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Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) The Ultimate VP44 Q&A Thread

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O. k I along with many others have somewhat of an o. k understanding about the inner working portions of the VP44 Fuel injection pump either found in our trucks or on a bench at a dealer with a red inspection tag hanging off of it. There is a complex amout of circuitry within the pump that needs some discussion so people (As well as myself) can come back to this thread and check it out from time to time to help Diag a sinking feeling, or to just to know whats happening at what time with our rigs. Solinoids , Temp sensor's , Bypasses , Electronics ..... The works. <hr>



:edit; just learned something once again from this thred!



*Note this thread is from 04-28-2002*
 
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There are

Pages that can be found on the net about the VP but the search engine is once again showing us that it can be a friend and a thread like this can be useful on the tdr.

I give credit to the Dodge ram.org site for the folowing page:

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An article appearing in the March 2000 issue of Petersons 4Wheel & Off Road quoted Dr. Diesel saying that the VP44 injector pump used on 24 Valve ISB Dodge diesel trucks was unreliable compared to the 12 valve engine's P7100 injector pump.



Curious about the claim, Roger Blind and Bill Alsip both e-mailed Cummins for a response. Cummins made some interesting comparisons between the ISB trucks and the 12 valve trucks. This is what Cummins had to say: Subject: 35259 :: Injection Pump Life



The 24 valve ISB engine in the 98 ½ Dodge has a Bosch VP44 electronic controlled fuel pump. The engine has an electronic control module connected to the pump as well as various sensors on the engine, the driveline and electronic throttle pedal. Service on the Dodge Ram has been enhanced since the engine electronics can be accessed with either Chrysler DRBIII or Cummins INSITE electronic tools. The electronic ECM is designed for the Dodge application and other controls are not compatible and there are no interchangeable chips. Operating parameters are established by the Chrysler DRBIII or Cummins INSITE tools.

The Bosch VP44 electronic fuel pump has higher injection pressures, electronic controlled timing and fueling which allows precise, instantaneous control and provides greater responsiveness over the entire power range (extended from 2700 to 3200 rpm). This is a completely new engine design platform that combines electronic engine controls with high-pressure injection as well as high strength engine componentry. The 24 valve design with cylinder centered fuel injection improves combustion efficiency which results in better emissions, fuel economy and performance. The VP44 is a radial-piston pump with 3 pistons. The pistons are attached to the distributor rotor and the fuel pump shaft. The pistons ride inside a cam ring (think of a donut with a "bumpy" hole) so as the pump shaft rotates the piston carrier, the pistons are compressed towards the center, pressurizing the fuel. The pressurized fuel is then directed to the proper cylinder by the distributor rotor.

The cam ring can be rotated in a "retarded" or "advanced" direction; this is done using a solenoid valve, which modulates pressure to a fuel-pressurized piston beneath the cam ring. Also, the start and end of injection are controlled by a solenoid valve.

Although the VP44 has initially not been as reliable as we would have liked, we (and BOSCH) are confident that its reliability will improve. The VP44 is much less complicated internally than the P7100, and it has many fewer finely machined parts.

We don't know for sure that BOSCH considered low-sulfur fuel when designing the pump, since the pump is fuel lubricated and today's fuels are low-sulfur.

The VP44 is completely fuel lubricated, as the VE pump is. It does not use oil lubrication like the P7100 does. The VP44 is expected to last at least a long as the P7100 in normal automotive applications. However, we obviously have much more "long-term" experience with the P7100 than we do with the VP44, so our knowledge base is still evolving. Soon after launch, the VP44 had its share of problems, just as the P7100 did when it was introduced, but we have worked closely with BOSCH to correct the issues with the pump, and we're confident that the VP44 will be a reliable fuel pump.

There are some significant differences between older trucks/engines and the newer trucks with the 24-valve engine. A Dodge pickup today can be 75 HP more powerful and almost 2000 lbs heavier than a 1991 W250; the weight of the trucks has increased yearly as Dodge has added safety and convenience features.

