Guns, Bows, Shooting Sports, and Hunting Not welcome in Toys "R" Us

[icman95]

I know that even in this forum, there will be many different opinions, but I will post this anyway. Below is a letter I just sent to Toys "R" Us corporate offices via their website. It is pretty self explanatory. Should you agree, perhaps you could send a similar email to them. Just go to Toysrus.com Home - The Official Toys"R"Us Site - Toys, Games, & More and look for contact us and contact customer service. Those of you who don't agree, I respect your right to do so.



Thanks-



"Hi,

I was mortified and offended by something I saw in the window of one of your Connecticut stores today. As I was walking through the front door, I noticed, among all the other signs in the window, one that says "Firearms Prohibited on these Premises. " I felt like I had been punched in the stomach. How could it be that I was not welcome here? While I was not carrying a firearm at the time, I am a law abiding citizen who has a concealed carry permit issued by the State of Connecticut. I do carry my pistol quite often when shopping and running errands. This leads me to two different choices. 1) Leave it at home so that I can go into your store 2) Carry it with me and avoid your store.



While it is your right to deny anyone you see fit access to your store, your execution of this right is infringing upon my right to carry a weapon to use for self defense. I will, therefore, choose to continue excercising my right to self defense, and instead never spend another dime in any of your stores. One of the most notable inconsistencies in this issue is that you have posted a sign in the window asking law abiding citizens to not come inside, yet there is no sign that says pedaphiles/sex offenders are not welcome. Considering that this is a place children tend to congregate, I would expect that your company wouldn't condone sex offenders entering the building. Yet there is no sign saying so. I realize that people convicted of such crimes are prohibited by law from going to places where children gather, but then again, criminals don't follow the laws. This is what makes them criminals. If there is no sign explicitly denying them access to your store, then it might be implied that they are welcome there. Why would you allow them in and not a citizen with a concealed weapon and a permit to carry it? It would almost seem that your priorities are backwards.



In any event, I will gladly abide by your wishes by not bringing my firearm into your stores. I will also avoid bringing my money into your stores. This includes shopping on your website. Furthermore, I would hate to have people I know get into a sticky situation while carrying their firearms, so I will be telling everyone I can about this problem so that they might avoid it, too. I will be sending a copy of this letter to the headquarters of the National Rifle Association so that they might alert the almost 4 million members to avoid carrying their firearms into your stores. In fact, it might be nice if the membership avoided yor stores altogether. I will, likewise, send a copy of this to the corporate offices of the makers of my firearms, and also post this issue on two internet forums where I know this will be of interest.



I hope you will reconsider your stance on this matter. In the meantime, I will be doing all of my toy and baby needs shopping at your competition. Wal-Mart here I come.



Thank you for your time. "

 

[SHobbs]

Can they legaly keep you out? In Texas the ONLY legal sign to keep those with carry permits from entering must state the following:



In order to provide notice that entry on property by a license holder with a concealed handgun is forbidden, Penal Code Section 30. 06(c)(3)(A) requires that a written communication contain the following language:



"PURSUANT TO SECTION 30. 06, PENAL CODE (TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF A LICENSE TO CARRY A CONCEALED HANDGUN) A PERSON LICENSED UNDER SUBCHAPTER H, CHAPTER 411, GOVERNMENT CODE (CONCEALED HANDGUN LAW), MAY NOT ENTER THIS PROPERTY WITH A CONCEALED HANDGUN. "



"CONFORME A LA SECCIÓN 30. 06 DEL CÔDIGO PENAL (TRASPASAR PORTANDO ARMAS DE FUEGO) PERSONAS CON LICENCIA BAJO DEL SUB-CAPITULO H, CAPITULO 411, CODIGO DE GOBIERNO (LEY DE PORTAR ARMAS), NO DEBEN ENTRAR A ESTA PROPIEDAD PORTANDO UN ARMA DE FUEGO. "



Penal Code Section 30. 06(c)(3)(B) further states that a sign must meet the following requirements:



I. includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;

II. appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and

II. is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public



Without that sign and in the prescribed manner by which the state defines they can't stop someone carrying legaly from entering. There are places which ARE off limits and listed in the concealed carry laws, other than that no on can just slap a sign on the door to keep a person out unless the sign contains the above language.

 

[JApol]

Well written Ken.

 

[JGamble]

Amen..... I fully understand liqour stores and banks, possibly even consignment/pawn/barter shops. but toys r us? Where are the pedophilia signs? hmmm...

 

[icman95]

SHobbs-the answer is I don't know but I'm also not going to push my luck. Each state has it's own rules/regs regarding firearms carry, etc and I'm sure you'll agree that TX is a bit more friendly to it than CT. I have no doubt that if I were to be found in one of their stores with a weapon they would have me up on tresspass charges and they would stick in CT.





