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Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) caTCHER ecm (Marco's aka MAD)
- Thread starter Bob Wagner
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Well, I've got mine installed. So far, so good.
I've driven as much as one day after work will allow me and I can say this. The change in driveability is evident. The biggest positive changes to me seem to fall in three areas.
First one is surging. This is the main reason I wanted this unit. My truck had a terrible surging problem around 2200 RPM. I'm sure under a stock configuration the surge was hardly noticeable. But in my more modified state, the problem seemed to be amplified. The Catcher has killed this problem quite well.
Second, one is defueling. I can say that the catcher does not defuel until you hit the red line RPM. Then it shuts you down like a switch. Actually I think it's more the VP shutting you down moreso than the ECM, but nevertheless, it fuels all the way up to redline.
Third is the spoolup. I don't get lower spoolup RPM so my spool up point is the same, what does happen is that I move through the lower RPM range faster off-boost than I did before. It's still spools at the same RPM and boost level, it just goes through the lower RPM band faster. My guess is that this would be indicated on a dyno as a serious shift of torque to the left.
Now on to the negatives. The biggest negative I believe is the smoke. At lighter throttle (and I do mean light) the smoke is okay. In fact it's pretty mild. But there is a fine line between mild smoke and the "great black death". Now, bear in mind that I am modified a bit, so that is a large factor in my smoke. With normal injectors, it may not be that bad.
Another negative (these negatives are all inter-related), is that the throttle is really, REALLY touchy. Like I said, there is a fine line between good, smooth power and "insect genocide". This makes it pretty hard to drive with some civility. You can do it, and I'm sure that I will just have to re-learn the pedal a bit. But anything beyond a 1/4 throttle is pretty serious and you better hold on.
The last main negative I have about it is the cruise control. I have the old style cruise and it now over-shoots something fierce. I don't think that the self-adjusting bias on the PCM is capable of adapting to the new throttle. It may be, but I'm not holding my breath. Something will have to be done to make the cruise behave better. We're talking a 5 to 8 mph overshoot. This will take the PCM a while to adjust (if it even can). This makes using the cruise a tricky proposition.
Well, that's it for my first day's use of the thing. My over-all impression is that it is good. For me the surge cure, spooling, and defueling cures make this unit worth it. The driveability issues are something that I will learn to live with. One quick note, there doesn't seem to be any peak power gain at all. That's fine. It wasn't advertised to do that. But I will say it does make a difference in how fast you get there. In that, it works pretty well.
Would I reccommend it? Well, that depends on what you want out of your truck and plan on doing with it.
If anyone has any questions, please feel free to PM me, email me, or give me a call. I'll give you my honest opinion.
Aron (Amianthus)
BTW, it seems to work just fine with my EZ. Without the EZ, you seem to lose a little extra on top (but not much). I haven't run it with my FMS yet.
I've driven as much as one day after work will allow me and I can say this. The change in driveability is evident. The biggest positive changes to me seem to fall in three areas.
First one is surging. This is the main reason I wanted this unit. My truck had a terrible surging problem around 2200 RPM. I'm sure under a stock configuration the surge was hardly noticeable. But in my more modified state, the problem seemed to be amplified. The Catcher has killed this problem quite well.
Second, one is defueling. I can say that the catcher does not defuel until you hit the red line RPM. Then it shuts you down like a switch. Actually I think it's more the VP shutting you down moreso than the ECM, but nevertheless, it fuels all the way up to redline.
Third is the spoolup. I don't get lower spoolup RPM so my spool up point is the same, what does happen is that I move through the lower RPM range faster off-boost than I did before. It's still spools at the same RPM and boost level, it just goes through the lower RPM band faster. My guess is that this would be indicated on a dyno as a serious shift of torque to the left.
Now on to the negatives. The biggest negative I believe is the smoke. At lighter throttle (and I do mean light) the smoke is okay. In fact it's pretty mild. But there is a fine line between mild smoke and the "great black death". Now, bear in mind that I am modified a bit, so that is a large factor in my smoke. With normal injectors, it may not be that bad.
Another negative (these negatives are all inter-related), is that the throttle is really, REALLY touchy. Like I said, there is a fine line between good, smooth power and "insect genocide". This makes it pretty hard to drive with some civility. You can do it, and I'm sure that I will just have to re-learn the pedal a bit. But anything beyond a 1/4 throttle is pretty serious and you better hold on.
The last main negative I have about it is the cruise control. I have the old style cruise and it now over-shoots something fierce. I don't think that the self-adjusting bias on the PCM is capable of adapting to the new throttle. It may be, but I'm not holding my breath. Something will have to be done to make the cruise behave better. We're talking a 5 to 8 mph overshoot. This will take the PCM a while to adjust (if it even can). This makes using the cruise a tricky proposition.
