Oil Article

[PUFF00]

Good article on oil. I don't know the person who wrote it, but he seems to give an objective opinion.
http://www.uti.com/~hoser/4strokeoil.htm

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2001. 5 3500 QC 4X4 6-speed HO 3. 55 black
1998 Jeep TJ black http://www.nm4w.org/members/puffer.htm

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

LOOKS good - this from the end of the article pretty well summs it up:

"The more expensive synthetics; AMSOIL, Mobil 1, and Spectro offer the only truly significant differences, due to their superior high temperature oxidation resistance, high film strength, very low tendency to form deposits, stable viscosity base, and low temperature flow characteristics. Synthetics are superior lubricants compared to traditional petroleum oils. You will have to decide if their high cost is justified in your application.

The extended oil drain intervals given by the vehicle manufacturers (typically 7500 miles) and synthetic oil companies (up to 25,000 miles) are for what is called normal service. Normal service is defined as the engine at normal operating temperature, at highway speeds, and in a dust free environment. Stop and go, city driving, trips of less than 10 miles, or extreme heat or cold puts the oil change interval into the severe service category, which is 3000 miles for most vehicles. Synthetics can be run two to three times the mileage of petroleum oils with no problems. They do not react to combustion and combustion by-products to the extent that the dead dinosaur juice does. The longer drain intervals possible help take the bite out of the higher cost of the synthetics. "


AND, the final paragraph:


"If your car or bike is still under warranty you will have to stick to the recommended drain intervals. These are set for petroleum oils and the manufacturers make no official allowance for the use of synthetics. "

Which pretty much parallels the practice of GM in my '98 Camaro SS - it comes from GM with synthetic, as does the Corvette - but oil change intervals are still pretty much unchanged from vehicles supplied with conventional oils.


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http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

 

[Sled Puller]

One more writer who prints what he thinks is right and not the facts.
The fact is, even if you never change yer oil, the burden of proof is on them to prove that was the cause.
I am so sick of people scared to death about their warranty. Have some spine people and fight that dealer when he is in the wrong.

Friend of mine bought a truck and had the dealer do his oil changes for 5 years because he was scared of voiding his warranty. Sheesh!
Gene

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1997 Cummins Dodge 4x4 Bombed & Amsoiled. Amsoil Premiere Direct Jobber, Member of: NRA Business Alliance, GLTDR, WANTED: Wrecked Dodges.
www.awdist.com

 

[mikepvg]

Regarding Puff's link:
Good article #ad
BAD #'s #ad

Not sure when that article was written but these figures change year to year. Buyer must be informed w/ current data.
i. e. in 15w50 category
1) Chevron VI=154 NOT 204 *Zinc=. 145 NOT . 11
2) Mobil 1 VI=160 NOT 180 *Zinc=. 11 NOT ---

I would not assume ANY of the other #'s are correct until verified by CURRENT data sheets.
Mikey
#ad

 

[Sled Puller]

Mike,
I saw a few of the Amsoil numbers were way off too. Almost like they mixed and matched different products/manufactorers. ??? That article is losing credability fast.
Gene

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

GENE repeats a common claim concerning warranties...

"Make 'em (service managers) PROVE it was the (insert name of product HERE) that caused the failure... . "

Sounds GREAT doesn't it... But it just ISN'T practical for many of us out in the real world! So you use Amsoil, and now a rocker arm fails - it's pretty clear to YOU it's purely a mechanical defect, but the service manager sees your Amsoil sticker in the engine compartment, and states that it's the lubricant that caused the failure. NOW, you have a clear difference of opinion, and feel that you can easily have his pronouncement overturned by a zone rep - but you NEED YOUR truck, and don't have the luxury of TIME to play craphouse lawyer, so you PAY the hundred bucks to get the rocker arm replaced, and hit the road!

This IS NOT a made-up scenario - cars like my Camaro SS are being denied warranty service DAILY for the THINEST of excuses! Put new wheels on the car, and later the brake rotors warp? NO WARRANTY, the wheels did it - even tho' there is a CLEAR trail and established history of defective rotors on F-bodies by GM! Put on an aftermarket exhaust system, and later you burn a valve or bend a pushrod? Warranty DENIED - it was the exhaust system's fault - even tho' the LS1 alloy V8 is NOTED for valve and pushrod failures REGARDLESS of exhaust system!

But MOST of us just plain don't have the time or resources to stand around and FIGHT with these guys, even in cases we may well win... eventually... And in the case of some of the relatively MINOR stuff, like oil or some aftermarket filter, WHY EVEN BOTHER? There's so LITTLE in many cases to actually GAIN, it's hardly worth the effort to tempt fate to begin with!

SO, be honest Gene - if you had a truck still under warranty, with about 80,000 miles, and had NEVER changed the Amsoil in it - and the crankshaft broke - would YOU boldly vollunteer to the service manager you had never changed to oil, and then leave it to HIM to "prove" it was the oil's fault (while YOU waited to get your truck outta the shop... ) OR, would evade the issue in one way or another?

