Camper/overload springs/and more

[NIsaacs]

Without some documentation to go with the pictures, it don't tell the story. It appears to me that most of them yarded the bed off the frame, rather than the frame failing.

Frame failure is extremely rare. With all my stupid hauls and junky trucks, over the years, I have not ever broken a frame.

Take my sled pull truck. With 1000k lbs of tractor weights, 4.5' ahead of the front axle, rear hitch 5' behind the rear axle, 26" high, attached with a short chain at the bottom of a 30k lbs sled...When the weight box is full forward and the shanks deploy at about the 275' mark, you stop so fast the engine wants to run backward. We are talking 50 hooks like this. I have probably seen a 1000 trucks pull with never a frame issue, everything else breaks but not the frame.

 

[AH64ID]

Sled pulling, even with those extreme weights and their arms, still doesn’t pit the same load or stress on a frame. The stress the slide-in puts between the axles is huge.

Some of those photos are certainly frame failures, and some might be bed failures.

At the end of the day if your’e putting a camper that heavy in your bed you should be using a 4500/5500.

 

[NIsaacs]

Sled pulling, even with those extreme weights and their arms, still doesn’t pit the same load or stress on a frame. The stress the slide-in puts between the axles is huge.

Some of those photos are certainly frame failures, and some might be bed failures.

At the end of the day if your’e putting a camper that heavy in your bed you should be using a 4500/5500.

No argument from me that a big camper stresses a truck but it don't break the frames. The mini trucks in the pictures are apples and oranges to the 14k Ram dually. Without a closeup picture or documentation, there is no way to determine what failed in those pictures. What do you see that you can say for certain? I say again, frame failure is rare.

 

[AH64ID]

Yes they are very rare, but all the pickup frame failures I can think of involve slide-in campers.

They all have one thing in common, failure at the forward tie down point. That we can say for certain.

It’s not really apples to oranges if the cargo weight is relative to the frame size.

One story I read a guy broke the frame on his F-350 and upgraded to a F-450 pickup and broke that frame too, which isn’t surprising since it’s the same frame (Talk about not doing your research)

Maybe these camper companies need to develop a tie down system that latches to the 5th wheel prep.

 

[Topzide]

@AH64ID, You nailed it on an attachment point! Would be pretty simple to do. Just have a port in the floor with support built into camper. Than you could use a simple clamp attachment at the front that wouldn't be carrying all the weight! Just more of a point to keep the camper from hopping in the bed. JM2C.

 

[NIsaacs]

For sure we can agree, the Ram in the story broke the frame. We can also agree Ram was justified in refusing warranty, but, my guess is Ram will not forget the ugly picture and will keep it in mind on their next generation frame. I would like to see an '18 frame next to a '19 frame and compare that spot.

 

[kthaxton]

Ultimately, Ram denied the warranty saying it was overloaded......I'm willing to bet they got their ducks in a row before concluding that.

 

[Turbo Terry]

Seems the common thing is the over hang and all the weight to the rear of the axle. I see them on the road all the time. Big truck camper 2 slides hanging way out. There has to be a limit . There a lot of leverage and a constant motion going down the road working it, Something has to give.

 

[Ozymandias]

Seems the common thing is the over hang and all the weight to the rear of the axle. I see them on the road all the time. Big truck camper 2 slides hanging way out. There has to be a limit . There a lot of leverage and a constant motion going down the road working it, Something has to give.

You got it.

 

[Ozymandias]

No argument from me that a big camper stresses a truck but it don't break the frames. The mini trucks in the pictures are apples and oranges to the 14k Ram dually. Without a closeup picture or documentation, there is no way to determine what failed in those pictures. What do you see that you can say for certain? I say again, frame failure is rare.

Believe it or not, you can do a reverse search with all of these pictures guiding you back to Forums threads discussing the single event. These are all broken frames.
Campers break frames, as simple as it is.
But lucky us it very rarely happens to HD pickup - that was the reason for me to buy one. And this single case with this overloaded dually does not change my meaning that an HD pickup is very much safe from breaking the frame.

 

[NIsaacs]

Believe it or not, you can do a reverse search with all of these pictures guiding you back to Forums threads discussing the single event. These are all broken frames.
Campers break frames, as simple as it is.
But lucky us it very rarely happens to HD pickup - that was the reason for me to buy one. And this single case with this overloaded dually does not change my meaning that an HD pickup is very much safe from breaking the frame.

I guess I have been lucky with my hauls and probably live in a small world. What is it they say? He watches out for babies and old guys?

For sure I lost a little bit of confidence in Ram. I wonder if the truck had air ride? It is a lot easier for the frame to rock on a single point air bag v/s a wide spread leaf spring with a front mount 2+ feet forward and 2+ feet on the rear. That does concern me a little with my 2500 and it's coil springs small foot print. That may be one of the reasons Ram discourages campers on the 2500. Then I added aftermarket air bags to mine, again with a small foot print. I do think the added beef of the in bed hitch helps.

 

[AH64ID]

I guess I have been lucky with my hauls and probably live in a small world. What is it they say? He watches out for babies and old guys?

For sure I lost a little bit of confidence in Ram. I wonder if the truck had air ride? It is a lot easier for the frame to rock on a single point air bag v/s a wide spread leaf spring with a front mount 2+ feet forward and 2+ feet on the rear. That does concern me a little with my 2500 and it's coil springs small foot print. That may be one of the reasons Ram discourages campers on the 2500. Then I added aftermarket air bags to mine, again with a small foot print. I do think the added beef of the in bed hitch helps.

While I agree on spreading the load across the frame at more than 2 points it doesn’t appear to matter in these failures. The frames fail at the forward camper mounting point, which is ~2’ forward of the forward spring mount on a LWB Ram.

The 2500 isn’t promoted for campers because of the low payload based on the low GVWR.

 

[NIsaacs]

The 2500 isn’t promoted for campers because of the low payload based on the low GVWR.

That might be part of it but not the main reason. My '01 has about the same payload as my '21 and it is a camper special. 8800 gvw v/s 10k. Since they are both short beds I would not ever want a heavy camper on them. We had one once, a 9' we mounted on the '91 D-250 long bed. We made one short trip with it and sold it. The guy that bought it had a short bed 1500 Chevy....often wondered how that worked out for him

 

[AH64ID]

That might be part of it but not the main reason. My '01 has about the same payload as my '21 and it is a camper special. 8800 gvw v/s 10k. Since they are both short beds I would not ever want a heavy camper on them. We had one once, a 9' we mounted on the '91 D-250 long bed. We made one short trip with it and sold it. The guy that bought it had a short bed 1500 Chevy....often wondered how that worked out for him

When you look at documents like this one it’s hard to see any other reason. The trucks that say camper not recommended don’t have the payload. Configurations with “adequate”payload have the ability. A 4x4 2500 CC LB Cummins isn’t recommended for a camper, but the short bed version is with its slightly higher payload.

I wouldn’t want a bigger camper in the short bed either.

https://www.ramtrucks.com/assets/bbg/pdf/2016/docs/ram/hdramcg.pdf

 

[Turbo Terry]

My old 99 2500 had a rating sticker of 1750 lbs for a camper and a cog drawing also. It was a regular cab long box.I hauled a 3000 lbs camper for more than 20 years. Factory rear anti sway bars Firestone air bags and 5 position Rancho no issues