Well, that's it for my first day's use of the thing. My over-all impression is that it is good. For me the surge cure, spooling, and defueling cures make this unit worth it. The driveability issues are something that I will learn to live with. One quick note, there doesn't seem to be any peak power gain at all. That's fine. It wasn't advertised to do that. But I will say it does make a difference in how fast you get there. In that, it works pretty well.
Would I reccommend it? Well, that depends on what you want out of your truck and plan on doing with it.
If anyone has any questions, please feel free to PM me, email me, or give me a call. I'll give you my honest opinion.
Aron (Amianthus)
BTW, it seems to work just fine with my EZ. Without the EZ, you seem to lose a little extra on top (but not much). I haven't run it with my FMS yet.
Amianthus
Earlier in the thread someone sugested an adjustable restrictor valve in the vacuum line to the cruise control, have you tried that?
Jared
Earlier in the thread someone sugested an adjustable restrictor valve in the vacuum line to the cruise control, have you tried that?
Jared
Amianthus,
You simply have to get used to that new feel in the throttle.
"But there is a fine line between mild smoke and the "great black death".
You have simply to learn how to follow that fine line with the throttle while the engine revs up. I can assure you with a little more practice you'll become able to do it. Then watch out!
Too much fuel ( read too much smoke ) kills the performance. The CaTCHER gives you the controll over the fuel or too much of it.
Simply stomping on the loud pedal and waiting for something to happen does no longer work for you. YOU have the controll now.
I'm not too excited about the PCM to adapt to the new throttle response. Mine never did.
Steve says that the valve in the vacuum line works. I have still to test it.
Marco
You simply have to get used to that new feel in the throttle.
"But there is a fine line between mild smoke and the "great black death".
You have simply to learn how to follow that fine line with the throttle while the engine revs up. I can assure you with a little more practice you'll become able to do it. Then watch out!
Too much fuel ( read too much smoke ) kills the performance. The CaTCHER gives you the controll over the fuel or too much of it.
Simply stomping on the loud pedal and waiting for something to happen does no longer work for you. YOU have the controll now.
I'm not too excited about the PCM to adapt to the new throttle response. Mine never did.
Steve says that the valve in the vacuum line works. I have still to test it.
Marco
Sounds like what I am getting from all of this is that the catcher makes the truck feel and drive more like a truck with a modified p-pump rather than what we are used to with the vp-44 equipped trucks. I have always liked the way a p-pump responds instantly, over the slower ramp-up feel of the vp-44. Just when I thought I had the bombing under control..... 
What I am hearing is that the MAD ecm programming would give us stock only guys with a VP44 what I miss in them.
Simply this: I owned a '98 12V 2500 CTD. I just loved that truck and wish I still had it. (whole nuther story).
Instant throttle response, total driver control. No slack between throttle and go power.
When I got my '98. 5 3500 CTD, I was instantly put off by the complete 180 degree change in character. This is a Cummins? No way, no guts, no throttle response, no nada. It took me 4 months to finally acquiesse and learn to peg it on 2000 RPM and just wait and wait for the truck to drag itself out of lethargy and finally get up to speed.
If Marco's CaTCHER ecm program returns to me the feel of my 98 12V truck, I will be happier than a fox in the hen house.
Just my take.
John
Simply this: I owned a '98 12V 2500 CTD. I just loved that truck and wish I still had it. (whole nuther story).
Instant throttle response, total driver control. No slack between throttle and go power.
When I got my '98. 5 3500 CTD, I was instantly put off by the complete 180 degree change in character. This is a Cummins? No way, no guts, no throttle response, no nada. It took me 4 months to finally acquiesse and learn to peg it on 2000 RPM and just wait and wait for the truck to drag itself out of lethargy and finally get up to speed.
If Marco's CaTCHER ecm program returns to me the feel of my 98 12V truck, I will be happier than a fox in the hen house.
Just my take.
John
Bob Wagner
TDR MEMBER
just got back from towing to the ocean and back, CaTCHER is still working like a champ 
Marco, I'm assuming you got my email with the info on my truck you wanted, since I haven't heard more from you. If you need me to, I think I can get my truck to someone with a DRB tomorrow if need be, but it sounds like you have it figured out. I just hope you get my ecm back before vacation, if not thats fine too.
Marco, tomorrow morning I'll see if the small town dealer across the Mississippi River from me can scan the ECM. They don't sell many trucks let alone diesels but it's the only one I can get to right away. Hopefully the service department will know what to do.
I need to ask for the software revision number?
I need to ask for the software revision number?
