Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) help troubleshoot this.

[DIESELWRKS]

okay dont know what has happened. truck was fine running prior to stopping. went in to the store came out and started the truck and sounded at first like a 3 cycle cold start. turned it off quickley. checked to see if I had any codes. bumped the the key a few times I'm flowing fuel have 19psi flowing. I was less than a 1/4 mile from home. so I started it drove it home. really no power or boost white to grey was puffing out the stack the entire trip. the sound is a knock, not like the sound when i bent a exhaust valve. but almost up top on the engine. would a bad vp still run throw no codes and make this loud of a knock. my oil is not milkshaked my radiator fluid is fine. no visual leaks anywhere. what would the signs be something bigger in the engine. as I would accelerate the sound would almost pick up pitch and the knock would be a little less the shacking of the cab would be less but the pitch would be lounder almost like a baseball card in spokes as the wheel went faster. trucks parked. still no codes after driving it. so now what. to dark now to take of valve cover





2002 HO 6-SPD LB 4X4 QC HTT 62/14 SB-DD3600 TST PM3/*REVO-BETA*SMARTY MACH 4'S, RINGED AND STUDS, AFE/2 " FTE 6" STACK D/PRICOL GAUGES, FASS 150, VULCAN 1/2 DRAW-STRAW, 3/8 FUEL LINE, DSS-BOX DT PRO-FAB TRAC BAR, CONV-T STYLE STEERING,BORGENSON BOX AND SHAFT,DUNKS TRACTION BARS, AIR BAGS,17'' KMC BLACK HOSS, 37" TOYO MT'S 6" RCD LONG ARM LIFT. :-laf... THANKS RIP Source Automotive

 

[DIESELWRKS]

so if it is a Rod/bearing or broken piston senerio. when I pull my valve cover tomorrow what would be a give away? a sunken bridge? :{

 

[madmanmanick]

There are a few things to take a look at. Your turbo, exhaust manifold/turbo inlet gaskets, turbo to intercooler hoses.

Turbo: the sound may be from the compressor, at low speeds it barely spins so it is the knocking, when you accelerate it spins faster and that is when the pitch gets louder. You could of snapped the shaft, had a bearing go, etc. something in that area is wear I would start looking. If you have a boost gauge what pressure are you getting.

Exhaust manifold/turbo inlet gasket: Had a 1998 Dodge Ram with the gas engine in it and I had the exhaust gasket blow out on me. Everytime that I would accelerate I got this really wierd knocking sound. It would go away as I decelerated, but it would get louder as I accelerated. Check you exhaust manifold gasket, the gasket between it and the turbo, or the connection to the downpipe.

Turbo hoses: The last possibility is that one of the boost hoses going to intercooler came off.

Hope this helps

 

[madmanmanick]

sorry one more thing I just just thought of, to see if you have damage inside a piston or valves take an IR thermometer and take readings as close to the outlet of each cylinder and if one is colder than the rest than that one is not maintaining compression.

 

[DIESELWRKS]

okay pulled cover and everything looks normal and is tight. seen all valves, push rods seem to be straight. but with out pulling things apart again? turbo checked nothing out of normal with turbo. tomorrow will restart the truck and check with infered thermometer and check the manifold for a colder cylinder. if I cant see anything on top half of valve-train then everytime I start it I could be doing more damage. could be broken wrist pin, piston? who knows. I did have a slight haze after running it for 30 sec. of grey coming out my stack and it did smell like fuel not strong but did. I'm going to have a friend check out under the valve cover tomorrow see if he notices anything I missed.

 

[DFerverda]

When one of my bud's truck sounded like that, a real rough loud RAP RAP RAP and idled real rough and loud, it was the vp.

We changed the vp and lift pump and all was well. I read on here somewhere, there was a way to wire around the vp to see if it is the problem or not, i cant seem to find it. Maybe someone will chime in that knows.....

Good luck Dirk

 

[DIESELWRKS]

I cracked all fuel lines one at a time they all have fuel to them the sound was a little less on #1 this is also the the cold reading on the manifold for #1. push rods are good on number one tomorrow will be pulling the injector and scoping the hole to see what lurks inside #1 cyl, so if the injector looks good then there is something wrong with compression/ piston. I dont smell diesel in the oil no metal pieces in oil. so the bottom end. I dont know what the cyl walls would look like if compression was a issue. but will see tomorrow. and if the tip or injector is cracked or a piece missing either stuck smashed on piston hitting the head. so tomorrow will tell a little more of the story. hopefully injector didn't crack I havent heard of alot of mach's doing this. untill tomorrow.

 

[DIESELWRKS]

still stumped. pulled injector and the tip is fine. scoped the hole and nothing looks unnormal. I have not found any material in my oil yet. I cannot understand the excessive ammount of fuel that is being sent out exhaust. if the piston was not sealing I would be putting fuel in the oil. also when turning the engine over by hand noticed a slight tighter spot when cyl #1 would be going on down stroke from TDC. the next thing friends and I were going to try is pull gear off injection pump and then rotate engine and see if rough spot that was felt turning it over is still there. If I spun a main bearing I dont think I would have the oil pressure that I do. I dont have a rod stuck through the side of the block from what I can tell my head/ valve train is good. any Ideas. would it be worth pulling front cover. or would you pull the oil pan first and look underneath? I know it can be done probley just a pain to pull the pan with motor in the truck.