Also, the electronic controls on the 24-valve engine allow Cummins to control the power and torque very precisely across the entire RPM range. The mechanically controlled engines have their power and torque precisely controlled at torque peak and rated power RPMs, but between those two engine speeds, power and torque can often exceed the published figures.

Dodge set specific power and torque limits at particular RPMs for our engine, and with the electronic controls, we were able to meet them very accurately. This means that a mechanically controlled engine may produce more power and torque than a 24-valve engine at particular engine RPMs. This is most noticeable when one compares the trucks back-to-back, as someone who trades in an older Cummins powered Dodge would do.

While the 24-valve engine itself is more efficient than the older mechanical engines, actual observed fuel economy may differ between older and 24-valve trucks, due to the fact that



the 24-valve trucks are generally heavier,

the 24-valve trucks produce more useable power at higher RPM than the mechanical engines, allowing the driver to rev higher (the engine is not as efficient at higher RPM as it is at lower RPM), and

the previously discussed torque curve differences may promote a less efficient driving style.

Thank you for choosing Cummins power or products. Please let us know if you need assistance in locating the nearest Cummins-authorized distributor or dealer. Please feel free to use our International Dealer Locator: (http://www.cummins.com/partserv/intro.html) found on the Customer Assistance page of the Cummins website (www.cummins.com).

Let us know if have other questions, or if away from your computer, feel free to call us (toll-free, from North America) at 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357), or 1-812-377-5000 (toll call, worldwide, ask for 800-DIESELS).



Regards,

--

Powermaster Customer Assistance Center

Cummins Engine Company, Inc.

Columbus, Indiana, USA

Email: -- email address removed --



My Comments (it's my web page and I get to add my $0. 02 FWIW):



On one hand, several people have caught the Cummins statement: We don't know for sure that BOSCH considered low-sulfur fuel when designing the pump.

On the other hand, Cummins insists that the pump is designed for low sulfur fuel and no injector pump lubrication should be added to the fuel.

On the gripping hand*, there have been VP44 failures caused by insufficient fuel flow from weak fuel transfer pumps, many after only a few hours of operation with low fuel feed pressure. To me, the failures indicate that the fuel lubrication is essential to the life of the VP44 and, if there is not sufficient flow or lubrication, pump life is short. Injector pumps on the 1998 and 1999 model years have have the most trouble.



On the TDR forum, there has been a raging debate about VP44 injector pump damage caused by restriction in the PrimeLock™ remote fuel filter system. The jury is still out, but it appears that the PrimeLock filter adapter DOES reduce fuel pressure readings from the lift pump to the injection pump. When a lift pump is marginal (there have been two bulletins released by Dodge about marginal and failing lift pumps), the added restriction from ANY accessory in the fuel line can cause injector pump failure. Be very careful about adding accessories that might cause failure of an expensive part, Dodge will probably attempt to deny warranty coverage. Here is the thread, but it has become somewhat inflammatory and may be deleted.



One thing you should know:

From the service manual "The VP44 is cooled by the fuel that flows through it. ... Approximately 70% of fuel entering the pump is returned to the tank through the overflow valve and fuel return line. "

The VP44 does not inject fuel when the throttle is closed and the engine speed is above idle (i. e. decelerating or coasting). When no fuel is being injected, all of the fuel is returning to the tank and the injector pump's distributor rotor head is turning with no cooling or lubrication from fuel. I don't know how long the rotor can run with no fuel, but a lubricating fuel supplement will help maintain a film on the rotor head to help keep it cool. IMHO: Everyone with a VP44 pump should use a polymer based (not alcohol based) fuel additive that contains a pump lubricant. I use it in Sue's 2001 ETH because it doesn't cost much, and it may help keep these relatively fragile (and expensive) pumps functioning. Some suggestions: Standyne Performance Formula, Power Service Diesel Lube, and Marvel Mystery Oil. All have excellent reputations. Other folks are using Howes Lubricator Meaner Power Kleaner, Pro-Tec Diesel Fuel Conditioner, and Rotella DFA. DO NOT USE AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID. transmission fluid contains friction modifiers for the clutch packs, and these additives are not good for injection pumps. As always, YMMV! -Dave-