Possible Cruise fix
Those of you with the old style cruise (vaccum system), don't think High HP is always the cause of poor cruise response. I had the same issue with my 12V and put up with it for over a year until it finally quit and I had to fix it. A relatively cheap replacement of the servo (under the battery) fixed the cruise and low and behold no more overshooting the cruise or over reacting cruise. Nice and smooth even with double the stock HP.
jjw
ND
Those of you with the old style cruise (vaccum system), don't think High HP is always the cause of poor cruise response. I had the same issue with my 12V and put up with it for over a year until it finally quit and I had to fix it. A relatively cheap replacement of the servo (under the battery) fixed the cruise and low and behold no more overshooting the cruise or over reacting cruise. Nice and smooth even with double the stock HP.
jjw
ND
Just got home from vacation... ... ... ..... interesting developments. Mines still not here, because I didn't want it arriving while I was gone.
The "spare" I sent off was the same part number as the orginal on the truck. It was made 6 days after my orginal and the serial number is is 64 apart... . sooo hope my 2001 truck has no issues!!
Hope to get it tommorrow, or Friday.
The "spare" I sent off was the same part number as the orginal on the truck. It was made 6 days after my orginal and the serial number is is 64 apart... . sooo hope my 2001 truck has no issues!!
Hope to get it tommorrow, or Friday.
you guys with problems - minor or otherwise, how about sharing with the rest of us - "mystery" and secrecy make some of us make assumptions that MIGHT be more serious than they really are - open up, and let us know what's going on...
We don't want or need the "mushroom treatment"...
We don't want or need the "mushroom treatment"...
Bob Wagner
TDR MEMBER
me too
Kat, I also found an exact match for my ecm and its been flawless since install.
I will call tcourse tomorrow to see if he received his .
I also received an HO ecm reflashed for another member.
I will report back and then I am over in Hawaii 8/2 - 8/11
Kat, I also found an exact match for my ecm and its been flawless since install.
I will call tcourse tomorrow to see if he received his .
I also received an HO ecm reflashed for another member.
I will report back and then I am over in Hawaii 8/2 - 8/11
Yes Bob, I got mine today. In the middle of really important bid so had to wait unit tonight.
Got home and had the inlaws for dinner, so it will have to be tomorrow after I finish my bid.
If you like you can come plug it in and go for a ride
Got the truck back today with the 4. 10s in also.
TC
Marco, we all appreciate you honesty. As a Westerners are prone to say, "there might have been a slight hitch-in-the-getalong" Not to worry, Marco is on it. After all, Rome wasn't built in a day.
Gary, be patient, all good things come to those that wait. When things get a little more sorted out we will be glad to to share with you and others. It is my firm belief that when on the cutting edge, suppliers and consumers should work together to solve issues if any, and not necessarily in a public forum, especially when dealing with new technology. Marco has been more than straight forward, maybe to much so, IMHO. If you all want to refer to me as a guinea pig, then so be it, my problem not yours. I just want what is best for all concerned and that is why I have been working with Marco to resolve any issues that I may have because in the end it will benefit all. I don't really think there is a shroud of secrecy around this, but perhaps just a couple of minor bumps in the road. I have every confidence that Marco, Doug, Dawn and crew will get this sorted out and I predict that the end result will be huge!
Sincerely,
Roger
Gary, be patient, all good things come to those that wait. When things get a little more sorted out we will be glad to to share with you and others. It is my firm belief that when on the cutting edge, suppliers and consumers should work together to solve issues if any, and not necessarily in a public forum, especially when dealing with new technology. Marco has been more than straight forward, maybe to much so, IMHO. If you all want to refer to me as a guinea pig, then so be it, my problem not yours. I just want what is best for all concerned and that is why I have been working with Marco to resolve any issues that I may have because in the end it will benefit all. I don't really think there is a shroud of secrecy around this, but perhaps just a couple of minor bumps in the road. I have every confidence that Marco, Doug, Dawn and crew will get this sorted out and I predict that the end result will be huge!
Sincerely,
Roger
RCone is my HERO!
Let me start from the important things first. I'll comment about the "mushroom treatment"... later in this MSG.
RCone is my hero! I say that again! He HAS solved a BIG problem for me, that means YOU are directly intrested too.
He has been able to provide me the magic number out of his ECM.
I would've needed his ECM HERE to read it, instead HE has managed to get it. I leave it to Roger if he wants/can comment how/ what he did it.
That is the software revision number. That number is:
383238306J
Problem solved! That truck is a CALIFORNIA version.
Another problem I was completly unaware of! I've always used the Federal softwares... The 01. 5 California version reads the Camshaft sensor in a different way. Makes me think that the tone ring on the camshaft is spaced different from the Federal trucks. In that way DC made sure that you can't use a Federal ECM in an Californian truck...
I'm almost sure that for '98-'99-'00 the ECM's / Software's can be swapped from a Federal truck into an Californian and vice versa with out problems. The problem starts in MY 01 ( dunno yet if also the Early build's are affected I'll check that all out later )
So to make that looooooooooooooooooooong story short...