JApol- Thanks. Hopefully it helps but I'm not holding my breath. I've already sent it to the NRA an Smith and Wesson HQ

 

[JApol]

Most people don't realize that the person that has the gun strapped to their body is the one that can put 4 rounds in the chest and one in the head of the robber 50 feet away before he hits the ground

 

[SHobbs]

Amen..... I fully understand liqour stores and banks, possibly even consignment/pawn/barter shops. but toys r us? Where are the pedophilia signs? hmmm...

As I understand here in Texas the places you listed are ALL legal to carry in. Many places here at first tried to keep CHL holders out and many failed.



Ken,



I see the laws in CT are as vague as the rest. I can't find anything that will clearly state where you can and can not carry. My best advice would be to contact your state law enforcement agency and ask them. Better safe than sorry.

 

[icman95]

True, but I can make it even more simple than that. I know where I'm not wanted and will not go there, thus keeping my money away from any business that doesn't allow me to express my freedoms.

 

[JLEONARD]

There are many places in Ct where firearms are not allowed. My current workplace for one. Immediate firing (pun intended) if caught with a firearm. Many others are like that as well.

As a matter of fact after the unfortunate tragedy at the hartford beer distributors I would expect most companies to adopt that policy within the next year or so.

As for the store, if I was carrying I would still have entered the store regardless.

 

[ChrisOlson]

Most people don't realize that the person that has the gun strapped to their body is the one that can put 4 rounds in the chest and one in the head of the robber 50 feet away before he hits the ground

Now now Mr JApol that Robber has rights too. in this Liberal democratic age and now with Obama ialized health care we will all be paying for this mans injuries should you Miss that head shot at 50 ft. (humor)



as far as the OP I agree that it was really bad form to single out Concealed weapons holders and your letter was well written. as United states citizens we should all write more hand written letters to the corporations about our views. In addition we also should write more letters to our lawmakers to tell them of our views on proposed law changes and such.



did you get a reply yet from ther CORP office???



Great letter



Chris

 

[icman95]

Chris: funny you should ask because as I was reading you post their reply came in. It is the generic garbage I was expecting and doesn't do anything but sadden me even more. It implies that CCW people are dangerous to the public/children in their stores. The reply is below:





Thank you for contacting Toys"R"Us. At Toys“R”Us, Inc. , the safety and security of our customers and our employees is, and always has been, our highest priority. As a retailer that welcomes millions of kids and families into our stores across the country each year, we take our responsibility to create only the safest shopping environment very seriously. While we respect citizens’ rights to carry firearms in public areas according to certain state laws, our company policy prohibits customers from doing so in any of our stores out of an abundance of caution for the safety and protection of the children and families shopping with us. We make our customers aware of this policy by posting signs at the front of each of our Toys“R”Us and Babies“R”Us stores nationwide. It is also

our policy not to sell any toy gun that could be mistaken for a real gun. Toys“R”Us was the first retailer in the U. S. to adopt this policy, which was established in 1994. I apologize for any inconvenience this policy has caused you.



Sincerely,



The "R"Us Team

 

[BrianJ]

I hold a Colorado CCWP and carry quite often, that being said, I personally don't have issue with Toy's R Us establishing their policy on their private property. In Colorado, private property owners can establish their own policy on allowing firearms, but it has to be posted in plain view if they are prohibited (i. e. if it's not posted, you can enter while carrying). While I may or may not decide to shop at a business on private property that prohibits firearms, I fully respect their right to designate policy on THEIR property. If I am carrying and want to go in bad enough, I can always stash my piece in my car/truck until I am done with my business. I would hope that any "conservative" would feel the same way about individual (which includes business and business owners) property rights.

 

[SHobbs]

Guess I should check out a Toys R Us thats close by and see whats posted.

 

[icman95]

I'd be curious to see what you come up with. I've been going to the one I saw the sign in for some time now and have never noticed it before. I wonder if it's always been there and I've never seen it or they just recently put it up. I tend to think that they recently put it up because that is something I would have noticed. Besides of the words there is a picture of a gun in a circle with a line through it. Kinda hard to miss.

 

[Troubleshooter]

Amen..... I fully understand liqour stores and banks, possibly even consignment/pawn/barter shops... .

On the contrary, those are exactly the sorts of places where I do want to carry. When I'm going to the bank to withdraw or deposit several thousand dollars, you'd better bet that I'm carrying. I chose my current bank for that reason (among others) and told them so at the tiime. It's also the reason that I closed the accounts at the bank that I had used for nearly 25 years, after they actively opposed CHL legislation.