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Great post Tim!!! Thanks for the information. I've been using Rotella DFA since I got my truck. "But" I ran with a dead lift pump for several thousand miles. The good news is that my VP44 did not blow up :D So I figure I have a good one, plus I have only 45K miles on the beast at this point so I have another 55K miles of warranty to cover my butt. Mine is a 2000 so maybe they got better at making them by the time my truck was put together, I hope!!!
 
guess I'll get on here too....

might as well show some diagrams while we are at it, thanks to Fritz's web site (dodgeram.org)



2000 Dodge ISB ECM Left Half

2000 Dodge ISB ECM Right Half



... and here is what Blue Chip Diesel had to say about the VP44.

The best way to start this explanation is to quote an e-mail that was found on the Cummins website. "The Bosch VP44 has not been as reliable as we had hoped". Depending on whom you talk to and whom you think is being honest, you will get only some of the information you need. I will endeavor here to get you up to date and informed; the reason I can tell you more is because Bosch has not allowed any dealer yet to service, dismantle or deal with the problems except to send defective pumps back to the factory. This means we can and have dismantled many pumps to figure them out and diagnose what failed and what the cause is for the failure. We do not pretend to be any where near as smart as Bosch may be, but since there was no information and or truth out there, we felt we had to get the best information we could.



The most common problem with the pump is that the rotor seizes in the distributor section of the pump. I should note here that all rotary pumps have had this potential problem, to varying degrees; this is nothing new to the injection pump world. The most common cause and most accepted reason for this failure on rotary pumps in general, is lack of lubrication. This can be due to running out of fuel or the lower lubricity of the newer low sulphur fuels. I think this is a fairly common reason for the VP44 to seize and the reason is that the lift pump providing lubrication/fuel to the injection pump, is frequently unreliable also. They intermittently don’t create enough pressure to run the injection pump but the reason the truck stays running is that there is another fuel pump built into the injection pump, that keeps it going but at a reduced power. A lot of people now know about bad lift pumps; starting with the early 98’s not only were weak pressure wise, but also had exposed terminals on the bottom that corrode off in salt environments, leaving the truck on the side of the road because the wire fell off! The way to tell if you have a corrosion sensitive pump is to see if the electrical connection is a plug on a 6-inch pigtail coming from the bottom of the pump. If the plug is on the top cover of the pump you’re all set! The other reason I think injection pumps fail due to lubrication is many people say their truck stopped running on deceleration and not full throttle. The VP44 pump stops delivering fuel, shuts off all fuel, on deceleration which none of their other units do. This starves the rotor and distributor for fuel and therefore lubrication.



What actually happens when the rotor seizes, and this is from a Bosch Factory Rep, the slot in the rotor interferes with the distributor because of an inferior deburring process. In layman’s terms "deburring" is eliminating sharp edges. As a sharp edge isn’t strong it deflects under the 4600-PSI inside the pump. The sharp edge deflects and interferes with the distributor; it galls and then seizes. The drive plate then breaks and only the input shaft of the pump rotates. Other people have said that increased pressure from add-on device cause the failure. This statement only indicates their lack of knowledge, because, unlike most pumps, the VP44 pump does not create more fuel delivery by increasing pressure. The VP44 creates more fuel delivery by holding the fuel bypass solenoid closed longer. Fuel delivery pressure is largely controlled by the "pop off pressure " of the injector. We have proven this with a transducer on the injection lines.