When you send an ECM I have to know exactly what MY, SO, HO, stick or AT AND if it's a Federal truck or Californian.
For the MY 01 I have also to know if it is an "Early" build or if it is an 01. 5. The early builds have drums in the rear, the 01. 5's discs.
( Just got an holler, looks like all ECM's that have been shipped to me have been delivered to my home. GREAT!)
That brings me to the "mushroom treatment"...
I HATE mushroom treatments! We've never met, so you can't know what kinda guy I am.
I have only one word. Dunno if you use that kinda saying there.
Means, that when I say that I will do something, I just do it. Period.
I try to be 100% sure about a thing before I say it. In this thread you've seen that 100% sure isn't always possible.
But most of all, I'm man enough to admit my mistakes.
I've ALWAYS payed for my mistakes. I've always tried HARD to correct them. Sometimes it's too late to correct a mistake... .
That said. I really can't seem to find a reason why I should not be straight forward. Even in the public.
Lookie here, would I've bu]] **-- arround with you, WE would've never been able to solve the problem. Instead.....
Straight forward!
Thanks again Roger!
Thanks to all for your attention!
Ok, now let me go I have to work on a few ECM's.
Marco
Let me start from the important things first. I'll comment about the "mushroom treatment"... later in this MSG.
RCone is my hero! I say that again! He HAS solved a BIG problem for me, that means YOU are directly intrested too.
He has been able to provide me the magic number out of his ECM.
I would've needed his ECM HERE to read it, instead HE has managed to get it. I leave it to Roger if he wants/can comment how/ what he did it.
That is the software revision number. That number is:
383238306J
Problem solved! That truck is a CALIFORNIA version.
Another problem I was completly unaware of! I've always used the Federal softwares... The 01. 5 California version reads the Camshaft sensor in a different way. Makes me think that the tone ring on the camshaft is spaced different from the Federal trucks. In that way DC made sure that you can't use a Federal ECM in an Californian truck...
I'm almost sure that for '98-'99-'00 the ECM's / Software's can be swapped from a Federal truck into an Californian and vice versa with out problems. The problem starts in MY 01 ( dunno yet if also the Early build's are affected I'll check that all out later )
So to make that looooooooooooooooooooong story short...
When you send an ECM I have to know exactly what MY, SO, HO, stick or AT AND if it's a Federal truck or Californian.
For the MY 01 I have also to know if it is an "Early" build or if it is an 01. 5. The early builds have drums in the rear, the 01. 5's discs.
( Just got an holler, looks like all ECM's that have been shipped to me have been delivered to my home. GREAT!)
That brings me to the "mushroom treatment"...
I HATE mushroom treatments! We've never met, so you can't know what kinda guy I am.
I have only one word. Dunno if you use that kinda saying there.
Means, that when I say that I will do something, I just do it. Period.
I try to be 100% sure about a thing before I say it. In this thread you've seen that 100% sure isn't always possible.
But most of all, I'm man enough to admit my mistakes.
I've ALWAYS payed for my mistakes. I've always tried HARD to correct them. Sometimes it's too late to correct a mistake... .
That said. I really can't seem to find a reason why I should not be straight forward. Even in the public.
Lookie here, would I've bu]] **-- arround with you, WE would've never been able to solve the problem. Instead.....
Straight forward!
Thanks again Roger!
Thanks to all for your attention!
Ok, now let me go I have to work on a few ECM's.
Marco
Sorry TDR if I use U for my personal needs.
If that's not in line with the guidlines I applogize!
I need to make sure these guys see my E-Mail's ASAP.
Rcone, I've send you E-Mail and PM'ed you. Please check it out.
Your ECM is done.
Murle, The ECM is here. I've send you an E-Mail. Please check it out ASAP!
Darkhorse, Same as Murle... .
EDIT:
Amillstream, sorry I've forgotten you again...
Same as Darkhorse and murle...
Please tell me ASAP if your tuck's are Federal or Californian.
There's only little time left before I leave for the vacation...
Thanks,
Marco
If that's not in line with the guidlines I applogize!
I need to make sure these guys see my E-Mail's ASAP.
Rcone, I've send you E-Mail and PM'ed you. Please check it out.
Your ECM is done.
Murle, The ECM is here. I've send you an E-Mail. Please check it out ASAP!
Darkhorse, Same as Murle... .
EDIT:
Amillstream, sorry I've forgotten you again...
Same as Darkhorse and murle...
Please tell me ASAP if your tuck's are Federal or Californian.
There's only little time left before I leave for the vacation...
Thanks,
Marco
Last edited:
Marco,
PMed you.
PMed you.
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Issue 128 – Digital Version
Digital Magazines
FREE!
TDR Test Drive - Digital Edition
Renew
Subscribe
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Back Issues
Subscription Status
Address Change Form
Buyer's Guides
Ram Diagnostic Trouble Codes
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