Fords New Diesel

[Flying_gage]

Been watching this thread for a couple days. Kind of sad. Been a member of TDR for 4-5 years and haven't witnessed a thread fall apart like it did on this one. I pay my money to TDR in hopes that the pablum is kept to a minimum.



I have never got the one dimensional side of folks. When you boil things down, all an opinion is is a matter or perspective. Nothing more or less. Why some people treat opinions with such high regard will forever be lost on me; much less get angry over another's opinion?



I have been riding around in Ford chassis'ed ambulance's for 17 years now. Started out in a 6. 9 with a 3spd auto. Today I am riding around in 6. 4 equipped Ambo's. I am not sure if there is a more abusive environment than this? I have never had one fail to start. Period. It does happen and I know it. Our dept is embroiled in a lawsuit where a 7. 3 lost it's crank position sensor while the medics were inside performing CPR. That particular ambo had well over a 100,000 miles and had been having intermittent issues prior to the failure. But, I have hundreds of thousands of miles behind a 6. 9, 7. 3, 6. 0 and 6. 4 so I would think that counts for something.



I was waiting for the calamity in '04 when we purchased 4 new ambo's with the 6. 4. It never happened. Not sure what to make of that in relation to all the bad press I have viewed. I have no doubt there is more than a grain of truth to it though. But that has been my experience... . I am sure towing with them is "different" but I have no experience with that.



I do like the reading/information about other vehicles on TDR. I have always enjoyed the additional information about other makes and the individual perspective owners share here. I would not like that to disappear. Should it, I would strongly re-consider my renewal. Information is a franchise. To ignore information in general is to be disenfranchised. In addition, in light of Dodge's predicament, there may come a time when I can't get a Cummins in a Dodge. If that happens, I won't switch to a gasser. I will find the next best thing, whatever brand it may be?



Not looking to change anyone's opinion. Just my response to those who can get full of themselves.

 

[JUeckert]

i tip my hat to you sir. . fwiw, if you have a 7. 3 powerstroke in your family,circle of friends, or at your work, inform them there is a recall on certain trucks with these engine. ford issued a recall approx 12 months ago on the sensors. i got a notice on my 02 in jan 09, just got another notice last week that applies to my 01 model. dad has an 02 also, and hasnt recieved a notice yet. as many folks as i know who own trucks with this particular engine, only two have had issues, i have had zero issues. cheers. .

 

[Flying_gage]

Only fords at present are my 88 California SSP Mustang and my 93 Mustang. Beyond that, I have a 1998 Hardtop base model (not Z28 but a sportcoupe, pretty rare car) Camaro with the LS1. Also the wife drives a 1999 Chevy Suburban, that I am often tempted to trade for a powerstroke (7. 3) Expedition. I also have a Case 1845C Skidsteer with the mighty 4B. I have owned just about every brand and in the last 20 years they are all good and reliable.



There are lemons though and my last bout of lemonade was a 2003 TDI Jetta. That car drove me up a wall! It was perfectly engineered, but poorly built.



I am considering the purchase of a totaled Hummer H1. That should be interesting. Maybe that will be the wife's driver?:-laf

 

[JUeckert]

if you intend on buying the hummer with the pretense of driveing it yourself, yet calling it your wifes, becareful. i did that with my first[ her first] blazer years ago. she liked it so much, i hardly got a chance too drive it, let alone take it to the river bottoms hunting. ended up having to buy my own! as for those lemmons, yep you can get one with any brand. good thing about sites like this one, for many consumers it's their only way of learning about a product, or obtaining other info like repair work . knowledge is power, and it's knowledge that can save you money from repairs, or being left on side of the road.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Been watching this thread for a couple days. Kind of sad. Been a member of TDR for 4-5 years and haven't witnessed a thread fall apart like it did on this one. I pay my money to TDR in hopes that the pablum is kept to a minimum.



I have never got the one dimensional side of folks. When you boil things down, all an opinion is is a matter or perspective. Nothing more or less. Why some people treat opinions with such high regard (especially their OWN?)will forever be lost on me; much less get angry over another's opinion?



I have been riding around in Ford chassis'ed ambulance's for 17 years now. Started out in a 6. 9 with a 3spd auto. Today I am riding around in 6. 4 equipped Ambo's. I am not sure if there is a more abusive environment than this? I have never had one fail to start. Period. It does happen and I know it. Our dept is embroiled in a lawsuit where a 7. 3 lost it's crank position sensor while the medics were inside performing CPR. That particular ambo had well over a 100,000 miles and had been having intermittent issues prior to the failure. But, I have hundreds of thousands of miles behind a 6. 9, 7. 3, 6. 0 and 6. 4 so I would think that counts for something.



