mode is? Have you?

You are the one that said the the CP4 is Europe has a lot less issues. It is note across the inter-web that Europe has much better diesel fuel. 1+1=2 maybe?

 

[SnoKing]

Longevity conjecture aside, what REALLY makes the CP4 a bad design is that when it fails it sends metallic particles through the entire fuel system, turning a simple component replacement into a catastrophic system-wide failure. That is my definition of a *&^%-poor design.

Yet, the after market has a solution to this and Bosch does not!