Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Starting problem with my 99 24v

[jthorpe]

Hey guys. I'm having a problem with the truck. I noticed it last night. It seems that the truck is having a hard time starting sometimes. Today, when I tried to start it, I turned the key, waited for the pump to stop, waited for the start light to go out then cranked it over. It took like 6-7 seconds before the truck started. Turned over about 7 or 8 times. It's been doing that consistently all day. I'm thinking I might have a bad lift pump or something. Can you guys give me some guidance? Any help would be appreciated.



The lift pump sounds like it's running when I turn the key, but for some reason, it's taking longer than usual to start. This truck has ALWAYS started on the first try and first turnover. It's got about 84k miles on it now.



UPDATE: Well, seems to run fine once it's started. Before when I would bump the starter though, the pump would run for 10-20 seconds. It doesn't seem to be doing that anymore for some reason. At least I haven't been able to get it to do it today. BUT, like I said, when it runs it's fine. I just got back from the hospital and when I tried to start it in the hospital parking lot, it took about 7 or 8 turnovers before it would fire. Once fired though, all is good. The lift pump is the only thing I can think of other than maybe some bad fuel or something. I really have no idea. Might have to take it to the dealer this week. I don't even know where to look for the return lines, etc.



SECOND UPDATE: After letting the truck sit for a few minutes, I bumped the starter. The lift pump ran for 20 seconds or so and it seemed ok. I guess I'll never know without a FP gauge, but it seems normal. I don't get it. After I turned the truck off, it started up on the first turnover. It seems to be messing up after sitting for a while, even when the lift pump does its 20 second run. Hope I don't have a dying VP44

 

[Briar Hopper]

Those symptoms are classic, I'd bet good money it's the lift pump. There are a few members on here who have reported you can hear the lift pump run, even though it's not pumping. (broken/separated shaft, various other reasons)

You have a '99, it's possible the filter canister may have an air leak at a fitting or the seal to the lid. Not very likely, though, but still possible.

Email me your address so I can overnight a gauge & fitting to you.

 

[B.G. Smith]

Starting

I don't think the 24 valves have had the return line deterioation problem like the 12 valve trucks. It could be your lift pump. My lift pump would still run when it had completely quit pumping and the truck will run without the lift pump as long as it doesn't lose prime. You need somehow to check the lift pump output, I check mie with a automotive fuel pump pressure/vacuum gauge and a piece of hose. The fittings in the top of the filter are 1/8" pipe thread. You could loosen the banjo bolt where the fuel line enters the VP44 and bump he starter and see if it will pump fuel up to there. The only problem is if the pump is not working you may not get it primed again. The lift pump is covered by the 100,000 engine warranty. bg

 

[Pit Bull]

If you still have the OEM batteries you might want to check and see if they are the problem? Sounds like the charge is not holding and they might not be turning the mighty Cummins over as fast as they use too, causing a delayed start. Since you mentioned that it started right up after running awhile, this is my best guess since I am not there to listen and see what it is doing. Let us know what it is. Good luck.

 

[Pit Bull]

I had a "dead" lift pump and it sounded the same as the good lift pump. But I never had a starting problem when my lift pump was dead. The only reason I knew my lift pump was dead was when I attached Briars guage and it showed no psi's. Mine even ran the same with a dead lift pump.

 

[jthorpe]

Thanks for the info guys. I'm going to have Tom send me the gauge. Mine is probably toast. One thing I did notice is that it changes sound. Sometimes it seems to pump faster, then slower. Who knows, it's probably gone. I hope it's that and not a VP44. YIKES!

 

[icarus33]

Get that fuel pressure gauge installed, but make sure there is a lift pump available in town since like previously mentioned, the system may loose prime installing the gauge. The impeller shaft is ceramic, a mechanical fuse. If it shears off, the motor will still run, but will not run the pump.



ic

 

[Briar Hopper]

Pit Bull hit a good one, I clean forgot that one ! Yeah, sometimes the batteries can do that... I remember when mine failed earlier this year. AutoZone can test batteries for free. Ooops, Icarus33 also made a good point. You'll lose prime installing the fitting in the top of the filter housing. Not good. Dealer's parking lot, with the wife's car on standby, might be a good place to install the fitting. Wish I was there to help.

 

[tcoombs]

At the dealer....

In the dealers parking lot is right. My pump finally gave up the ghost when I went to put a guage on it. The insurance wouldn't cover the towing beacuse I had it towed to an out of town dealer. (Don't trust the local dealer). Truck was out of commision for a week.



Good luck.

 

[TSims]

My truck is doing the same thing - but it started doing it after the local dealer changed the lift pump(warranty) at 83K miles. I don't think it is a problem with air in the system or the filter - changed at 90K(now 93K) and had no problems purging or starting. My local transmission shop owner - an ASE certified tech and a former Chrysler tech - told me he had seen this problem in three other trucks with similar mileage(near 100K). All three turned out to be a problem with the injector pump - a cracked ring in the pump(not sure what that part is).



Anyone else heard of this diagnosis?

 

[jthorpe]

Ok here's an update guys. I didn't drive the truck yesterday but I decided to drive it to work today to see if I could repeat the problem. When I started it up at the house, it came up on the first turnover. No problem at all. Seems to run fine all the way to work. Once I got to work though, I shut it down, let it sit for about a minute then tried to start it back up. Sure enough, it took about 10-12 turnovers before the truck would start. SO, it seems like it's only doing this when it's warm. Any ideas? I'm going to check it with the fuel pressure gauge when I get home from work tonight but I thought I'd check to see what you all think.

 

[Bigramguy]

Could this be the problem if it isn't the lift pump ?



http://dodgeram.info/tsb/2000/18-15-00.htm

 

[jthorpe]

Welp, checked the fuel pressure tonight. 13 psi idle, 10 average, never below 7 WOT and I ran it hard. I'm going to let the dealer look at it tomorrow anyway so they can check the injection pump.



I also see TSB 18-015-00 is very close to what I'm seeing with mine.



Jack