As for the original post, it's a good letter but I'm not surprised at the response. Toys R Us has been anti-gun for years now, and I don't see them changing. Frankly, they've been in such financial trouble the past few years that I'm surprised that they still had a store that you could visit.



Two suggestions moving forward:



1. Find another toy retailer (preferably a mom-and-pop shop), and while you're in there buying, mention that you are no longer purchasing from Toys R Us (and why). I did this with an appliance store when one of the big-box places posted, and the familiy-owned place agreed to match the prices on comparable merchandise, to include sales items.



2. Another tact to take in future letters is to mention that CHL holders in your state are law-abiding citizens who have been fingerprinted, undergone a background check, undergone "x" hours of training, qualified with their firearm (not "weapon"), etc etc as appropriate in your state. Then ask whether they can say that about their other customers, and ask which type of customer they would rather have in theri store. Don't know about CT, but in Texas we were told that the CHL applicant underwent more extensive background checks than most police officers do.

 

[HHhuntitall]

I think if you were to get to the bottom of the real issue, it's dollar based, as always. Most insurance companies pressure their customers into making their company policies against firearms in their stores. Why that is, I don't know, but I'd bet it has to do with liberal run, media fed, fear fueled, propaganda. Actually facts don't support their policies, but they continue, nonetheless. Again, I think it gets back to control and fear, but it's their company. If they choose to do business that way, that's their choice. I've had many family and friends fight and some die for them to have that right. In the same breath, I have the right to not do business with them. If enough of us chose to use that right, in support of our core beliefs, many businesses would either go under or review their policies to accomodate the majority of it's customers. But price, luxury, and convenience is more important to many, and our apathy is what's destroying us all... ... Thanks for standing with us... .



God bless you and yours,

Casey

 

[SierraRam]

This really confuses me. Only law abiding citiizens will go through with an application for a concelaed carry permit and they are closely scrutinized. Criminals will carry anywhere they want. So if I own a business I would welcome legal concealed carry owners into my establishment, the are not going to rob me, as a matter of fact they may be able to save me and or my employee's. Of course I live in a state where it is next to imposible to obtain a CCWP so the criminals here know they are walking amoung a bunch of sheep.

 

[icman95]

I couldn't agree more with several of the last posts. I will, as I told them in the letter, stop shopping there, although there is no mom and pop alternative near me. Other big box stores are about all I have to work with. To that end, we could make this a dollars based issue in our favor. If we were to spread the word far and wide, perhaps we could get enough people to write to the company that they would have to listen to us. Of course, the apathy mentioned above does rule the world, so one can only hope.



I do recognize the fact that we are talking about private property here, and that they are welcome to make any policy they want. I even mention that in my letter to them. I am simply saying that the choices they make lead me to make certain ones of my own-specifically, refusing to shop there and spreading the word about their policy.



This all does seem to be a bit backwards as the people legally carrying the guns go through a more stringent background check than perhaps anyone else who enters the store. I guess big corporate politics doesn't see it that way. It wouldn't take much for those of you who are upset by this to email them through their website and just write a few lines to express your displeasure with this situation. Here is the link directly to the page where you fill out the form in the contact us section:



Toys"R"Us/Babies"R"Us : Help Desk



A few polite, respectful, sentences are all it takes. In this case the pen (keyboard) might truely be mightier than the sword (or firearm).

 

[AABEN]

Amen..... I fully understand liqour stores and banks, possibly even consignment/pawn/barter shops. but toys r us? Where are the pedophilia signs? hmmm...

I live in IN and we carry in the banks and liqour stores and pawn shops all the time. We have a life time CC perments Cost 125. 00

 

[HHhuntitall]

I live in Texas, and as stated, if the sign is not posted according to code, it can be ignored by CCW holders. Perhaps they are not posted properly for a reason, just to keep the insurance companies happy. I've personally never paid any attention to any of the signs. One of the privately owned banks I do business with also posts the sign, but I openly show my disdain for it and it's well known I carry right past it. The bank branch manager only has it there for his insurance purposes, and also carries, albiet discreetly. When I mention the sign to him, he assures me it's not his policy, but their insurance. When I mention that I might not be doing business there, he says he will try to do something about it. It hasn't been done yet, and I'm not a very patient man. There's a nice bank across the street that I have already begun to use, and like a great deal..... Cute girls at the counter, too... . My truck account is already moved to there, and I think the ranch account will soon follow.



As a second note, in Texas, convicted pedophiles aren't allowed within 300' of a known place where children congregate and are known to be, such as schools, playgrounds... ... kid's stores.