I was waiting for the calamity in '04 when we purchased 4 new ambo's with the 6. 4. It never happened. Not sure what to make of that in relation to all the bad press I have viewed. I have no doubt there is more than a grain of truth to it though. But that has been my experience... . I am sure towing with them is "different" but I have no experience with that.



I do like the reading/information about other vehicles on TDR. I have always enjoyed the additional information about other makes and the individual perspective owners share here. I would not like that to disappear. Should it, I would strongly re-consider my renewal. Information is a franchise. To ignore information in general is to be disenfranchised. In addition, in light of Dodge's predicament, there may come a time when I can't get a Cummins in a Dodge. If that happens, I won't switch to a gasser. I will find the next best thing, whatever brand it may be?



Not looking to change anyone's opinion. Just my response to those who can get full of themselves.

ABSOLUTELY - I couldn't agree more, and info related to all aspects, both bad AND good, of diesel vehicles - INCLUDING brands other than Dodge, is what THIS forum is all about!

 

[macdaddy]

Get em HB!!!!!!!!!!!!

HB... .....



Your the greatest... ... ... .....



Where's CF?. I cant believe i havnt heard from him on here.



Mac

 

[HBarlow]

HB... .....

Your the greatest... ... ... .....

Where's CF?. I cant believe i havnt heard from him on here.

Mac

CF only posts in the cartoon . . . uhhhhh . . . political forum. It's the only forum where cut and paste for all the member's posts is considered normal.

 

[Flying_gage]

Did I mention someone by name? Nope... .



Like I mentioned, I was just expressing my view. There were multiple posters in this thread. I didn't single anyone out. I will say however I have been curious though as to any responses.

 

[hammersley]

My issue with Ford Diesel is

Only fords at present are my 88 California SSP Mustang and my 93 Mustang. Beyond that, I have a 1998 Hardtop base model (not Z28 but a sportcoupe, pretty rare car) Camaro with the LS1. Also the wife drives a 1999 Chevy Suburban, that I am often tempted to trade for a powerstroke (7. 3) Expedition. I also have a Case 1845C Skidsteer with the mighty 4B. I have owned just about every brand and in the last 20 years they are all good and reliable.

There are lemons though and my last bout of lemonade was a 2003 TDI Jetta. That car drove me up a wall! It was perfectly engineered, but poorly built.

I am considering the purchase of a totaled Hummer H1. That should be interesting. Maybe that will be the wife's driver?:-laf

the insistence that having the engine oil ALSO run the injectors is absurd! I know the yellow folks use this BUT that doesn't mean I think it's a good idea. Oil is for lubrication, not for hydraulic pressure... that's what hydraulic oil is all about. There are other design issues - V-8, which means I think they are an inferior design..... pure and simple. And when Cummins goes that way... I'll say so as well. For my use, this will be my last modern Diesel... . I plan on running it like a B-52..... rebuild-rebuild-rebuild! And where I have no salt issues, I can do that... ...

 

[HBarlow]

the insistence that having the engine oil ALSO run the injectors is absurd! I know the yellow folks use this BUT that doesn't mean I think it's a good idea. Oil is for lubrication, not for hydraulic pressure... that's what hydraulic oil is all about. There are other design issues - V-8, which means I think they are an inferior design..... pure and simple. And when Cummins goes that way... I'll say so as well. For my use, this will be my last modern Diesel... . I plan on running it like a B-52..... rebuild-rebuild-rebuild! And where I have no salt issues, I can do that... ...

I agree. Activating the injectors with engine oil and a complicated means of stepping up hydraulic pressure seems unnecessary or unwise complexity for no obvious gain. Simplicity usually provides reliablility and longevity.

 

[Flying_gage]

I agree. Activating the injectors with engine oil and a complicated means of stepping up hydraulic pressure seems unnecessary or unwise complexity for no obvious gain. Simplicity usually provides reliablility and longevity.

Herein lies the problem; Mr. Barlow this is an opinion. Nothing wrong with it. But unless your are a engineer, it is nothing more than emotive reasoning, (your experiences and perception influence your decisions).

I would be hypocritical were I to say I do not engage in that sort of reasoning. But my education and my life experiences then prevent me from using it as a foundation in an argument. That foundation is akin to quicksand, no matter what amount of verbal force is applied.

What may seem complicated/unnecessary/unwise to you the layperson, makes perfect sense within it's given design parameters to an engineer. Outside of those parameters, I am sure engineers start to get nervous.

