What oil is in your Cummiins today ?

[gtwitch]

In answer about Phosphorus that and Zinc are two additivs that help to lubricate engine parts in shear ie Cam and flat followers which are comming less used in the modern roller tappet auto/truck engines, however Cummins still have flat tappet design as do most of the avaition engines of the past 50 years and IMO Zinc and phosphorus are necessary and both T4 and T6 Rotella both have these. I am not a lubrication engineer but have done lots of reading and research in the last 40 years of building and raceing high HP engines. In these endeavors, I have used mostly Valvolline and Rotella oils and maybe just luckey but have never had an engine failure due to lubrication or the lack of! Most of this are observations on my part.
gtwitch in wyoming

 

[gtwitch]

In answer about Phosphorus that and Zinc are two additivs that help to lubricate engine parts in shear ie Cam and flat followers which are comming less used in the modern roller tappet auto/truck engines, however Cummins still have flat tappet design as do most of the avaition engines of the past 50 years and IMO Zinc and phosphorus are necessary and both T4 and T6 Rotella both have these. I am not a lubrication engineer but have done lots of reading and research in the last 40 years of building and raceing high HP engines. In these endeavors, I have used mostly Valvolline and Rotella oils and maybe just luckey but have never had an engine failure due to lubrication or the lack of! Most of this are observations on my part.
gtwitch in wyoming

 

[brcbruiser]

Shell Rotella T6 Synthetic

 

[Newsa]

Since Ford won't comment on the specific problem they're seeing in their engines I'm assuming it's a design deficiency unique to their platform. Just look for Cummins CES 20086 on any CK4 bottle, it is their stamp of approval and includes several ISB tests.

Ford may not have publicly commented. But there is a video that says Ford thinks the new oil us too thin. Do they have concerns about film strength?

 

[Jared Herzog]

Wonder how many guys like me ran out and bought the Rotella T6 thinking it was cj4, because that is what the bottle said, only to dump ck4 in. If you did that with a Ford it could be an issue. I do not think they should have incorrectly marked the bottle. Or, was their cj4 already meeting the ck4 spec so no actual formulation change was necessary? The engineer i talked with said it was "market ready" early but the label change was not necessary until Jan1.

 

[Newsa]

I think Redline hasn't yet changed to CK4 yet. They are taking their time.

And there's Kendall Super D XA that has a titanium supplement additive that partly replaces the zinc/phosphorus. Kendall Super D XA is CK4, but meets standard by lowering ZDDP but adding something almost as good?

 

[Newsa]

In answer about Phosphorus that and Zinc are two additivs that help to lubricate engine parts in shear ie Cam and flat followers which are comming less used in the modern roller tappet auto/truck engines, however Cummins still have flat tappet design as do most of the avaition engines of the past 50 years and IMO Zinc and phosphorus are necessary and both T4 and T6 Rotella both have these. I am not a lubrication engineer but have done lots of reading and research in the last 40 years of building and raceing high HP engines. In these endeavors, I have used mostly Valvolline and Rotella oils and maybe just luckey but have never had an engine failure due to lubrication or the lack of! Most of this are observations on my part.
gtwitch in wyoming

See this update. Diesel oils (including multiweight) that are specific to diesels will not be required to reduce their ZDDP content. If they are a 40 weight oil (including multiweight) and do not have the SN gasoline sticker.

https://www.oildepot.ca/solution-ford-concerns-2017-api-ck-4-diesel-motor-oil-specs/

 

[Jared Herzog]

I am not totally opposed to ck4. I am bad with change. I always stick with what works but time goes on and changes happen. I just do not want to cut corners because it is easy. I want a good oil that will not shorten the life of my truck. I can return the six gallons of t6 ck4 marked cj4 unless you guys say run it. Then i will run it. The motorcraft says it is cj4/ci4. But i do not think it is synthetic. It is not ck4.
Has anyone done UOA on the ck4 after an oil change interval? There has to be some labs testing this stuff new and old and have an opinion on it.
One thing to note is my truck is at 23,000 miles. The first two changes were T6. On a cold start, in Texas so not cold really, i had a tap for a few seconds. I think this is normal and remember all my trucks making more noise when cold. Anyway, this tap is either quieter or gone with the Mopar oil 15w40. I want to settle on an oil for my next change within these new standards and stick with one brand. It could be old cj4 or new ck4 in any brand. So in summary i am no longer sold on and set up for Rotella T6. Every option is now on the table for me including additives for oil.

 

[JR]

Ford may not have publicly commented. But there is a video that says Ford thinks the new oil us too thin. Do they have concerns about film strength?

Their issue with the FA4 10w30 is ironic given the Power Stroke is factory filled with 10w30. It is not a question of viscosity, film strength, lower phos or any other oil related composition but a design issue unique to the Ford engine. Since they won't release any specific reasons for their recommendation it's difficult for me to take the seriously. Esp. when Cummins, DD, Cat, Mack, etc. have all tested and approved the CK4. All Shell CK4 products meet CES 20086. There are also more ISB specific tests to meet the CK4 rating than the CJ4.