Talk's cheap, and bravado is great on internet or the movies - but when you're afoot in REAL life, some things just aren't worth it! #ad


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http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

 

[PUFF00]

Sorry for posting a link to info that seems inaccurate.

But thanks for pointing it out. Now I'll investigate it more and not take these numbers as gospel.

Next time I’ll post it as “Is this information Accurate?” instead of assuming it is.


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2001. 5 3500 QC 4X4 6-speed HO 3. 55 black
1998 Jeep TJ black http://www.nm4w.org/members/puffer.htm

 

[Sled Puller]

Still a good article Puff, I have seen it is easy to make mistakes like that in the numbers, you just have to figger out if they are HONEST mistakes!


Gary,
First of all, if you did run 80,000 miles on the same oil, you would have oil sample analysis to back it up. Or you would be an idiot, and deserve failure.
Then the garage would have to put it writing that they voided your warranty because of such and such.
If it goes that far, then Amsoil will take care of it, and go after the Dealership.
Gary,
You sit there and cry about this or that and try to come with things that MIGHT happen, but the simple truth is, Amsoil has been doing this for 28 years, and has not had a failure yet following their instructions, or a warranty voided.

Gene

 

[Sled Puller]

Lee,
I thought about that later, the age of the article. I did not see a date on it.
What would be very interesting is to see which companies have gained/lossed quality in that time.

Gary,
We agree that you have to "qualify" yourself to decide if you want the best, or no hassle off the shelf, accept plenty good enough.
I have talked quite a few people OUT of using synthetics, believe it or not.

As far as the warranties go, that is a sore subject, because I hear those lies and mistruths from all dealers from lawnmowers to snowmobiles to cars. They all have a limitied knowledge on oils, what their warranty actually covers, and a strong desire to sell you THEIR oil and THEIR oil changing service, and will give you bad info to scare you into it. Dodge tried that with me on my 5spd, I told them to stick their Castrol!!!

I am just trying to set the record straight.

As soon as you say "PUT IT IN WRITING. " They change their tune. End of story.

I am keeping my truck well beyond warranty coverage, so I'm running the best I can buy.
Don't forget, Dodges suggestions/practices are only designed to get you out of warranty!!
Gene

 

[DocStressor]

Ed Hackett wrote that article many years ago and it has been posted all over the web under many titles. The oil specs were correct at the time he did the research.

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1999 Quad cab 2500, SB, SLT, 4X4, 5-speed, 3. 54, tow and camper package, Lance 820 camper, Lance cabover stabilizers, Rancho 9000s, Airlift airbags,Reese Titan V hitch, Mag-Hytec differential cover with Amsoil 2000 75W-90 lube, Amsoil air filter

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"Gary,
You sit there and cry about this or that and try to come with things that MIGHT happen, but the simple truth is, Amsoil has been doing this for 28 years, and has not had a failure yet following their instructions, or a warranty voided. "

SORRY you feel that way Gene, I really am!

All I have attempted here is to post MY OWN concerns and points of view concerning things like various aftermarket products, oil included... Sometimes I'm able to apply first-hand info on some I have used, sometimes info based on stuff gleaned from LOTS of exposure to mechanical subjects across a wide variety of subjects. Old age helps accumulate quite a bit of info for those eager to learn (not a helluva lot ELSE to say for old age tho'!) #ad


Fortunately, for the most part, I manage to maintain the ability to exchange/express my views without need of insult or abuse to "support" my view - tho' some of the more ummm, "enthusiastic" opponents in these exchanges aren't quite as restrained...

In the case of synthetics - Amsoil in particular - these current threads have helped present enough documentation that I am FULLY convinced Amsoil is the BEST synthetic currently available for those willing due to THEIR specific wants or needs to use a synthetic. Without these discussions, that wouldn't have happened!

BUT, I have ALSO determined that it's just NOT currently practical or cost effective for ME in MY truck in view of its use and expected lifespan (both the trucks AND mine!), tho' I *do* use it in other of my cars and engines.

I've ALSO determined over time, that enduring the possibility of warranty comflicts over rather trivial issues provided by MANY aftermarket products just ISN'T WORTH IT!

AFTER the warranty period, if you just MUST use some of that stuff, have at it - but MY experience has been that PRECIOUS FEW people are successful in challenging warranty refusals - and end up with little more than LOTS of frustration and loss of transportation while appeals are in progress.

And yes, *I* have "been there - done that" too, so NOT just whistling in the wind!

If my viewpoint and expressed opinions cause you distress, sorry - that's not my goal or intention... But *my* viewpoint IS just as valid as those of any others posted here - it's up to the onlookers to decide for themselves, based on info provided.

Cheers...

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http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

[This message has been edited by Gary - KJ6Q (edited 03-24-2001). ]