Engine oil can be used as hydraulic fluid with the appropriate additive. Many manufactures have and continue to use it as such. My Case skidsteer has 4700 hours and the Hyd. Fluid is 5w30. I buy a 5 gallon pale of it and then add one quart of friction modifier... . Must be okay for John Deere tractors also as my local store was out of the JDM-20 fluid and I was told that the Case fluid would work just fine.

 

[Yo Hoot]

My JD 310A backhoe uses the transmission sump for all of the loader and hoe hydraulics. It uses engine oil only to lubricate the engine. With the Ford and CATs, oil contaminated with combustion by-products doesn't seem to be a good idea but it looks like they get away with it. Foaming was also an issue. I think the real problems with HEUI injection is the complexity of the overall pressure changes effecting the injectors.

 

[HoleshotHolset]

Don't pass judgement just yet. Let it become available at the retail outlets. When the flames start coming out the tailpipe like they did on the 6. 4L - then pass judgement.



Beers,



Matt

 

[SMorneau]

So WTF does " over engineering" mean to you guys anyway?

I have witnessed lots of hours of engineering time being used to make a product cheaper at the expense of reliability and serviceability. Is that what is meant? Cause with todays engineering capabilities it is possible to make a complex assembly that will wear out as a unit instead of a simple failure and that takes a lot of engineering.

I am also familiar with the more traditional usage that would indicate something is over built for it's purpose.

I will give Ford credit for over built trucks but not engines. That said, thanks to my friend with his trusty 7. 3 who pulled my truck home on a trailer last weekend.

 

[HBarlow]

Herein lies the problem; Mr. Barlow this is an opinion. Nothing wrong with it. But unless your are a engineer, it is nothing more than emotive reasoning, (your experiences and perception influence your decisions).

I would be hypocritical were I to say I do not engage in that sort of reasoning. But my education and my life experiences then prevent me from using it as a foundation in an argument. That foundation is akin to quicksand, no matter what amount of verbal force is applied.

What may seem complicated/unnecessary/unwise to you the layperson, makes perfect sense within it's given design parameters to an engineer. Outside of those parameters, I am sure engineers start to get nervous.

Engine oil can be used as hydraulic fluid with the appropriate additive. Many manufactures have and continue to use it as such. My Case skidsteer has 4700 hours and the Hyd. Fluid is 5w30. I buy a 5 gallon pale of it and then add one quart of friction modifier... . Must be okay for John Deere tractors also as my local store was out of the JDM-20 fluid and I was told that the Case fluid would work just fine.

Nice speech but you contadicted yourself in just two paragraphs. You stated your education and life experiences prevent you from using opinions in an argument then expressed an opinion to argue your point about use of engine oil as hydraulic fluid.

I disregard posts made by people like you who preach about what others should think or say. I served my country for almost 30 years in order for myself, and you, to maintain your right of free speech. I assure you that you won't restrict mine.

My Kubota tractor uses engine oil in the crankcase and hydraulic fluid in the hydraulic system to operate the front loader, the mid-mount mower, and the rear three point hitch. I have researched the fluids used to determine if I could avoid buying expensive oils from a Kubota dealer. I can but engine oil and hydaulic fluid are very different products for different applications.

I guess you can express whatever opinions you wish to, I'll continue to express my opinions without your approval.

I also won't like Fords any better, even if you do.

 

[Flying_gage]

Thank you for you service. Mine and my own do appreciate it. If you are ever passing through Illinois on 88, shoot me a PM and I'll buy you a beer. It's the least I can do.

 

[JUeckert]

My JD 310A backhoe uses the transmission sump for all of the loader and hoe hydraulics. It uses engine oil only to lubricate the engine. With the Ford and CATs, oil contaminated with combustion by-products doesn't seem to be a good idea but it looks like they get away with it. Foaming was also an issue. I think the real problems with HEUI injection is the complexity of the overall pressure changes effecting the injectors.

oil contamination from combustion on powerstroke engines, was only an issue on the 6. 0 engines. egr on these engine's created all kinds of issues,especially if modded. the egr design on the 6. 0 was in my opinion a foolish design. luckily there exist an after market product, that can eliminate most if not all these issues. powerstroke engines depended on good quality clean oil, due to the design. adding something that possibly introduces contaminates to the system aint cool. egr has been around since the days of the light duty 6. 2 gm diesel, and they had no issues with it. memory serves me, egr was used on some 12v engines also.

 

[HBarlow]

Thank you for the kind words and invitation. It's a classy way to end a disagreement. I'll remember your invitation and take you up on the offer if I'm passing through, well, except for the beer, gave it up almost 30 years ago, but that's another story.

My wife and I are hooked up and loaded to take off tomorrow morning early pulling the fiver. We're on our way to Grand Portage, MN but will be traveling I-35 from OKC to Duluth, a little west of you.