 

[Newsa]

Their issue with the FA4 10w30 is ironic given the Power Stroke is factory filled with 10w30. It is not a question of viscosity, film strength, lower phos or any other oil related composition but a design issue unique to the Ford engine. Since they won't release any specific reasons for their recommendation it's difficult for me to take the seriously. Esp. when Cummins, DD, Cat, Mack, etc. have all tested and approved the CK4. All Shell CK4 products meet CES 20086. There are also more ISB specific tests to meet the CK4 rating than the CJ4.

Some suggested that there is a design problem with the powerstroke. A little reading up on the issue showed me that Ford used a HEIU high pressure motor oil system for the fuel injectors. And ford had a history of being very picky about which 10w-30 or 15w-40 (picky about brand/manufacturer) was used in the powerstrokes. There was some talk in my research of motor oil getting aerated which seems a real problem for a lubricating oil???

Cummins , on the contrary, only used motor oil for lubrication.

Does anyone think or have info on why Ford has an issue with using the CK4 oils in the current powerstroke? Just curious about the design differences. And curious if Duramax had any of the powerstroke issues.

Thx

 

[18Dodger18]

Vavolinbe Blue 15-40 Synthetic Lube Oil..

Valvoline premium blue 5w40 synthetic

SNOKING

SNOKING, Do you have that info about the Valvoline Blue on "Good authority"..? If so, thanks...
That would probably be as good or better than most to continue running. I have had extremely GOOD LUCK running Shell Rotella T-6, so that is what I probably will continue to use..
Olde Bob
(18Dodger18)

 

[JR]

Some suggested that there is a design problem with the powerstroke. A little reading up on the issue showed me that Ford used a HEIU high pressure motor oil system for the fuel injectors. And ford had a history of being very picky about which 10w-30 or 15w-40 (picky about brand/manufacturer) was used in the powerstrokes. There was some talk in my research of motor oil getting aerated which seems a real problem for a lubricating oil???

Cummins , on the contrary, only used motor oil for lubrication.

Does anyone think or have info on why Ford has an issue with using the CK4 oils in the current powerstroke? Just curious about the design differences. And curious if Duramax had any of the powerstroke issues.

Thx

HEUI was a Navistar and Cat thing. None of those engines ever had issues related to oil specs. When Ford broke away from Navistar they changed up the fuel system to a CP4. While these have been problematic they are essentially an updated version that is on the Cummins engine and do not require oil pressure for operation.
I'm no expert but I've seen the internals of Fords engines and while they are impressive I've got reservations on the longevity of them. Ford engineered the heads from the ground up - aluminum in construction, reverse flow, 4 valves per cylinder with bridgeless rocker arms. there is also only one cam follower per set of valves - like I said quite radical and they very well may be running on the ragged edge of durability vs Performance.

 

[Newsa]

Accidental duplicate post

 

[Newsa]

SNOKING, Do you have that info about the Valvoline Blue on "Good authority"..? If so, thanks...
That would probably be as good or better than most to continue running. I have had extremely GOOD LUCK running Shell Rotella T-6, so that is what I probably will continue to use..
Olde Bob
(18Dodger18)

There are wide varieties of synthetic. My opinion is that Valvoline Blue is one of the better ones. I really like redline and amsoil as well. Even Kendall Super D EX blend (not 100% synthetic, but seems to work as well as most full syns according to reviews) is a high performing oil.

Here is some info for those looking for what oil to use. Doesn't endorse a brand. It just speaks about the superiority of synthetics.

Note the last paragraph that concludes synthetics are well worth the extra cost.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/class...il-benefits-autotips-0608-20170607-story.html

 

[bigceltic]

Here is a link to the study I received from Amsoil
http://www.amsoil.com/lit/AAA-Research-Report-Synthetic-vs-Conventional.pdf

 

[Newsa]

There are wide varieties of synthetic. My opinion is that Valvoline Blue is one of the better ones. I really like redline and amsoil as well. Even Kendall Super D EX blend (not 100% synthetic, but seems to work as well as most full syns according to reviews) is a high performing oil.

Here is some info for those looking for what oil to use. Doesn't endorse a brand. It just speaks about the superiority of synthetics.

Note the last paragraph that concludes synthetics are well worth the extra cost.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/class...il-benefits-autotips-0608-20170607-story.html

www.businessinsider.com/aaa-study-explains-why-synthetic-oil-is-better-for-you-car-2017-6

 

[Micsol]

Don't want to hijack this thread but will I do harm running 5w-40 synthetic during the summer months. Owners manual says to run it in low temps

 

[Killer223]

No, it'll be fine.

 

[Newsa]

This is in my 2013 manual (diesel supp).

All synthetics are better than conventional, but there are a few synthetic 15w40's.

That's what I run (15w40 syn) year round in Florida except for the 4 free oil changes and one bout with Rotella T6 (Because of rebate). And some Kendall super D XA syn blend on another occasion.

 

[rsg1963]

Usually Valvoline Blue 15w-40, currently Royal Purple 5w-40, and almost always either Mopar filter or Mobile 1 filter.