bad trannie

[f.boyle]

my trannie makes bad noises. it grinds when down shifting in to second, and whines the rest of the time but it has the extra quart, well proble half the extra quart now. now here is where you can help me. SHould I go nv4500, back to the gutbag or (drum roll please)NV5600???? Now I have prices ready to install,

Nv4500- $1900+clutch

gutbag- $1600+clutch

NV5600-$3800+drive shaft mods and clutch

I was thinking the 4500 and a gearvendors down the road but I drive truck all day then get in my dodge to go home and forget that it takes it for ever to get prepped for 3rd. so I really want the 6r. help will the 4500 take the beating towing, and hopefully pulling will dishout?

 

[dpuckett]

First off, some noise from the Getrag- a whine, if you will- is considered normal, though not necessarily good, bad or indifferent.



Second, how fast are you going when you downshift into 2nd? I almost NEVER downshift into 2nd, esp with the 4. 10 gearing. I just leave it in 3rd, unless I get down to about 11mph. Loaded, is a different story, though- I drive it like a totaly different truck then.



What do you mean by "getting prepped for 3rd?"



Personally, I'd check the Getrag out and see if it even needs rebuilt. If it is just a light whine, esp under load and at certain RPMs, I wouldnt worry for right now; just keep the fluid changed regularly and dont abuse it TOO badly. OTOH, if it is whining loud enough to beat out the engine or radio, then it's time to look into a rebuild.



If you go for a NV4500, get a steel transmission-to-Tcase adptor, esp if you plan to go with an OD unit behind the Tcase. Then make sure you get the updated 5ht gear set up. If you dont, you may as well go for a Getrag.



Daniel

 

[f.boyle]

it whines a lot more consistantly and much louder than it used to. I was thinking go for som 75-90 gear oil see if that shut it up a bit. I am going about 7-10 mph slower than some times faster than others. It has only started the grinding thing in the last 200miles, and sometimes when I shift, it makes a sound like the bearing are gone on a shaft it started the whining thing on the other side of texas so we stopped and I checked the oil level, it was fine. the reason I checked it was because it leaks.

I hope some of thisa babbleing helps yall figure out what the heck I did/ need to do.

Chainsaw



oh ya- and getting prepped for third means winding second up so when you go in to third with a load it doesnt doggoutreally bad just a little.

 

[1stgen4evr]

The whinning little B

Gear whine is always caused by improper gear mesh. That means you are loosing preload on the bearings. Whinning all the time? Probably the front countershaft bearing going out.



More than a whine is from scuffing on a gear pair. Has the transmission been run low at any time?



Grinding into a gear is most likely the syncro failing. My shift/load/ratio pattern caused a failure on the third gear syncro after about 375k miles. Installed a "new" used syncro and back at work. If you have composite syncros, you must use a compatible synthetic lube.



I have 425k miles on a getrag that has never had a real rebuild. I have had it out and put a few parts in it on three different occasions and reset the preload on each of those occasions. And I would add that this is not a sunday drive but a roadwork truck.



Just had a bad front ujoint fool me into thinking I had a transmission or differential going out. Must be getting old. That would have never happened when I was fifty. Check everything out.



I would like to have a 5600 but till I can wiggle my nose and have it, I won't. The getrag has done me an admirable job. The mod would cost more than the truck would bring.



I have posted on inspecting the getrag. You can find it in the archives. If not, PM and I will send that to you. You can tell a lot without removing the transmission.



Leaks? My guess is you will be working on it.



My transmission has had 85aw since abut 125k miles. According to all the info here, that is a no no. Works for me. It won't correct a failing bearing.



1stgen4evr

James

 

[f.boyle]

I was talking to a TDR member on the telephone he said he heard of the pilot bushing crapping out so they would machine for a pilot bearing and that would make a big differance.

 

[dpuckett]

oh ya- and getting prepped for third means winding second up so when you go in to third with a load it doesnt doggoutreally bad just a little.

