transmission Help

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After much research and deliberation, I purchased a Convertor and VB kit. 20 miles after installation (yes 20), I realize that I have made a mistake, as the Transmission proceeded to lose 1st and second gears, and lockup no longer occurs. Kit was installed by very reputable shop, but I now have a standard case of finger pointing going on. Parts manufacturer says installers fault, installer says parts fault! All I want is a truck that will tow my 12k lb trailer, and live! Convertor seems to be ok, hard to tell after such a short period, but I now need suggestions on Valve body or Kit. Play funds have dried up, but have to fix the truck ASAP. Please advise as to what Valve body to use. The transmission will be rebuilt. (again #ad
) I know a lot of people are sold on Bill K, and no offense, but I don't like the idea of changing the governor, which seems to be required after talking to Bill. Please advise if this is incorrect.

Thank You all for any help you can give.

Truck is '96 3500 4x4 dually, with 4" exhaust and 250hp TST plate.

 

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RBrooks,

What a nightmare. I'm sympathetic, but can tell you that I've heard this sort of horror story more times than I can count, now. It's why I tell people to go to a place that both manufactures the torque converter and has a transmission shop of long standing, like SunCoast in Ft. Walton Beach, Florida. Most local transmission shops are not set up to fine tune our Rams (select proper stall speed for application, adjust line pressure, tweak valve body internal settings, etc. ) after they plug in the new torque converter. Places will tell you they are up to the task, but more are learning as they go, using your truck (and YOU) as guinea pigs.

I think your first recourse is with the shop that did the work -- then the company that sold you the torque converter. The "finger pointing" may be typical, but there shouldn't be any question about whose fault it is if your truck as truly "lost" first and second gears. The not dropping down into overdrive could be a function of a clogged valve body solenoid filter. That's easily remedied, and happened when by transmission work was done. The loss of first and second gear sounds more sinister, however. I'm definitely NOT a transmission expert, but, regardless of the cause of your trouble, I'm hoping you paid by credit card, and not personal check. If you paid by check, I'd stop payment immediately. If by credit card, you have up to 30 days to stop payment/dispute charges. I wouldn't wait too long, though. I'd really hold the shop's feet to the fire, tell 'em you don't want to hear any excuses -- just "make it right!" Remember, they have a reputation to uphold, and I'm sure their work must be guaranteed for 90 days (or, whatever), and if they're a reputable shop you shouldn't have to deal with this crap; they should be resolving the problem completely -- dealing directly with the makers of your torque converter, shift kit, and so on. If they took the parts, accepted the job, and represented that they could do the install, you have a right to expect that they will stay with the problem, no matter what it takes to resolve it, until the truck is right.

I'm sorry you've had this trouble. Best of luck getting it resolved.

------------------
97 2500 4x4, club cab, auto, 3. 54 limited slip, JRE 4" exhaust, Dr. Performance Fuel system (370 HP), "Twister Turbo," Geno's guages -- Boost, EGT, transmission & Rear -- MAG Hytec covers, SunCoast Converter/Transgo shift kit, Brite Box, tons o'chrome under hood, Prime Loc, EZ Drain, Seat covers, wood dash, Rancho Suspension, Warn M12000 Winch on Warn Brush Guard, Warn driving and fog lights, Hella twin back up lights, 285/75/R16 B. F. G. ATs on Mickey Thompson "Classic" rims; Linex bed liner, BD exhaust brake.

 

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Unfortunatly, here in Vermont there is no one that even understands the word Cummins, much less knows how to work on them and there appendages. (transmission, etc) Therefore I purchased the parts from a TDR advertisor and brought them to a shop that I trust. They will help me to some extent, but they feel that the VB kit is the problem. I tend to agree with them, as I watched the kit be installed, and feel that they did the job correctly.

I have basicly written off the $2k investment as learning curve, hoping that the Convertor works with some other VB ok, and trying again. The shop that did the work will get the job again, but with some other VB.

Due to the extensive modifications done to the VB, I feel that I am safer starting over with a new VB, not a kit. Possibly BD, but am looking for recommendations.

 

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Rob,

You gotta do what you think's right, dude. I bought a Trans-Go shift kit, which is really nothing more than a couple of springs and a set of instructions which tells the technician to drill a couple of tiny holes in the valve body, upper housing separator plate.

The technician then swaps out the regulator valve spring and the throttle valve spring, then buttons everything back up and replaces the unit (valve body), fills her back up with fluid and you're good to go. The folks at Trans-Go are very patient in walking technicians through this process the first time they do it.

I don't understand why you'd have to replace the entire valve body, though. Maybe they drilled a hole too big in the upper housing plate, resulting in pressure that was too high. The hole can be (if that's the case) peened shut, then redrilled, properly. In any case there's nothing else about the valve body that they could've screwed up during this process. The Governor pressure solenoid, Governor pressure sensor, converter clutch/overdrive solenoid assembly (including sump temperature thermistor) and all the other valve body components should be perfectly fine.