The reason any aftermarket device that hooks up to the solenoid wire is blamed for the failure is that the failure 99 times out of 100 (honest numbers here) the pump fails within 20 minutes of running with power enhancement. The reason this happens is because the fuel solenoid is held closed longer, therefore using more length of the slot in the rotor. The slot in the rotor overlaps a hole in the distributor to allow for different timing and amounts of fuel to be delivered to the injector and when the solenoid holds the bypass solenoid closed longer, then the high "pop off" pressure is still there when the middle of the slot overlaps the hole. The middle of the slot is the weakest area and therefore deflects, interferes and seizes. Pump failure with fuel enhancement devices is not CAUSED by the enhancement device, but PRECIPITATED by the device. WE think this is a "glass half full" scenario rather than a "glass half empty" one, because the potential, eventual failure can be determined within controllable parameters, namely on the test run at higher power, close to home or the local dealer. The other side of the coin is, honestly, if your truck is still running 20 minutes after the installation you have a 99% chance your pump will last forever. Adding a power enhancement device that hooks to the solenoid wire can give you peace of mind that you can depend on the pump. The worst case scenario here is that the replacement pump may not be any more dependable than the first one. I know of a dealer that had to put three pumps on a 2000 truck to get it delivered to the customer! The good news is that we are seeing less and less pump failures out there; we know there have been at least three changes to the pump and hopefully they are all for the better and they are getting more reliable.



We at Blue Chip have invented a pump tester that hooks up to the same wires on the pump and can tell you in a very short time whether or not there are actual fuel signals going to the solenoid and therefore determining if the pump is working correctly. The only exception to this is if fuse number 9, in the fusebox on the left side if the dash, is blown; in other words, to diagnose a pump failure verify that fuse number nine is not blown and hook up our tester. Crank the engine and if the LED blinks you have a good pump; there are other rare kinds of pump problems, but if our tester says the pump is OK, the engine should at least idle and run. This is much easier and much less time consuming than either the Cummins tester or the DRB3 tool at the Dodge dealer.



Lastly the installation of bigger injectors; do they alleviate the high pressure and therefore failures in the VP44? Absolutely NOT. They are a bigger hole so fuel volume is increased at the same pressure. Remember fuel pressure is controlled by "Pop off" pressure more than the size of the hole! Again we have proven this with a transducer on the injection line. Bigger injectors do get more fuel into the combustion chamber sooner, therefore effectively advancing the timing and giving the engine better throttle response.



Bigger injectors are worth it but not for the reason of saving the pump.



Just wanted to add to the thread with any info I could.



Andrew
 
Awesome thread

Great job on this thread, thanks for the effort. I'd love to see some internal diagrams that show how the VP44 is assembled. Also some more info on the CANbus/J1939 technology woud be great, specifically what parameters are passed between the 3 computers on our trucks, and how exactly do the fueling boxes work their magic?



RS
 
The VP44 does not inject fuel when the throttle is closed and the engine speed is above idle (i. e. decelerating or coasting).



Correct me if I am wrong, but, why doesn't my truck stall on an off-ramp, or going down a hill? I may not totally understand diesels yet, but common sense says fuel+compression+air=idle



Josh
 
Won't stall because

In order to "stall" the engine speed must go to zero. Even though there's no fuel being injected when coasting above idle RPM, fuel will automatically be added when the ECM detects idle RPM is reached so that the engine won't stall.



RS
 
Naaaa... I still don't believe it... If I recall from my auto-shop days... Why wouldn't there be a TON of oil blowby? If I remember correctly, with combustion, that alone forces oil control rings to "work", with out the pressure of combustion, no oil control...



I'm just trying grasp this, I maybe wrong, just doesn't seem logical.





Josh
 
When the engine is above idle RPM and is coasting... . for instance going down a hill with your foot off the gas there is no fuel injected... ... if you do not believe me, just look at your pyro... it will drop to less than 200F. There is no blowby for one reason... there is no throttle plate to create a vacuum in the intake manifold... gassers do not suffer from blow by from this, so why shoud a diesel.
 
oh, and oil controll rings... the bottom set of the three are there to lubricate the cylinder, the top two seal the cylinder walls.
 
Right, the diesel cylinder takes a full charge of air with every intake stroke. So you don't have to worry about oil gettting drawn up.



The ECM/PCM detects rpm going below the set idle and adjusts fuel accordingly. I can let the clutch up slow with my foot off the accelerator and the computer feeds fuel to keep it from stalling. I can, and have, chugged up hills without going above idle. Before someone accuses me of lugging, the engine was never in a situation it couldn't accellerate out of.



