Air Intake Revisited

[Bob4x4]

I am not trying to dispute any cfm gains,I just saw very little differance in flow between the Banks and ATS manifolds compared to what Cfm saw.

There are definite rpms and loads where the improved intakes will shine. I don't think there is any validity to the one dyno that showed Banks intake lost hp,even though that one test has been highly touted here on TDR.

I am also more than a bit curious why the cfm ads are no longer showing the ATS comparison?

I have E-mailed the dyno chart that shows a stock fueled truck under a simulated heavy towing situation with and with out the intake to another member who may have the software/expertise to post it here.



Bob

 

[CDonaldson]

hotram03, we're not fighting, just a little spirited banter.



hey Bob - bench test vrs realtime apps - would actually be a difference, but not enough to make any one of them specifically take any kind of a drop or jump out ahead of the pack. Everyone's trucks are enough different that trying to compare them on different trucks with your own truck in mind for the mod - apples and oranges. Different intercoolers will change numbers, different turbos will change numberes, different air filters and intakes will change numbers. So, at least there is bench testing to do a generalized comparison.



I think the 'color scheme' of the charts in the ads is the reference to Banks/red and ATS/blue. Now they will have to repeat their tests to add the new guys/competition - BD and Glacier.



I guess if you study the physical differences in the two (Banks and ATS) they are somewhat different. Might be you would actually have to calculate the cu ins of the manifold air chambers and bend radius(s) to explain why the difference. Even using length as a gradual collector to 'straighten' flow could be a factor. I'd love to see some kind of interior wind tunnel stuff done, maybe a clear model so you could see how much turbulence occurs inside. That might explain the differences in the two as well.



Regardless, ALL of them are better than stock when it comes to air flow. To me that's what is important, PLUS they are ALL nicer looking than the stock unit.



CD

 

[Bob4x4]

Ok if I did this right these dyno runs are with and with out the new AFE intake manifold,stock fueling,stge 2 air kit and Cat back 4" exhaust 37" tires in 2nd gear 48re (stock Trans) with 15klbs load simulation

#ad




Bob

 

[nickleinonen]

which one is which on the above graph? [and where are the pictures?]

 

[Bob4x4]

which one is which on the above graph? [and where are the pictures?]

The dotted lines are the AFE and the solid is stock intake. With the stock trans I did not want to push my luck. Still had many runs on it to insure repeatibility of the results. All the highs and lows were thrown out and these runs are represenitive of the many. I have been working like crazy this week end so I can got to Baja for the 500. I will try to get a pic taken today



Bob

 

[dsherman]

Dave as I told you in pm Many dyno tests,and over the road testing does not make a freebie :-{}. I have said over and over again in private and in public I will never recommend a product I have not personnaly tested. Now if you want to make this personal keep it up. At what restriction did CFM do their testing?No one will come forth and say

I wish we would have had one to test also but it did not happen in time.



Bob

Bob,

Like I said before you can’t give a nonbias opinion when you have or make personal and financial gains from each company.

For example you were big on KORE systems because you got yours for COST! You thought that was the best thing out since the napkin and you got a lot of people believing it so you helped sale their systems.

Now you flipped sides to support and help sale Sage/Carli suspensions systems WHY!! Will because he gave you a complete 3" Carli suspensions to R&D and you sold your KORE system. Now you’re big on Carli's system.

So honestly Bob, You can't give a nonbias honest opinion can you with any credibility. You sale AFE products so you have strong ties with nick and you help sale and promote Carli's systems. So what gives

Thats my take on this matter.

__________________

 

[dsherman]

The dotted lines are the AFE and the solid is stock intake. With the stock trans I did not want to push my luck. Still had many runs on it to insure repeatibility of the results. All the highs and lows were thrown out and these runs are represenitive of the many. I have been working like crazy this week end so I can got to Baja for the 500. I will try to get a pic taken today



Bob

Take some pics of the inside I wont to see if is a take off of the tag products

 

[Bob4x4]

Take some pics of the inside I wont to see if is a take off of the tag products

No, it is an original design from an AFE engineer using proven technology.