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "valve body kit," unless it is something far more exotic than what was done to my transmission/valve body by the good folks at Trans-Go. My transmission has been harnessed to my 400 hp Cummins for about 35,000 miles, now, with nary a problem.

A new valve body (47RE transmission Dodge part #5211-8646) is $548. 70! Yikes! The mechanic's "shop price" on that item is $438. 96... That's a lot of money, either way.

I really hope the people who built your "kit," and the shop will decide to do the right thing and pay for their own "education," instead of simply agreeing to do the job over again, on your nickel. If they screwed the pooch the first time, what makes you think they'll get it right, this time... ?

I'd call "Trans-Go," and ask for Dave. They make the best shift kit going, IMO.

Good luck, compadre. .

 

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The valve body kit that was used was much more involved then the transgo kit. Holes drilled in valvebody itself, holes plugged in seperator plate, several new valves, etc... . Kit install took 3 hrs with two tech's working on it!

You say you have 400hp, what sort of load? Towing anything? Just trying to compare apples to apples!

 

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Rbrooks:

I tow a small trailer with my tools, quite often. The weight varies, but my truck, empty, weighs about 7500 lbs. Weight of my trailer full of tools is maybe 6,000 pounds. I'm sure that you, routinely, trailer a lot more weight than that.

I had my truck built more for racing and playing than heavy duty trailering. I don't think that I could have this much power and trailer heavy loads, day in and day out, without frying a transmission, or twisting off a drive shaft. My converter has a stall speed of about 1650-1700.

When I had the converter installed, I had the shop go through the transmission and install the heaviest rated "competition" clutch packs and coleens. My truck will run the quarter mile at just over 90 mph on tall tires. It's a lot of fun to drive, but it's probably not something that would make an ideal towing platform. Maybe with a light foot and 4. 10 gears. #ad

 

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rbrooks,
if you want help email me, if you want the vb fixed you may have to fax me the instructions so i can review them, otherwise you can get a core vb and start over.
valve body cores are cheap

 

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Rbrooks,
Bummer, I dont know what kit you had installed, but the trans go kit has holes that have to be drilled the v-body as well as the plate. I installed mine myself, with a couple of questins back to TransGo, which were great to work with. Took me about 6 hrs in two spurts to complete the work. Thats been 15-20k mile ago, without any problems.
I would think that a Transmision Shop would be better at it than me. After all the transmission is a transmission, it is just attached to a real motor.
My $. 02 is that Bill K. has a great looking product, and if i have a prob. I will have to look closer at it.
My truck pulls the 27' Fiver without any problems,total weight at about 13-14k truck and all.
Good luck,
Randy

 

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I haul a 5ver that weighs in about 12. 5K. I just put Bill K's torque converter and BD Gov Spring kit, and am completely sold on both. I will also be installing his valve body hopefully this week. I spoke with Bill indepth about his products and warranty work if needed. I'd recommend you contact him for advice and for his products if your still on the market for them. I haven't read anything negative about his TC or valve body and have recommended them to other locals based upon my experience. You can visit his site at www.dieseltrans.com and that'll get you his phone number also. Good luck.

------------------
'95, 2500, 4X4, ext cab, white, Banks Power Pak, Kondolay TC, Horton Fan, Bosch 215, BD Governor Springs, Wiley Coyote strapped to my grill
Parts On hand to install Kondolay valve body, Bully Dawg Propane and 16cm housing
Parts on order are Griffin Radiator

 

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Mr. Brooks,

It makes no difference to me who you chose to do your work for you.

I merely want to clarify something you said about my advice to you regarding the governor springs. While it is not necessary to have these kits for use with our valve bodies,12 valve customers that have installed them like them.

12 Valve engines cut back fuel at varying rates anywhere from 2300-2600rpms on a stock pump. When i calibrate a valve body i also pre-set the shift points at wide open throttle for the 12 valve engines.

As you may not be aware , i am an ex-employee of BD and eventhough i personally do NOT like the owner or his business practices i recommended the kit as i truly felt it was best for your application.

DTT can set the shift points at whatever the customer chooses, whether its 2300rpms or 4000rpms.
We set at 100rpms before fuel cutback.
Just want to set the record straight,
Bill




[This message has been edited by Bill Kondolay (edited 10-17-2000). ]

 

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I just want to know why nobody thinks it is at all remarkable that this guy has been "pantsed" by the people who have provided him parts and labor, and, for a lot of money, I might add.

And, Mr. Brooks, I don't understand your attitude, to be honest with you. It seems to be, "Ho-hum, that's a $2,000 shot-in-the-shorts, but 'I TRIED TO BY-PASS THE CUSSING FILTER happens!'"

I don't get it. On another thread, we've got a bunch of posters up in arms because their steering wheels and fuel senders are giving spotty service after 85,000 miles. One poster took me to task for accepting, without a fight, having to replace some leaking seals at 70,000 miles.