Sounds like you need more fuel to cure that problem. Up to 20K GCVW, I've never had a problem in this, or my last 1ton, which frequently saw 23K.



Oh yeah, one more thing I forgot to mention- the clutch will interchange from the Getrag to the NV4500. HAVe to get a new flywheel adaptor, I think, though.



-DP

 

[f.boyle]

the people at blumenthal said all I need is the bellhousing. I'm not sure if I want to put back inthe old cluch or get a new one. or put the old one in for a bit so I can get my new trannie in sooner the clutches for this truck is expensive. I fould a brand new luk for $ 150 but I guess there not worth much. TDR said so. what clutch should I put in?

 

[dpuckett]

To say I wasnt impressed with the LuK would be an understatement. I know a guy who got 500K out of his original Sachs in a 90. if you're going to get a new clutch, give South Bend a call. I've heard nothing but good about them. There are a few others out there, but SBC is a big supporter of the TDR, and the R&D some of the high HP junkies go through.



-DP

 

[f.boyle]

new theory behind bad noises now I'm noticing it in all gears up &down shifting could it just be my pilot bearing making wierd noises? I'll try to describe it the best I can: with the clutch pushed in and rolling/some times stopped it sounds as though some thing is wobbeling around. thats the best way I can put it. Please help me?:{ Oo.

Frank

 

[f.boyle]

another thing if I drain the oil out it should have metal flakes in it correct? is it possible that this is in the transfercase not the transmition? If I were to pull the pto covers would I be able to see any thing?

Frank

 

[1stgen4evr]

noises

Did you read my post on checking the getrag? It is now on the second page. And yes you can see a lot by removing the pto covers.



James

 

[f.boyle]

I never found it.

 

[1stgen4evr]

checking the getrag

Have you run the transmission low on lube? Always have the extra qt?



After a visual check of the transmission to see if there are obvious external problems, an internal check can be done without opening anything. Use a hard plastic drink cup and while stopped (engine running) and then while driving, touch the (empty) cup to the shift stick knob. The various sounds that the transmission make will be amplified by the megaphone of the cup. You may not know what all you are hearing but what you hear will be loud enough to make a preliminary judgment as to looking deeper. It is helpful to have a 'good' transmission to listen to for reference. Does the sound you notice become greater in a particular gear? ( I can hear the injection pump on mine).



I would note that sounds from a bad ujoint or from the differential can be telegraphed to the stick and cause confusion. These of course will not be heard when stopped. The countershaft will be turning if the engine is running.



If you have concern after this brief check, open the pto side covers on the transmission and look at the gears and syncros. The gears should be mirror bright with no evidence of scuffing what-so-ever. You can see the front portion of the gears QUITE well and with a flashlight and mirror can see the back pretty good. You can see what is in the bottom of the transmission as well and there will or may be MINOR metal flakes but if there is significant metal, you have a problem.



One of the major causes of failure on the Getrag is the front countershaft bearing. Because of the design of the OD, this bearing is always loaded with the exception of the brief time the transmission is in fourth. If this bearing is worn/failing, the countershaft will show movement fore and aft. You can determine this by prying the countershaft fore and aft. If it moves at all, you have a problem. The countershaft bearings are 'preloaded' and there should be NO decernable movement. Very minor movement may be corrected by resetting the preload. My transmission has 425k miles and has never had a real rebuild but it has been out and reshimmed on three occasions.



From the posts I have read on the fwd trucks, the getrag would require countershaft bearing replacement at a shorter interval than for the twd trucks. The transmission and transfer case are cumbersome and I understand that no one wants to take them out for the fun of it but if the system is maintained according to a pre-need schedule, the getrag will wear the engine out on the fwd without the expense of a 4500 or 5600. The price of a transmission jack is far less than the cost of a 4500.



There were some bad trannys from the factory but these should be long gone by now and your transmission should be good for the long haul if maintained.



1stgen4evr

James