Bob

 

[dflesher65]

Is it me or does dsherman seem like a unhappy camper, from what I heard dsherman got a lot of freeies too! And sold them! It sounds like jealousyto me!



Dwight

 

[Bob4x4]

Is it me or does dsherman seem like a unhappy camper, from what I heard dsherman got a lot of freeies too! And sold them! It sounds like jealousyto me!



Dwight

You may have hit the nail on the head :-laf



Bob,always testing

 

[hotram03]

Gee if they are freebies, could I test too!

 

[dflesher65]

Hell, I wish I could get some gauges installed for a good price! Among many other things that I would like to do to my truck:-laf

 

[ASchwartz]

Hell, I wish I could get some gauges installed for a good price! Among many other things that I would like to do to my truck:-laf

Dwight,



You buy the gauges and I'll help you install them.



Avi

 

[CDonaldson]

Well, the only thing I have gotten for my truck that was free, was actually a birthday present I think, was a muffler elimination pipe. so any comments I have about something I bought and paid for the right to talk about it.



Having said that - BOB - thanks for posting the dyno stuff, good information. My local TDR club is scheduling a dyno day sometime later this year, I may go and dyno my truck with the GDP intake horn if it is on a day I can go to Albuquerque. That is about a 3 hour trip one way 230 miles, so I need to have the day off to go.



CD

 

[Bob4x4]

Having said that - BOB - thanks for posting the dyno stuff, good information. My local TDR club is scheduling a dyno day sometime later this year, I may go and dyno my truck with the GDP intake horn if it is on a day I can go to Albuquerque. That is about a 3 hour trip one way 230 miles, so I need to have the day off to go.



CD

Are you going to have time to dyno before and after intake... ... ..... same day?



Bob

 

[dflesher65]

Avi,

I'm going to take you up on that, I've had my gauges for months but can't seem to find someone to install them for a reasonable price.

I'll PM you after work. My wife is off to Hawaii this weekend and I have it all to myself for once

 

[CDonaldson]

Hey Bob.



I go up to Albq now and then, I may make arrangements to dyno on one of my trips. I can take my stock intake up with me, it will only take a few minutes to change it and dyno both stock and GDP. I just have to find time to make a trip up. Not going to happen in the next month or so, I have a very full calendar until mid-end of July. If the TDR club has a dyno day I can probably get into the dyno twice. The fellow who has the shop is a real nice guy, I'm sure he will be fine with 2 dynos.



CD

 

[moonranch]

Hey Bob.



I go up to Albq now and then, I may make arrangements to dyno on one of my trips. I can take my stock intake up with me, it will only take a few minutes to change it and dyno both stock and GDP. I just have to find time to make a trip up. Not going to happen in the next month or so, I have a very full calendar until mid-end of July. If the TDR club has a dyno day I can probably get into the dyno twice. The fellow who has the shop is a real nice guy, I'm sure he will be fine with 2 dynos.



CD

CDonaldson-Let me know if you dyno in ABQ, with or without NMTDR. I will bring along my CFM+ and we can test it along with the others.

 

[JDerbedrossian]

Dwight,



You buy the gauges and I'll help you install them.



Avi

Avi, wrench day at your house sooner then you thought. Lets do it. And one more thing about this freebie stuff going on, I know for a fact that bob4x4's truck was abused for this testing on the dyno, not many people put up their personal trucks(45,000$) for that kind of punishment. So thank you bob for doing this for us, now we know it works and I will be changing my banks high ram as soon as possible.



Jake

 

[CDonaldson]

moonranch.



I'll have to get the number for the dyno guy and see what he says about us coming in to test this stuff. Maybe if it is an 'off' day for him, and his dyno isn't busy, he will let us just r&r them in the dyno bay. I met him this past year at the last NMTDR dyno day, very nice fellow. I will get back to you with information as soon as I can. I do know his shop is normally open M-F, so I am guessing we would have to make it a week day.



CD