Here's a case of an individual who's having to hit-the-hip for serious cash at (SAY WHA??) 20 miles, and everybody seems to be stifling a huge, collective yawn. I can't understand it, at all. If this isn't a case of a customer getting SERIOUSLY REAMED, here, I must not be understanding the facts correctly.

Does his testimony bespeak professionalism on the part of the shop doing the work, or the vendors involved? Does anybody give a rat's nasty?

I don't get it, at all.

I just wish, during my decades as a remodeler, that I had been blessed with customers like this. I could've installed skylights that leaked, shower pans that flooded rooms below, doors that bound on their hinges, floors that creaked, wall-board that bulged, walls that leaned at crazy angles, lights that didn't switch on, walks that didn't pitch water properly, tile floors that cracked, windows that leaked cold air, and furnaces that leaked carbon monoxide into the house, killing the occupants.

Not to worry, though. See, after all, I really, really tried to do my job -- even if I failed. "All part of the learning curve," that's all.

Sheeze... #ad

 

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Sasquatch,

I actually could not agree with you more! The shop that is doing the work is actually helpful and is standing behind their work, but they don't understand whaat is wrong. There seems to be no problems in the VB (It has been apart twice since) and the manufacturer of the parts is being less then helpful. Truth is, I'm PISSED, but it seems to be the story of this truck. At less then 60k mi I have put a steering box in, and now it needs another, transmission at 40k, (And now 59k) replaced both doors due to rust(at least that was warranty) and too many minor breakdowns to mention (Steering hoses, Throttle cables, etc... ) I bought the truck used, no warranty, so I seem to be on the wrong side of things. The Ford is starting to look awful tempting, but I hate the thought of the payments!

I am hoping that this will not be as expensive as it seems, but the thruck will be parked for a few weeks before I find out as I do not have the money to replace any major components right away. I will continue to fight with it myself, weather permitting, as it does not fit inside my shop.

Thanks to all that have responded, and keep the info coming!

Rodney

 

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i'm a little lost here , you bought a valve body "KIT" ,only one "KIT" on the market that i know of , and because i have heard enough people claim about problems with this "KIT", i decided that it was not the "KIT" for me.

part of the problem may be that we diesel owners are cheap SOB's , so instead of buying a valvebody that is proven for $300 plus , we spend $75 - $100 for a "KIT" that is supposedly used in the $300+ VB , HOGWASH !! i am the cheapest guy i know and after hearing the few horror stories i decided to buy a VB that is actually TESTED before it's stuck in the box . if it doesn't work it takes a little off my shoulder as being something "I" did , and i have install shift "KITS" in the past.

if i remember how these transmissions work , 1st and reverse are one drum/assembly , 2nd and 3rd the other , and OD is an animal all in it self . i have to say that your VB is the problem , and though the shop is competent as you say , something was done incorrectly , hopefully it didn't hurt anything else inside the trans.

but i have to agree , if i just spent $2k for a trans upgrade, i wouldn't be so la di da and just chalk it up as a bad experience. it's things like this that make me happy i have an awesome set of tools ,a shop manual ,and some hands on knowledge.

[This message has been edited by Mopar-muscle (edited 10-20-2000). ]

 

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After some valve body mods that increase presures, often the PCM puts the truck into limp home mode. The problem appears to be an overvoltage problem and a resister needs to be installed to remedy the limp home scinareo. This problem is fairly well understood by most valve body manufacturers. Trans-go is not on my list of offering enthusiastic customer support... In fact, IMHO, they stink! I would not be surprised if they never even heard of the problems caused by higher then stock pressures in our Dodges. Check the voltage output and install a 1/2 watt 100 ohm resistor in line to stop the limp home mode caused by over presures.
-Paul R. Haller-

 

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well paul , that explains why the DTT valvebody comes with a resistor and instructions for its install inside the trans on the wiring harness ( this can also be added outside the trans ) . i was not told the reason for the resistor , just to add it , in fact i didn't know i had to add it till i got the VB and read the instructions (this is not a bash but just an observation i have spent hours on the phone concerning my trans mods and this is not the first thing i missed and won't be the last). i'll be installing it this weekend . good heads up!!

 

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I heard about the resistor through a few sources and have installed it in orange wire just outside of transmission. This seems to be the easiest place for the install. However, this did not cure any of the problems.

The kit that I used is NOT a transgo, but it did not mention this resistor either. That info was gleaned from this site.

 

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well that leaves the resistor theory out , and as far as the OTHER kit , i have not heard anything either good or bad about it .

to bad you weren't a bit closer to me to be able to drive the ram down to mass. on saturday i will have a STOCK VB in hand to use as a test piece for a swap out to see where the problem is . hint hint.

 

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Mopar-Muscle, have actually heard some good things about the kit, just not from my own mouth!

Appreciate the offer, but already have a VB coming from GOEREND on a similar offer. (See email that was sent to you 10/19, 11pm)