The behavior will be different with an auto over a manual because the auto is always offering some resistance. With the manual, you can hear the engine stoke up when you push out the clutch in a coast down situation. Before you pushed out the clutch, the rear wheels were driving the engine quite well, thank you, and it didn't need fuel



Matt
 
Originally posted by Diesel Freak

oh, and oil controll rings... the bottom set of the three are there to lubricate the cylinder, the top two seal the cylinder walls.



Oil control rings do just that... wipe excess oil from the cylinder wall... And yes the top 2 seal the cylinder wall



Do you agree?



thanks for the replies, I seem to understand a little better now.



josh
 
Re: Hey DF

Originally posted by jstarnes

Is that white gimick in the center of the ecm (the pic that you posted) a place for a plug in PROM?







Yes, the EEPROM is the chip to the left of the PCA. . it is an Intel AB28F400 ( I do not have my notebook handy at the moment, to be sure of that or not)
 
yes it can be done, however the most you would be able to get out of the engine is 300 rear wheel HP using 275's, or 360 hp with DD3's... . you are better off buying a CAN Bus type box... Van Aaken, Edge EZ, ot Diablo Power Puck.



if you want more without the boxes, you have to hack the VP44 PCA.
 
Hi Gang,

I'd like to throw my 0. 2 cents in here.

Is this " The ultimate VP 44 Q&A Thread" ?



Ok then,

I'd like to head this thread into the "right" direction. Useless to talk about stuff that's already known and which besides most times isn't correct. Stuff inside the VP doesn't simply work exactly like the Bosch disk tells ya, or some "guru" says it works.



Let's talk about stuff that's NOT known!

As an example, do you know what's the difference between a box that works on the CAN bus, and the ones that tap the pump wire? You might think simple, the CAN bus is altered by the first ones, but WHAT exactly does the second type of box?

What kinda parameters does a CAN box type alter on the bus?



I guess my point is, let's finally make CLEAR how things work in reality...

There are too many misleading "opinions" arround here.



Just a few examples, it is NOT true:



"The VP44 does not inject fuel when the throttle is closed and the engine speed is above idle (i. e. decelerating or coasting). "



The VP DOES inject always fuel. Under coasting it injects a very small amount, but it injects fuel...



Another one. Everybody thinks that you need a "boost module" to prevent the ECM form defuelling above a certain boost.



Not true.



This was true for the very first 98. 5 software ( the one that got to be reflashed due to EPA issues). All the later softwares work in a completly different manner... .

So, what is the boost module for?



Evrybody thinks that the timing is retardet due to emissions, so advancing the timing will give more HP and better MPG.

This is only partially true.



Advancing the timing by 1. 75° gives 60% higher NOx, 2% better MPG and 1% higher HP. Advancing the timing further gives less MPG and LESS power... .



So all the talk about better MPG due to increased timing is a Urban legend at best. The higher MPG comes from a completly different parameter. Can you immagine which?



Got my point? Let's talk about reality, not urban legends... .



To understand how things work(in reality) it's simply not enough to collect informations ( most times missleading), and then claim "I KNOW". You need to use your brain and remember the basics of physiscs and internal combustion engines...



We have a perfect example right in this thread.



DF sez:

"yes it can be done, however the most you would be able to get out of the engine is 300 rear wheel HP using 275's, or 360 hp with DD3's... . you are better off buying a CAN Bus type box... Van Aaken, Edge EZ, ot Diablo Power Puck.

if you want more without the boxes, you have to hack the VP44 PCA. "



Where did you get those informations from DF? What kinda tests have you done to back up those findings?

Nice pic of the ECM you've shoved here... .



Too bad that it is MINE ECM, with MINE E-Prom with MINE socket soldered onto the board. ( I've send that pic to HAVAC a loooong time ago... )



Wouldn't it have been more correct to say, hey that's Marco's ECM... ???

Instead an "outsider" now thinks that YOU have knowledge about the ECM's technology. I suspect that might not be the complete truth... .



I don't mind that you or someone else posts a pic of mine here. If I wanted to keep that stuff secret, I would not have given them to anyone. My point (again) is the informations one gives on a public board HAVE to be correct, not missleading.

No word war intended...



Sorry for the long post.



Marco
 
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