 

[DFerverda]

I could not find the old post i wanted, but here is one that has similar information like i was lookin for.
https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/truck-911/223091-vp44-wiring-test.html
There have also been a couple 02's with the kdp issue, but i doubt it would cause the smoke and running bad. Hope you get it figured out.
Dirk

 

[ChrisOlson]

still stumped. pulled injector and the tip is fine. scoped the hole and nothing looks unnormal. I have not found any material in my oil yet. l thI cannot understand the excessive ammount of fueat is being sent out exhaust. if the piston was not sealing I would be putting fuel in the oil. also when turning the engine over by hand noticed a slight tighter spot when cyl #1 would be going on down stroke from TDC. the next thing friends and I were going to try is pull gear off injection pump and then rotate engine and see if rough spot that was felt turning it over is still there. If I spun a main bearing I dont think I would have the oil pressure that I do. I dont have a rod stuck through the side of the block from what I can tell my head/ valve train is good. any Ideas. would it be worth pulling front cover. or would you pull the oil pan first and look underneath? I know it can be done probley just a pain to pull the pan with motor in the truck.

Diesel Works

I am applying basic engeneering princibles here

KISS keep it simple stupid Not you!

As A diesel engineer I do not believe you have a problem with your crank piston con rod or anything like that.

Bump the starter get your transfer pump to work open the WIF valve make sure you have fuel flow up to and thru the filter and up to the VP44
irst thing I would do is see what kind of fuel flow you have thru the VP44 Bump the starter and crack the fuel return line out of the VP44. Make sure you have lots of fuel coming out


Injection timing will cause knocking, you cannot tell if an injector is bad by looking at it the injector has to be pop tested to prove if it is good this involves a special Injector tester. I do not know where to send you to have them tested, We have our own tester on board ship.

Also what else is in the Fuel timing Loop? the Injection Pump the VP44,
in this case all elecronic hard to troubleshoot. but if it is failing it could be causing fuel timing issues

this might be far fetched but if the cam gear has slipped on the cam that would take the timing out of wack check your cam timing like you would be adjusting your valves make sure that the timing is intact if so you have a VP44 or injector issue.

also if you have tuner box remove all that stuff and put the truck back to stock and see what codes you get .

Good luck I hope this helps

my gut says it is fuel related

chris

 

[DIESELWRKS]

I will check the return fuel ammount. I do have pressure and fuel to vp. my gauge is reading 19psi bump starting it and it located after filter prior to vp.

thanks for the reply will let ya know when I can get to it. will be tomorrow after work

 

[ChrisOlson]

I am sorry if i sound condensending I am not trying to be,
But Gauges do fail even if they read a pressure I mean Check Fuel Flow or use an old scool real gauge plumb it up to your port I have a schrader valve on an old school pressure gauge in case I doubt my electric pressure gauge.

hope you find your problem

 

[DIESELWRKS]

no I understand thanks I will check fuel flow. as far as I know my mechanical fuel pressure has been reliable showing 19psi. but I can check on the shr/port or my T-port I have prior to the vp with a differant mechanical gauge. besides checking pressure to vp and seeing the fuel come out of the inector lines. and seeing flow come out of return line. there really is no way to measure this ammount right. besides seeing flow. so today after work when I open up fitting for fuel return what is alot of fuel. or not enought fuel.

 

[DFerverda]

When you bump your starter, your lp should push out about a quart before it quits,(I think about 20 seconds) BUT i have seen mine push out almost a gallon so be prepared .

edit I reread and you are going to do the return, i am not sure about that one, i assume it would be the same... ... (you know what they say about assume)

 

[ChrisOlson]

I apologize I did not know you had a Mechinacal gauge and not electronic.

time to visit rook again i think

 

[Diesel Gunner]

Just an FYI Guys. I am the one that posted the "911" on VP 44 wiring problem.



I do not have any abnormal sounds. My truck runs just like it should.



I will make this suggestion though. Call Chip at Blue Chip Diesel. I spoke to him today and he seems to know his stuff about these VP44 pumps. In fact he had a few suggestions for me to work through (he could have just told me to spend the 1700 bucks and buy one of his pumps).



This does sound more like a fuel problem to me than a major mechanical problem, but I am no expert.



Good Luck

 

[NIsaacs]

Check your turbo to see if it is locked up. Did you have any boost when you drove it home? If the seals went south on the exhaust side it will smoke white as the raw oil seeps into the exhaust pipe. The engine will knock as it tries to accelerate without any boost or in the case of a locked up turbo the engine can't even breath enough to hardly run.



Nick

 

[DIESELWRKS]

nope the turbo is fine there is no oil anywhere on the turbo. and I did build a small amount of boost driving it home. I didn't push the truck thought going home because of the sound but I was able to get to 35 mph the weird event is the sound and knock is still there at idle with watching turbo fin spin fine and injector #1 unhooked from fuel.

 

[dodger22]

Dieselwrks - I have been following your posts and am curious if you have found the problem?



Richard

 

[DIESELWRKS]

Dieselwrks - I have been following your posts and am curious if you have found the problem?



Richard

yep I'm following the thread too.

not yet the truck was dropped off over the weekend to the shop it is in pecking order to get diagnosed and tear down where needed. I will post when the Dr. tells me the bad news $$$$$$$